Looking for a long time and quite confused.

[s-p-a-c-e]

It's somehow really hard....

...I am somehow still 'me'.

Felix, all that's happening is that 'me' is, for you, mostly un-observable.
I was like this about 15 years ago. :D

You can generally tell by familiar moods, emotional reactions when a button is pressed, and belief patterns that 'me' is operating - but it's a bit like a fish swimming in water, and not seeing the water.

It may seem strange to spend time on something that doesn't exist as a real being - 'me' - but its one thing to hear that, and another to see it. So, what I want you to do is act on the assumption that 'me' is fully operating now, and has been for most of your life.

Take inside and work with the assumption, that you have lived under this delusion of being 'me' for years.
Sit with this a while, and share what comes up.

WIth best wishes,
John

[SomeOne]

So, what I want you to do is act on the assumption that 'me' is fully operating now, and has been for most of your life.

Take inside and work with the assumption, that you have lived under this delusion of being 'me' for years.
Sit with this a while, and share what comes up.

The two "assumptions" seem different, the first one seems to be to assume that 'me' is operating right now, and the other one seems to be to assume that 'me' has only been a delusion. Is that right?

Thanks,
Felix

[s-p-a-c-e]

You got it. A working assumption that 'me' is operating now and has been for years, and you have largely unknowingly lived with/as that delusion of being 'me'. It's not true or false, but a way in.

[SomeOne]

You got it. A working assumption that 'me' is operating now and has been for years, and you have largely unknowingly lived with/as that delusion of being 'me'. It's not true or false, but a way in.

Hey there,

somehow I didn't really get a good grip on this (yet), it's kind of too confusing. I had brief moments where I looked at this 'me' as something else, but they were very short and very few. I spent more time with this, and there was much going on and much to be observed, but it doesn't come together in a clear way, there is nothing that is enough to be put into words.

Many Thanks,
Felix

[s-p-a-c-e]

somehow I didn't really get a good grip on this (yet), it's kind of too confusing. I had brief moments where I looked at this 'me' as something else, but they were very short and very few. I spent more time with this, and there was much going on and much to be observed, but it doesn't come together in a clear way, there is nothing that is enough to be put into words.

:) Many many years ago, I was on a retreat with a teacher in an exotic location. I was young, eager, but just could not see what he was pointing to.

This had gone on for months, and one day, at the retreat he said, 'You know John, were you aware that confusion is a willed state."

It hit me like a boulder in the head. How dare he suggest that!!!

But then, the most I pondered on it, the more I saw I had played confusion for years, I saw the benefits of confusion in getting me out of seeing things I didn't want to, or preventing my engaging in a task for which I was sure I would have failed. Confusion had played quite the role in my life up to this point.

Of course, I fought against it. Confusion was not a willed state, I didn't want to be confused, I just was.

He just smiled that fucking annoying enigmatic smile - you know, the teacher one, that says, "You'll see."

Of course, there's no suggestion at all that you too might be willing yourself into confusion. That would be too much of a co-incidence.

With best wishes,
John

[s-p-a-c-e]

*But then, the most I pondered on it
But then, the more I pondered on it

[SomeOne]

Hey John,

:) Many many years ago, I was on a retreat with a teacher in an exotic location. I was young, eager, but just could not see what he was pointing to.

This had gone on for months, and one day, at the retreat he said, 'You know John, were you aware that confusion is a willed state."

It hit me like a boulder in the head. How dare he suggest that!!!

But then, the most I pondered on it, the more I saw I had played confusion for years, I saw the benefits of confusion in getting me out of seeing things I didn't want to, or preventing my engaging in a task for which I was sure I would have failed. Confusion had played quite the role in my life up to this point.

Of course, I fought against it. Confusion was not a willed state, I didn't want to be confused, I just was.

He just smiled that fucking annoying enigmatic smile - you know, the teacher one, that says, "You'll see."

Of course, there's no suggestion at all that you too might be willing yourself into confusion. That would be too much of a co-incidence.

Thanks a lot for the tale! This new look on confusion seems really insightful and helpful. It feels like the only way to get out of confusion is to accept it, accept that it doesn't help, and continue looking with more will to find something. Also looking at why the confusion was willed there in the first place, i.e. what's the thing that was supposed to be hidden?

