The Gate

Hi again,

Yes, still entangled in life...

what we do here is looking for thuth. What is sensation, what is concepts, words, ideas (=thoughts), what is heard, seen ....
and we look if there can be found anything more inside like an I or me.

The question is "What is truth?" Is it sensations? Raw data? Being non-judgemental???

So have you found a "body" or is "body" a lable for ....?
Have you found any I inside?

A body is just a label to group physical sensations. The thing is, thanks to years and years of continuous conditioning, these physical sensations seem to be an entity on their own...

No "I" inside, just random thoughts, ideas and beliefs... It is difficult to see it as it is, a bunch of random ideas...

Thanks for being patient.

Love,

Matrod.

Hi Matrod

The question is "What is truth?" Is it sensations? Raw data? Being non-judgemental???

Yes, good question. What can we know for sure?
What is "raw data"? Is it different from the sensed, seen, heard ...?
How can say for sure that something is realy "non-judgemental"?
Can any thought be true?

love verananda

Hi verananda,

The question is "What is truth?" Is it sensations? Raw data? Being non-judgemental???
Yes, good question. What can we know for sure?

We don't know anything! That's for sure. We have the illusion of knowing, that's all.

What is "raw data"? Is it different from the sensed, seen, heard ...?

It is no different. Sense data is raw data without interpretation. This is clear. Why does the body react to this sensa data then? Is it impossible just to watch it flow?

How can say for sure that something is realy "non-judgemental"?

We can't for sure. The most approximate thing is to just watch what's going on and enjoy the show (Something very difficult at this time for this body...)

Can any thought be true?

Nope. Thoughts are just thoughts. Coming and going, without any substance. Is it necessary then to remind one again and again of this fact to end the strong conditioning?

Love,

Matrod.

Why does the body react to this sensa data then? Is it impossible just to watch it flow?

is "body" more than a lable, a concept?
What is "reaction" really?
Who reacts or could just watch the flow?

The most approximate thing is to just watch what's going on and enjoy the show (Something very difficult at this time for this body...)

ok. watch the show. sometime drama, othertime commedy or romance ......
who is judging what is better than the other?

love verananda

Hi again,

is "body" more than a lable, a concept?
What is "reaction" really?
Who reacts or could just watch the flow?

The body is a label. That's clear now.
A reaction is a learned behavior triggered by sensory data input.
Nobody reacts! So, what is happening then?

ok. watch the show. sometime drama, othertime commedy or romance ......
who is judging what is better than the other?

Nobody is judging, then why judgement happens?

Thanks again.

Love,

Matrod.

PS: I'll be traveling this week, so my answers may take a bit longer than usual...

Nobody reacts! So, what is happening then?

things just happen? Maybe thats it?

Nobody is judging, then why judgement happens?

do it need a "why"?

love verananda

Hi verananda,

The realization of no self happened recently. Just wanted to let you know.

Thanks a lot for your help and patience.

Love,

Matrod.

Hi Matrod,

thats wonderful!

Do you want me to to know more about?

We have 6 final questions. Its a good way to reflect if all aspects are seen after seeing throught the illusion.

Do you want to answer them?
I would be happy to send them to you!

Love Ve

Hi verananda,

Please do! I will elaborate on what happened later today.

Thanks again.

Love,

Matrod.

here it is ....

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?
Was there ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience.
Describe it fully as you see it now.

3) How does it feel to see this?
What is the difference from before you started this dialogue?
Please report from the past few days.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

5) a) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control.
b) What makes things happen? How does it work?
c) What are you responsible for?
d) Give examples from experience.

6) Anything to add?

looking forward to your answers :-)
love ve

Hi again,

Regarding the questions:

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?
Was there ever?

No separate self at all. There was never one.

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience.
Describe it fully as you see it now.

Separate self starts with the false identification with the body and the sense of being the doer. This never was. It is the result of conditioning and endless repetition. Right now it is just an empty space where everything is. No differences. No separate entities. No judgement.

3) How does it feel to see this?
What is the difference from before you started this dialogue?
Please report from the past few days.

It feels like no burdens. The mind is silent, or if it's working, nothing about what it says is relevant anymore. No borders or boundaries. Life just happens on its own.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

A burning sensation of having to know, so to speak. An intense focus on what is. Leaving aside concepts.

5) a) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control.
b) What makes things happen? How does it work?
c) What are you responsible for?
d) Give examples from experience.

Decision, Intention, Free Will, Choice, Control: Just illusory concepts. There's no doer whatsoever that is able to decide, have intention, exercise free will, choice or have control. Life is a series of spontaneous happenings. We just watch and go with the flow.

As said, things are completely spontaneous. No effort whatsoever.

"I" am not responsible for nothing. How can "I" be since the "I" idea is just a concept? There's nobody to be responsible in the first place!

Life happenings just appear and disappear. People just come and go. We do not have any influence on what happens. Mood changes, weather changes, we just go by, observing and enjoying the show. Nothing has any meaning or sense. Life just is as it is.

6) Anything to add?

Thanks for your guidance and patience. There can be no path when the Truth is so close! It is just a matter of looking, as you always said.

Love from Colombia.

Matrod.

PS: It happened in the most mundane way. While meditating, the realization of the absurdity of a separate self just came by itself. It was a split second that made all the difference. No fireworks, no angels singing, just the plain and old truth! No experience, just an "aha" moment. Stopped waiting for an extraordinary event on the spot. Life just continued. The view changed, that was all.

Hi Matrod,

thank you for wonderful answeres and sharing your experience.

Have a look for PM from admin with further information and invitation to aftergate groups.

It was a pleasure beeing your guide
Love Verananda