The Gate

Hi Aleks,

Sometimes we describe this sense of choosing as a ‘feeling’: It feels like ‘I’ did the ‘choosing’. But the question is, can a feeling ‘choose’? Is it in the nature of a feeling to ‘choose’?

In the beginning of the exercise there was very strong feeling that "I make choices". After that I stopped, and started to look/contemplate that feeling. Slowly a knowing emerged that in my childhood, for a long time I have been forced to make a choice to take the side of my mather or my father. An impossible choice for a child. And that has built a strong feeling of choice.
After I realized that, in the area of the heart it was a movement as if two fluid snakes emerged from the depth, for a couple of seconds moved around each other and merged in one with a soundless click. And the feeling of choosing disappeared. Gone.

Wow…thank you so much for sharing that with me…what powerful ‘seeing’ that was!

Okay, so we have looked at the idea of a controller, decider and chooser. Now let’s look at the idea of a doer/doership.

We’ll do a little exercise on this topic. It has to do with the sense of seeing.

Take a few relaxed breaths to let the dust settle for a while, and then:
Look on your right.
Then look on your left.
Finally, bring your head back to centre, close your eyes and look in front.

Okay, so when you look on the right, the view on the right is seen (whatever that is).
When you look on the left, the view on the left is seen (whatever that is).
And then, when you look in front of you with eyes closed, the view in front is seen (ie ‘black space’).

So, when the view on the right is seen, do you have the ‘choice’ not to see? I’m not asking can you ‘choose’ to see something else like another view or ‘black space’ if you close your eyes. The question is, can you turn seeing off? Can you NOT see what is seen?

Same thing with the view on the left, can you NOT see the view on the left?

Same thing with the view in front with closed eyes, can you NOT see the ‘black space’?

Can you turn off seeing?

What did the 'chooser' choose? Did a 'self' choose something?

If you can't choose what you're aware of, then what else is there to choose?

Kay

Hi Kay,

So, when the view on the right is seen, do you have the ‘choice’ not to see? I’m not asking can you ‘choose’ to see something else like another view or ‘black space’ if you close your eyes. The question is, can you turn seeing off? Can you NOT see what is seen?

The seeing can not be turned off.

Same thing with the view on the left, can you NOT see the view on the left?

No.

Same thing with the view in front with closed eyes, can you NOT see the ‘black space’?

No.

Can you turn off seeing?

No, it is not possible.

What did the 'chooser' choose? Did a 'self' choose something?

There is no "chooser".

If you can't choose what you're aware of, then what else is there to choose?

Well, you are right, this would have been the ultimate choice. Nothing is here to be chosen.

Aleks

Hey Aleks

If you can't choose what you're aware of, then what else is there to choose?

Well, you are right, this would have been the ultimate choice. Nothing is here to be chosen.

Can you explain further what you mean when you say “nothing is here to be chosen”?

Okay, so let’s have a look at the body.
Sit with eyes closed for about 15 minutes.
Paying attention only to the pure sensations, without relying on thoughts or mental images:

Can it be known how tall the body is?
Does the body have a weight or volume?
In actual experience does the body have a shape or a form?

Is there a boundary between the body and the clothing?
Is there a boundary between the body and the chair?

Is there an inside or an outside?
If there is an inside - inside of what exactly?
If there is an outside, the outside of what exactly?

What does the word/label ‘body’ ACTUALLY refer to?
What is the ACTUAL experience of the body?

Look very carefully, especially with the last question. Take your time, don’t rush. You can look several times during the day while doing other things (like washing hands, showering, having a short break from work, walking, etc.) before replying.

Kay

Hi Kay,

Can you explain further what you mean when you say “nothing is here to be chosen”?

I mean that everything just IS. Pure existence, manifestation...

Can it be known how tall the body is?

No

Does the body have a weight or volume?

No, it does not have these properties.

In actual experience does the body have a shape or a form?

No

Is there a boundary between the body and the clothing?

