I want to break free!
Re: I want to break free!
Here ya go
1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?
2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.
3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.
4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?
5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work? What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.
6) Anything to add?
1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?
2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.
3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.
4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?
5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work? What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.
6) Anything to add?
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Sonofnature
- Posts: 96
- Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2024 2:49 am
Re: I want to break free!
1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?
No. There was never a separate self.
2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.
The separate self is seemingly a bundle of stories, beliefs and assumptions (thoughts) coupled with “sensations”, which are also thoughts.
I don’t know when it starts. How can it be known? There is no memory of having a perspective of not being separate from anything or anyone before the apparent shift to the current perspective. Even the shift from previous to the current perspective is a thought.
There is an imagined story that the illusion of the separate self, started in early childhood, when the intelligence of this body reacted to a biological need and the first thought came into experience that indicated that there was a fragile self in “here” dependent on someone separate “out there”, and so the first code for the program of the separate self was installed.
3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.
Coming into this dialogue there was already an ongoing process of coming to terms with there not existing a separate self. Before doubt dropped during this dialogue, there were bouts of fear, grief and a feeling of meaninglessness/purposelessness.
After the doubt dropped, there is a lightness that has replaced the heaviness that was there before.
The character “Marius” used to be a very “serious” seeker, which came with a lot of pressure. Now the whole thing seems a bit silly. Seeking has dropped. Thoughts are no longer the enemy. Emotions are embraced and met with curiosity, rather than rejection. There are obviously still triggers that get triggered, but they are seen almost instantly and either drops away just by seeing them or dissected and embraced.
The simplicity of direct experience adds so much more depth and richness to life.
The fantasy of what “enlightenment” would bring has obviously dropped. It’s feels kind of crazy to see how this fantasy was created, but never questioned. One of the most powerful distractions there was here.
The belief that anything has to be fixed is gone. It is what it is, and it is beautiful.
4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?
This one is hard to pinpoint. Tyler, my guide, was relentless with pointing to DE again and again. The last identification that dropped was awareness. There was a belief that “being aware in the moment” was the “correct” place to “be”, and that everything else was “wrong”. Seeing that “being aware” is just a thought and finally understanding that whatever is, is what is, was a big one.
5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work? What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.
There is no free will. There is no control. Decisions, intentions and choice are based on biological and psychological programming in response to life. Who is there to be responsible?
Example: There is a sensation of dryness in the mouth, a thought arises about getting something to drink, body walks to the fridge to get something to drink, choice is made based on programmed preference of available beverage. Body moves glass to mouth and drinks the beverage.
6) Anything to add?
Just an expression of my deepest gratitude to Tyler for his dedication and precise pointers. Thank you. And thank you LU for helping me and so many others see things clearly.
No. There was never a separate self.
2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.
The separate self is seemingly a bundle of stories, beliefs and assumptions (thoughts) coupled with “sensations”, which are also thoughts.
I don’t know when it starts. How can it be known? There is no memory of having a perspective of not being separate from anything or anyone before the apparent shift to the current perspective. Even the shift from previous to the current perspective is a thought.
There is an imagined story that the illusion of the separate self, started in early childhood, when the intelligence of this body reacted to a biological need and the first thought came into experience that indicated that there was a fragile self in “here” dependent on someone separate “out there”, and so the first code for the program of the separate self was installed.
3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.
Coming into this dialogue there was already an ongoing process of coming to terms with there not existing a separate self. Before doubt dropped during this dialogue, there were bouts of fear, grief and a feeling of meaninglessness/purposelessness.
After the doubt dropped, there is a lightness that has replaced the heaviness that was there before.
The character “Marius” used to be a very “serious” seeker, which came with a lot of pressure. Now the whole thing seems a bit silly. Seeking has dropped. Thoughts are no longer the enemy. Emotions are embraced and met with curiosity, rather than rejection. There are obviously still triggers that get triggered, but they are seen almost instantly and either drops away just by seeing them or dissected and embraced.
The simplicity of direct experience adds so much more depth and richness to life.
The fantasy of what “enlightenment” would bring has obviously dropped. It’s feels kind of crazy to see how this fantasy was created, but never questioned. One of the most powerful distractions there was here.
The belief that anything has to be fixed is gone. It is what it is, and it is beautiful.
4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?
This one is hard to pinpoint. Tyler, my guide, was relentless with pointing to DE again and again. The last identification that dropped was awareness. There was a belief that “being aware in the moment” was the “correct” place to “be”, and that everything else was “wrong”. Seeing that “being aware” is just a thought and finally understanding that whatever is, is what is, was a big one.
5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work? What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.
There is no free will. There is no control. Decisions, intentions and choice are based on biological and psychological programming in response to life. Who is there to be responsible?
Example: There is a sensation of dryness in the mouth, a thought arises about getting something to drink, body walks to the fridge to get something to drink, choice is made based on programmed preference of available beverage. Body moves glass to mouth and drinks the beverage.
6) Anything to add?
Just an expression of my deepest gratitude to Tyler for his dedication and precise pointers. Thank you. And thank you LU for helping me and so many others see things clearly.
Re: I want to break free!
From another guide...
1) Can you share more about the moment identification with awareness was seen? Just in more detail what changed experientially... Just describe.
2) If someone said to you "you have not really seen through self, you have not really woken up". What reactions come up, what thoughts and feelings?
1) Can you share more about the moment identification with awareness was seen? Just in more detail what changed experientially... Just describe.
2) If someone said to you "you have not really seen through self, you have not really woken up". What reactions come up, what thoughts and feelings?
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Sonofnature
- Posts: 96
- Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2024 2:49 am
Re: I want to break free!
It was experienced as relief. There used to be a lot of judgement and despair when being lost in thought was seen, but of course, that was just another thought.1) Can you share more about the moment identification with awareness was seen? Just in more detail what changed experientially... Just describe.
Thoughts about being "awake" seems silly. Who is there to be awake, and feelings labeled curiosity and openness to explore whatever that someone means by this.2) If someone said to you "you have not really seen through self, you have not really woken up". What reactions come up, what thoughts and feelings?
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