Freedom

[Debtfree]

Morning Sioned, hope things are improved with your cat. I’m not going to tennis so I’ll be around x

[Seamist]

Hi Deborah
I've had a busy morning, so am later than usual today engaging here.
(Cat is slowly improving thanks).
A few comments on your full and moving post of yesterday:

I have been noticing I go more slowly and have been seeing how I’m more aware of feelings,sounds, sensations and thoughts and sometimes they are happening simultaneously,

this is great, excellent!

Intellectually I am getting it but not feeling or living it

not yet!You're still on the nursery slopes - but you will, if you keep at it.
Love the metaphorical fat ball! What a great image!

Let's continue today with exploring labelling and thinking.

Do you have an apple in the house? If not, use the image in this link:
http://www.maryshomestead.com/sitebuild ... /fruit.gif
When looking at an apple, there's colour; a thought saying ‘apple’; and maybe a thought
saying, "I'm looking at an apple."
What is known for sure?

There's more to this one, bu I'd like us to take it step-by-step
xxx
Sioned

[Debtfree]

There’s an apple, a large round one, a fruit and there are different colours of red, yellow, mottled in places, it’s got a concave bit on the top with a brown stalk bent towards me. The light is mainly caught around the dip and the light makes it shiny. It’s sitting on a small bit of it at the bottom where it balances leaning more to the left of my vision but it doesn’t topple as it looks fuller or fatter on the right side. Clever the way it balances itself naturally. If I look through half shut eyes it could be a nectarine with its slightly blotchy pleasing colouring. If I touch it it’s cool and my fingers feel warm so I get a cool /warm feeling simultaneously, weird. In the concave bit I can just spy a small brown patch folded from the dip emerging onto the top of the apple’s cheek. It looks solid. I realise all this is labelling and if I was a baby none of this would be how it sees it and it would just be a smudge of colour and form. It’s very still in its isness and is framed by all the other shapes, colours, textures, well maybe not framed but is one coloured shape that is part of all that it’s part of. If I look quietly at it it feels alive and almost looking at me!

[Debtfree]

Just had a nice image of the fat ball melting!

[Debtfree]

Well for sure nothing is known apart from awareness of seeing

[Seamist]

Fab
Is there really an apple , or only colour and a thought about an apple?

[Debtfree]

No there’s not an apple, colour, shape, thought, seeing and thinking about what’s seen.

[Debtfree]

There’s not an apple. Just colour and thinking and seeing...

[Seamist]

Hi Deborah,

There’s not an apple. Just colour and thinking and seeing..

Great!

Can "apple" be found in direct experience?
xx

[Debtfree]

No!

[Seamist]

Excellent!
Just adding a bit of info here to fill this out a bit, though I think that you have probably got this one now.
Anyway, just in case, here it is...

While these thoughts are known, what they talk ABOUT can't be found in actual
experience.
This is what is meant by ‘looking in actual experience ‘. What you know for sure, and, is
always here.
Taste labelled ‘apple’ is known
Colour labelled ‘apple’ is known
Sensation labelled ‘apple’ is known (when apple is touched)
Smell labelled ‘apple’ is known
Thought about/of an ‘apple’ is known
However, is an apple actually known?

[Debtfree]

No except in the isness but maybe better put would be as one with seeing or awareness x

[Seamist]

as one with seeing or awareness

-? not sure what you mean here? Can you explain a bit more?

[Debtfree]

Well I can’t know apple which is a label, symbol or concept but if I touch it I know a sensation, if I smell it I know its smell, I look at it and know colour and shape. As I really look hard at it I know its isness as it’s the same isness or awareness that I am. I have a feeling that if I know the truth of ‘me’ I can know appleness as they’ll be the same??? Bit difficult to explain.x

[Debtfree]

Am off to the Lakes to visit a friend for the day but will be back at five. Hope your cat is well. Speak later. X