No, there is not.

Is there a boundary between the body and the chair?

No.

Is there an inside or an outside?
If there is an inside - inside of what exactly?
If there is an outside, the outside of what exactly?

Actually here is an incredible thing I noticed a week ago. The feeling of "emptiness", something which has been around all the time and now it is not here, disappeared. And then there were no boundaries at all. Not only division between body and the outside world, but whatsoever division anywhere vanished. And deep peace.

What does the word/label ‘body’ ACTUALLY refer to?

It refers to an image.

What is the ACTUAL experience of the body?

I would say image only. Out of the image, I can not find a connection of the label/image body with the sound and sensation of breathing for example, or the tactile sensation. Even the perception can not be connected to the body in AE.

Aleks

Hi Aleks,

Can you explain further what you mean when you say “nothing is here to be chosen”?

I mean that everything just IS. Pure existence, manifestation...

Thanks for clarifying :)

Is there an inside or an outside?
If there is an inside - inside of what exactly?
If there is an outside, the outside of what exactly?

Actually here is an incredible thing I noticed a week ago. The feeling of "emptiness", something which has been around all the time and now it is not here, disappeared. And then there were no boundaries at all. Not only division between body and the outside world, but whatsoever division anywhere vanished. And deep peace.

Lovely Aleks :)

What does the word/label ‘body’ ACTUALLY refer to?

It refers to an image.

The WORD/LABEL ‘body’ is AE of thought.

What is the ACTUAL experience of the body?

I would say image only. Out of the image, I can not find a connection of the label/image body with the sound and sensation of breathing for example, or the tactile sensation. Even the perception can not be connected to the body in AE.

Do you refer to image as being the colours that are labelled as the body, or are you referring to the seeming ‘mental imprint’ that always seems to be there of the body, especially when the eyes are closed?

The label ‘body’ is AE of thought and not AE of a body
Sensations labelled as ‘body’ are AE of sensation and not AE of a body
Image labelled as ‘body’ is AE of colour and not AE of a body
Smell labelled as ‘body’ is AE of smell and not AE of a body
Taste labelled as ‘body’ is AE of taste and not AE of a body
Thoughts ABOUT the body are AE of thought and not AE of a body.
What is known is label, sensation, colour, smell, tastes and thoughts about the body, however is a body actually known?

Sit in a chair somewhere quiet and take in a couple of deep breaths to settle the dust and start to notice just the ‘body’, the chair, floor, rugs, furniture and walls. Without thought, all there is, is colour which thought then labels as clothes, or body, chair, wall etc (we are only looking at colour for this exercise).

Now look carefully.
1. Can a dividing line between the colour labelled ‘body’ and the colour labelled ‘chair’ be found?
2. Is there a dividing line between the colour labelled ‘chair’ and the colour labelled ‘floor/rug’?
3. Can a dividing line between the colour labelled ‘floor/rug’ and colour labelled ‘furniturel’ be found? Is there ‘space’ between ‘floor/rug’ and the ‘furniture’ or is there just simply colour
3. Can a dividing line between the colour labelled ‘floor/rug and furniture’ and the colour labelled ‘wall’ be found? Is there ‘space’ between ‘floor/rug’, ‘furniture’ and the ‘wall’ or is there just simply colour?
What do you find?

Is there an actual dividing line between any of these “colourS” or are they just simply seamless colour which thought divides into ‘things’ and further divides in into many different colourS and labels them as pink, black, yellow, green etc?

Is there such a thing as “space” or “distance”?

Is there an actual body/you sitting in a chair, or all there is, is colour?

Kay

Hi Kay,

Do you refer to image as being the colours that are labelled as the body

Yes, I was speaking about this.