With that said, I tried the assumptions out again, here is what I came up with, it still doesn't feel like much/going in the right direction:

You got it. A working assumption that 'me' is operating now and has been for years, and you have largely unknowingly lived with/as that delusion of being 'me'. It's not true or false, but a way in.

What I come up with is that there is no "you"/"I" that has lived with/as that delusion. Since the 'me' was operating all along, this "you"/"I" is only something 'created' by the "me" as well, and doesn't really exist. But this 'me' can't really be observed, so it doesn't make a difference whether it exists or not. But then again there is nobody doing the observation, etc.

Many Thanks,
Felix

[s-p-a-c-e]

Thanks a lot for the tale! This new look on confusion seems really insightful and helpful. It feels like the only way to get out of confusion is to accept it, accept that it doesn't help, and continue looking with more will to find something. Also looking at why the confusion was willed there in the first place, i.e. what's the thing that was supposed to be hidden?

At the time, I had always assumed that confusion was just me not getting it, maybe missing something.
What I hadn't bargained for, was the possibility that I might be wilfully confusing myself, so that I didn't have to face the imagined consequences of seeing what I didn't want to see. Basically, an avoidance tactic.

What I come up with is that there is no "you"/"I" that has lived with/as that delusion. Since the 'me' was operating all along, this "you"/"I" is only something 'created' by the "me" as well, and doesn't really exist. But this 'me' can't really be observed, so it doesn't make a difference whether it exists or not. But then again there is nobody doing the observation, etc.

For now, completely set aside the whole no-me-you-I-whatever, and just sit with you as you are, here and now. Not trying to see it any other than it is.

Don't push anything away, or try to figure anything out.

Observe every single aspect that is given.

A breath. Given.
Light. Given.
Warmth. Given.

Intelligence. Given.
Smile :) Given.

Be you as you are, 100%, with no added ingredients.

And radically accept what is given, open to the possibility of having it all be welcomed, appreciated.
Every single wart and all.

Just dwell in you as you are.

Share the experience.

With much love,
John

[SomeOne]

Hey John,

Thanks a lot for the tale! This new look on confusion seems really insightful and helpful. It feels like the only way to get out of confusion is to accept it, accept that it doesn't help, and continue looking with more will to find something. Also looking at why the confusion was willed there in the first place, i.e. what's the thing that was supposed to be hidden?

At the time, I had always assumed that confusion was just me not getting it, maybe missing something.
What I hadn't bargained for, was the possibility that I might be wilfully confusing myself, so that I didn't have to face the imagined consequences of seeing what I didn't want to see. Basically, an avoidance tactic.

Yeah, the avoidance tactic part was kind of clear to me, but I wasn't clear about what was being avoided; the "imagined consequences of seeing what I didn't want to see" really did it for me. Thanks.

For now, completely set aside the whole no-me-you-I-whatever, and just sit with you as you are, here and now. Not trying to see it any other than it is.

Don't push anything away, or try to figure anything out.

Observe every single aspect that is given.

A breath. Given.
Light. Given.
Warmth. Given.

Intelligence. Given.
Smile :) Given.

Be you as you are, 100%, with no added ingredients.

And radically accept what is given, open to the possibility of having it all be welcomed, appreciated.
Every single wart and all.

Just dwell in you as you are.

Share the experience.

With much love,
John

Man, that had me crying like a little bitch again. Same thing as one of the first posts here. Thanks a lot (I mean it). It's like, there's so much bullshit out there about how to live happy etc., and just a few well-crafted paragraphs can be so so much more real, and just make you look at life that much more honestly and accepting. Thanks a lot for taking your time, it's insane you do that for a total stranger, and with such a strong intensity. Really thanks, it means a lot.

The experience was much as before; it felt like I accepted a lot of shit that is going on within me, and that I wasn't facing before.It feels like it cleared a lot up for me. It was a really nice experience. Especially the part about having it all be welcomed and appreciated, even the warts resonated very strongly with me. This whole 'no-me-no-you' thing feels much lighter currently. At some points there was strong fear around this, fear that 'this whole thing' might be much less than what I hoped for, fear to look into it. I don't think I was able to fully welcome/accept/appreciate all that fear, but I tried, maybe I got parts of it :).

In between I felt drawn to sit down and write this reply, but I also felt that I could try and deepen the experience more instead. This made me feel torn somewhat. But then I realized that things change and run out, no experience stays forever. And there is no use in resisting it. Life has to go on, and won't always stay the same, it changes.

Right now, the experience is fading again, much like last time. It feels like I lost something again; hard to say. But when I remember how nice and liberating it felt, a light version of it comes back to me. Feels good.

I hope that was a good amount of experience.

Thanks a lot again,
Felix

[s-p-a-c-e]

Hi Felix,

It's strange isn't it.

We want to escape who we think we are, by effectively dis-appearing my-self.
And so we go seeking.
But rarely do we turn back around, as you have just done, and face ourselves, warts and all.

I can well understand the tears and sobs, I've been there :) - because it is kind of heart-breakingly sad, but at the same time, there's a poignancy about it that is quite beautiful.

Nothing is ever lost.

In coming to such a place with yourself, it makes for a better platform on which to look.
Although oddly, you might see why go seeking, when you are here all along. :)
Sorry, that's probably confusing. :D - but just let it wash through you, its cool.

Over the coming day, when it comes to mind, bring yourself home to where you are. You, with all your hopes and fears, talents and warts :) - yes, and smile, because you fucking deserve it! :D

You see, we are anything but strangers. :)

With best wishes,
John

[SomeOne]

Hey John,

Hi Felix,

It's strange isn't it.

We want to escape who we think we are, by effectively dis-appearing my-self.
And so we go seeking.
But rarely do we turn back around, as you have just done, and face ourselves, warts and all.

Yeah. That feels like it's a good way to put it.

I can well understand the tears and sobs, I've been there :) - because it is kind of heart-breakingly sad, but at the same time, there's a poignancy about it that is quite beautiful.

Yeah, it really _is_ sad. As much as it is liberating - it's still definitely very sad at its core.

Nothing is ever lost.

In coming to such a place with yourself, it makes for a better platform on which to look.
Although oddly, you might see why go seeking, when you are here all along. :)
Sorry, that's probably confusing. :D - but just let it wash through you, its cool.

Over the coming day, when it comes to mind, bring yourself home to where you are. You, with all your hopes and fears, talents and warts :) - yes, and smile, because you fucking deserve it! :D

You see, we are anything but strangers. :)

With best wishes,
John

Much thanks for your last post. Throughout the day I had some more small "release" moments, it was really nice. Everything felt much lighter somehow - including the "no-me-no-you"-stuff -, and the future felt much less important. There were more little things I thought about sharing when they occurred, but I don't really remember any right now. Currently, it feels like it's kind of 'clouding up' again, but it also feels like a lot of the lightness is still staying, and a little bit like a more permanent shift.

Many Thanks,
Felix

[s-p-a-c-e]

Much thanks for your last post. Throughout the day I had some more small "release" moments, it was really nice. Everything felt much lighter somehow - including the "no-me-no-you"-stuff -, and the future felt much less important. There were more little things I thought about sharing when they occurred, but I don't really remember any right now. Currently, it feels like it's kind of 'clouding up' again, but it also feels like a lot of the lightness is still staying, and a little bit like a more permanent shift.

There are two approaches to this. The common one, as we mentioned, is to escape. What am I escaping? Perceptions of myself. So, this is characterised by chasing bliss, or truth, or enlightenment; but its really more away-from that towards.

The second approach is not to run anywhere, or seek to escape where you are, but on the contrary, to face where you are, with an approach of ever-widening openness and honesty to seeing what is happening - right here, right now. And to know for a fact that delusions are in play :) that's half the fun. And it is a fascinating game to look to discover more about our perceptions of ourselves.

There is nothing more curious. :) - as Alice may have said.

Ponder on this:

"For as long as I can remember, I have thought myself to be this character Felix. And despite the fact that I cannot pinpoint this character, I still go about my life as if that were the case. What if, I have been wrong about that all along? What if, I am not at all what I thought myself to be? What if, when an arm moves 'Felix' is not the mover, but the arm moves precisely anyway. What if 'Felix' is not the speaker, yet words come and flow precisely anyway. Isn't that a curious thing?"