The label ‘body’ is AE of thought and not AE of a body

I saw this two days ago. It is a thought which stays all the time. After seeing this, suddenly there was total relaxation. And the feeling of FREEDOM. I have been living in a nightmare all my life. I was observing whether this feeling of freedom will not disappear. It seems that when I interact with others in my work it disappears and some parts (parts only) of the old conditioning are coming back. There are patterns of reactions rooted too deep (if I can say this) to find them. When I am alone the freedom is back. I do not know what to do, Kay, in order to change that.

What is known is label, sensation, colour, smell, tastes and thoughts about the body, however is a body actually known?

No, the body is mental construction, just like the apple.

1. Can a dividing line between the colour labelled ‘body’ and the colour labelled ‘chair’ be found?

No, there is no division.

2. Is there a dividing line between the colour labelled ‘chair’ and the colour labelled ‘floor/rug’?

There is no dividing line.

3. Can a dividing line between the colour labelled ‘floor/rug’ and colour labelled ‘furniturel’ be found? Is there ‘space’ between ‘floor/rug’ and the ‘furniture’ or is there just simply colour

There is no dividing line and it is not space, but color.

Is there an actual dividing line between any of these “colourS” or are they just simply seamless colour which thought divides into ‘things’ and further divides in into many different colourS and labels them as pink, black, yellow, green etc?

It is one thing which is somehow divided by thoughts.

Is there such a thing as “space” or “distance”?

No, these are just thoughts.

Is there an actual body/you sitting in a chair, or all there is, is colour?

It is a color only.

As I said before all the borders disappeared, and the space of openness is bigger now. There is no body. But the thought of something (body?) is not dissolving and is reacting to other thoughts (boss for example) with different sensations.

Alex

Hi Aleks,

The label ‘body’ is AE of thought and not AE of a body

I saw this two days ago. It is a thought which stays all the time. After seeing this, suddenly there was total relaxation. And the feeling of FREEDOM. I have been living in a nightmare all my life. I was observing whether this feeling of freedom will not disappear. It seems that when I interact with others in my work it disappears and some parts (parts only) of the old conditioning are coming back. There are patterns of reactions rooted too deep (if I can say this) to find them. When I am alone the freedom is back. I do not know what to do, Kay, in order to change that.

What is it exactly that wants to change that and for what purpose exactly? Can an author of thought be found? If not, then whatever story appears about what SEEMS to be happening appears. But without thought, how is it known that reactions are happening and that they are happening to a me?

The movement of ‘reactions’ is THIS…IT...experience itself! Nothing is not THIS. All abstractions in an abstract painting are the paint, but the paint do not literally become the abstractions. The ordinary is the extraordinary, as are the stories of reactions. This can be seen when we put aside the stories of all movements. Movements ARE, and are IT. The ordinary and mundane, the reactive, the apathetic are all movements and are all IT.

However, if we want an explanation a reason from the point of view of the SEEMING character in the dream, this exploration is just a beginning and not an ending. There will still be beliefs and patterns that are rooted in the idea of being a separate self that will need clearing as not everything gets rewritten in one big hit. The core belief of being a separate self is seen through, however, like a rug that is beginning to unravel, there are still many knots that still need undoing. Knowing that the ‘conditioning’ is not something that you own makes it is easier to clear. Continuing to LOOK is the key, even after the realisation has happened.

So yes, it SEEMS that identifying as the separate self shows up again and again, in different circumstances, along with feelings of resistance, doubt, frustration and confusion etc. This is known as yo-yoing and happens to everyone. Yo-yoing happens on an off, on and off until it becomes a frustration in itself!. Even though there may be a knowing that yo-yoing is also just an appearance, it all seems to be ‘real’! This is quite normal! It isn’t known how long this yo-yoing will go on for, but it will happen until it doesn’t. The key is to keep LOOKING. So there will be a period of checking, and doubting, and rechecking, and that is all very normal. And the movement of yo-yoing is also IT! 

3. Can a dividing line between the colour labelled ‘floor/rug’ and colour labelled ‘furniturel’ be found? Is there ‘space’ between ‘floor/rug’ and the ‘furniture’ or is there just simply colour

There is no dividing line and it is not space, but color.

Yes, just undivided, seamless colour.

As I said before all the borders disappeared, and the space of openness is bigger now. There is no body. But the thought of something (body?) is not dissolving and is reacting to other thoughts (boss for example) with different sensations.

Why would the thought of there being a body dissolve? There has never been a you who has resided in a body, and yet the idea of the body and the idea of a Aleksself have always appeared. Why would any of that change? If you were the author of thought, then you would be able to change the story…but as you are not…then the story of you being a separate self in a body remains. However, can you find anything/anyone that is or isn’t Aleks? Again…movement of Aleksself to no Aleksself is simply THIS as that movement! Is there not just a simple knowing of the character called Aleks and the story of/about Aleks?

If you are given a painting which is labelled Aleks, can you find an actual Aleks in the painting? There is the painting and the idea of an Aleks…but does the paint actually become Aleks or does the paint remain as paint but with ideas about an Aleks?

How does a thought react to another thought exactly? Is one thought aware of another thought?
What can a thought do?
Does a thought have volition?
Can it manipulate other thoughts or think new thoughts?


How is it known that a sensation goes hand in hand with a thought, or vice versa?

We have already done the following exercise, but I think we need to revisit it. So...looking to see if thought and sensation go hand-in-hand. In other words, do thoughts evoke sensations.

1. Put aside 10-15 minutes and sit quietly with your eyes closed.
2. Think of a story that brings up the sensation ‘anxiety’ (or fear) - one that you can feel in the body but not too intense that it overwhelms you.
3. Then with eyes still closed, I want you to LOOK very very carefully to see if you can find/see an actual link between the thought and the sensation ‘anxiety’. You are looking to find if there is something that links the thought/story with the sensation labelled as ‘anxiety’.
4. If the sensation starts to dissipate/weaken, then bring the story to mind again until the sensation is felt clearly again, then continue looking to see if you can see/find a link. You are looking for an actual link that connects the thought/story with the sensation.
5. If you find yourself following thought instead of looking carefully for the link, just bring your attention gently back to the sensation and continue looking.

Do this exercise at least 3-4 times throughout the next 2-3 days making sure to look very carefully. Do thoughts evoke sensations?
Let me know what you find.

Kay

Hi Kay,

What is it exactly that wants to change that and for what purpose exactly?

I think I could not explain well. There are reactions based on resistance. And it is a resistance of acceptance may be, which is creating pockets of closed areas in the perception. Especially it is felt when I am with others. I will explain what I mean.
After your post, I decided finally to look where I did not dare to look more than 45 years.

The first was my biggest humiliation, which happened when I was 4 years old. In the night I focused on that story and forced that focus through the resistance and fear for more than an hour. Pain in the belly came, and after some time it was like a burning, which went to the spine. All the night my spine was burning and I barely slept. On the morning I had a headache and symptoms of the eruption of energy, which happened after I saw the dissolving of Aleks.

The next day I focused on the worst day in my life, when my mother used me as a mediator with my father, trying to save the family. I was 6 years old, it was an impossible task, and when I returned to her with an enormous feeling of failure, guilt, and shame she did not tell me anything. Again all these feelings have been staying inside and coming in interactions with others. For an hour I cried several times. It was a great relief.

The third day I focused on anxiety, which I was feeling again when been with others as feeling that they will make something bad to me. I forced the attention on that feeling in the belly area, through the resistance and fear. After an hour a forgotten story emerged. When my grandfather dyed, I was 9 years old and the night he dyed I was sleeping in the same room. But when the ambulance came, I was awake and witnessed his agony. After that, for some time I was afraid to sleep because I imagined he will come as a skeleton and do something bad to me. I cried again after seeing all this, and again great relief came.

So, now many of my anxieties/resistances during social interactions are gone. As I said, there is a difference in the clear vision and openness when I am alone, and when with the family or at the office. As I understand I should proceed with looking at dissolving all these stories/thoughts/traumas. Because if these anxieties/resistances should be perceived as THAT, it is not the case with me. At the same time, very clearly there is nobody.

For the answers, I will make another post.

Aleks

Hi Kay,

What is it exactly that wants to change that and for what purpose exactly?

There is nobody. I do not know what to say.

Can an author of thought be found?

Very clearly there is no author of thought.

If not, then whatever story appears about what SEEMS to be happening appears. But without thought, how is it known that reactions are happening and that they are happening to a me?

Without thought, all that is not known.

Why would the thought of there being a body dissolve? There has never been a you who has resided in a body, and yet the idea of the body and the idea of a Aleksself have always appeared. Why would any of that change? If you were the author of thought, then you would be able to change the story…but as you are not…then the story of you being a separate self in a body remains. However, can you find anything/anyone that is or isn’t Aleks? Again…movement of Aleksself to no Aleksself is simply THIS as that movement! Is there not just a simple knowing of the character called Aleks and the story of/about Aleks?

I think I understand now. Please give me some days to stay with this when in the office. Sorry, I was too focused to do exercises and to look at the sensations.


Aleks

Hello Aleks,

So, now many of my anxieties/resistances during social interactions are gone. As I said, there is a difference in the clear vision and openness when I am alone, and when with the family or at the office. As I understand I should proceed with looking at dissolving all these stories/thoughts/traumas. Because if these anxieties/resistances should be perceived as THAT, it is not the case with me. At the same time, very clearly there is nobody.

Thank you for sharing all this with me! What you have done is a beautiful thing, albeit not fun when going through it. There seems to be a period where there processes used in order to release ‘past trauma’. By sitting with all the emotions that come up that are attached to stories…there is a letting go of them. Each time after, when the emotion appears, the stickiness of the emotion - of identifying as the emotion becomes less and less, as there is no place left for it to roost, so it passes on by as a visitor, instead of a guest. How long this goes on for, is anyone’s guess, but it is a good thing.

Why would the thought of there being a body dissolve? There has never been a you who has resided in a body, and yet the idea of the body and the idea of a Aleksself have always appeared. Why would any of that change? If you were the author of thought, then you would be able to change the story…but as you are not…then the story of you being a separate self in a body remains. However, can you find anything/anyone that is or isn’t Aleks? Again…movement of Aleksself to no Aleksself is simply THIS as that movement! Is there not just a simple knowing of the character called Aleks and the story of/about Aleks?

I think I understand now. Please give me some days to stay with this when in the office. Sorry, I was too focused to do exercises and to look at the sensations.

What is seen cannot be unseen. But that does not mean that you can never get lost in the story again. It’s like watching a movie and getting sucked into it. Once you look, you know: it’s a movie, not real life. So once you look, you know it’s a story and not reality. The same goes with the story of a me who resides in a body.

Take your time. Do what you need to do and get back to me when you are ready.

Love, Kay

Hello Aleks....how are you going with all of this?

Kay

Hi Kay,

What is seen cannot be unseen

Several times I specifically tried to go back to Aleks existence. It is impossible. Nonetheless, I would like to understand why sometimes the clear vision is blurred.

Hello Aleks....how are you going with all of this?

I went to several sessions of energy healing/regression and family constellations. As a result of these, and especially from the last session from Sunday, there were rearrangements of energies. I have a grand grandfather who has died in the WWI. A black shadow of that war which always been around with a constant feeling of threat disappeared.
What changed is first in the office the interacting is with stillness and the perception of others (if I can say others) changed. The silence deepens because it is not only the internal dialog missing but the automatic labeling is not working constantly, and it is more detached/distant.
The perception of thoughts and sensations changed. They are seen more clearly. And their background is somehow more clearly perceived.
This is what I can tell you now Kay. Sorry for my silence. I proceed with looking.

Aleks

Hello Aleks,

What is seen cannot be unseen

Several times I specifically tried to go back to Aleks existence. It is impossible. Nonetheless, I would like to understand why sometimes the clear vision is blurred.

I think I have gone over why this happens. There is no you who is controlling this.

I would like you to answer the following questions with some detail please, and answer what's true for you rather than any sort of 'ideal' answer. Also please provide examples where asked. By answering these questions we can see if there is anything that is really unclear. If not, then I can get you invited to the LU groups on Facebook and you will also have access to the Further Investigation forum if and when you need it.

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?
Was there ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience.
Describe it fully as you see it now.

3) How does it feel to see this?
What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over; made you look?

5) a) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work? Give examples from your own recent experiences to how things happen and how things work.

b) What are you responsible for? Give examples from your own recent experiences to how this works.

6) Anything to add?

Love, Kay

Hi Kay,

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?
Was there ever?

There is no separate entity, ”I” or “Self”. It does not exist in any place, in any way or any shape or form. It has never existed.

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience.
Describe it fully as you see it now.

It is a belief, which has been formed in early childhood by adopting the language, which is dualistic in its essence by the actions of the parents, which have created the idea that there is a named separate entity, which should be referenced in every movement or change which happens.

3) How does it feel to see this?

What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

Freedom and peace in the first place. Silence. Space. Instead of emotions some sensations and thoughts. And the perception/experience. Existence/being.
Difference? I cannot see what is not different. It was a person sitting in a body permanently tortured by fears and negative emotions, trapped between the past full of mistakes and a future full of threats. Now it is a peaceful NOW in which everything exists.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over; made you look?

The last bit was when you told me that as with the other thoughts, the “body” thought does not have an owner. I needed several days to fully absorb the meaning. And the presence of something like doer disappeared. Actually it took a month from the dissolution of Aleks to the dissolution of the doer.

5) a) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work? Give examples from your own recent experiences to how things happen and how things work.

There is no one to do anything. The only action is observation/perception but even the changes in its field/space are not controlled. Today in the office the moving body and its interactions were observed/perceived with no one action or reaction to the happening.

b) What are you responsible for? Give examples from your own recent experiences to how this works.

There is nobody. Very clearly there is nobody. So who to be responsible? And how to be responsible as everything moves/exists by itself?

6) Anything to add?

Yes. In my case, with my violent childhood and three generations war and repressions, it was of great importance to deal with past traumas in order for the clear vision to affirm itself. So deep looking combined with some practices like regressions and family constellations are indispensable. Again – the dissolution of the person took 3 to 4 seconds, but the dissolution of the doer more than a month. The exercise with the hand is easy, but to see the whole body and the changes around it without reactions is a different story.

Aleks

Hello Aleks,

Thank you for your responses. I will be asking other guides to have a look at your thread to see if I have missed anything and to make sure that I have been pointing clearly. They may have other questions for you.

6) Anything to add?

Yes. In my case, with my violent childhood and three generations war and repressions, it was of great importance to deal with past traumas in order for the clear vision to affirm itself. So deep looking combined with some practices like regressions and family constellations are indispensable. Again – the dissolution of the person took 3 to 4 seconds, but the dissolution of the doer more than a month. The exercise with the hand is easy, but to see the whole body and the changes around it without reactions is a different story.

Yes, there seems to be things that need to be addressed by a separate self, however, where is this separate self that needs these to be addressed? This is what we LOOK at here at LU...simply the seeing through the idea of there being a separate self and nothing more. This exploration is just a beginning and not an ending. There are beliefs and patterns that are rooted in the idea of being a separate self that need clearing as not everything gets rewritten when realisation happens. The core belief of being a separate self is seen through, however, like a rug that is beginning to unravel there are still many knots that need undoing. This is up to the individual to how this is done and when etc and is not up to the guide here, at LU to help with these undoings. That is way beyond their purview as a voluntary guide to assist in seeing through the illusory self.

I will get back to you as soon as I have heard back from the other guides.

Love, Kay