Keep it light, and smile at intervals. :)

With much love,
John

[SomeOne]

Ponder on this:

"For as long as I can remember, I have thought myself to be this character Felix. And despite the fact that I cannot pinpoint this character, I still go about my life as if that were the case. What if, I have been wrong about that all along? What if, I am not at all what I thought myself to be? What if, when an arm moves 'Felix' is not the mover, but the arm moves precisely anyway. What if 'Felix' is not the speaker, yet words come and flow precisely anyway. Isn't that a curious thing?"


Keep it light, and smile at intervals. :)

With much love,
John

Hey John,

thanks for your post. It's really a curious thing indeed. I looked at my arms moving again, and while looking at how they were going to move, and whether I could see in advance how they would move, they suddenly started moving really wildly, completely different from anything I was thinking about. In that moment I realized that they just move, and while one can think about a reason for why they moved as they did, they still just move by themselves.

I then noticed that it seemed to be different for very common movements, like walking etc. But when I looked, I also noticed that I didn't know ahead of time how exactly my feet would be placed, or when I would suddenly turn around. Actually, it feels like there is always something going on, every moment, not only when "I" do something. Same for the words. They seem to come from and go to nowhere.

Then, I thought about past situations, and wondered "what if 'Felix' wasn't there, either?" and it felt really releasing, as I noticed what that felt like.

While doing the pondering, there were a few situations were I drifted off, and when I noticed that I felt the urge to quickly go back to the "exercise". However, instead I "kept it light" and allowed the moment to drift off. I then immediately noticed a sadness/fear/feeling that seemed to stem from the fact that I was chasing this so much, because I was so desperate. Noticing that also felt very relieving, almost up to the point of thinking "why should I even continue this? there is no need to".

Many Thanks,
Felix

[s-p-a-c-e]

thanks for your post. It's really a curious thing indeed. I looked at my arms moving again, and while looking at how they were going to move, and whether I could see in advance how they would move, they suddenly started moving really wildly, completely different from anything I was thinking about. In that moment I realized that they just move, and while one can think about a reason for why they moved as they did, they still just move by themselves.

Yeah. :) I'm always curious of the word 'just'. Like, 'they just move', rather than, 'they move'.
It's like we want to add in some shock factor :) - fuck, look at that, they just moved.
And we want to say, 'all by themselves' - because we are obsessed with agency.
Everything has agency. The sky is unhappy, the computer doesn't want to work. :D

And of course, we have assigned agency to "MEEEEEEEE".

I then noticed that it seemed to be different for very common movements, like walking etc. But when I looked, I also noticed that I didn't know ahead of time how exactly my feet would be placed, or when I would suddenly turn around. Actually, it feels like there is always something going on, every moment, not only when "I" do something. Same for the words. They seem to come from and go to nowhere.

I do wonder whether a fox sits and wonders how paws move, and tails swish. lol Or a swift, 'look mam, the wings, they are just flapping."

Then, I thought about past situations, and wondered "what if 'Felix' wasn't there, either?" and it felt really releasing, as I noticed what that felt like.

Cool. Hmmmm, what if. Re-writes history doesn't it. Are you saying that "I" didn't score that goal where "I" dribbled around 6 defenders. :)

While doing the pondering, there were a few situations were I drifted off, and when I noticed that I felt the urge to quickly go back to the "exercise". However, instead I "kept it light" and allowed the moment to drift off. I then immediately noticed a sadness/fear/feeling that seemed to stem from the fact that I was chasing this so much, because I was so desperate. Noticing that also felt very relieving, almost up to the point of thinking "why should I even continue this? there is no need to".

Excellent stuff to keep it light, and to respect where these things lead, and what shows up. Its very interesting what happens, when we take off the reins in wanting to be THIS WAY, and OPEN UP to how it is, and how it moves.

And to give ourselves a break, and feel some appreciation for the road we've been on. Life's tough enough without getting on our own case.

Let's stay with this approach for a little longer. Opening up the doors to how it is, a kind of radical welcoming of you - not wanting to be any other than you.

Continue to explore, and please share as you go.

With much love,
John

[SomeOne]

Hey John,

Yeah. :) I'm always curious of the word 'just'. Like, 'they just move', rather than, 'they move'.
It's like we want to add in some shock factor :) - fuck, look at that, they just moved.
And we want to say, 'all by themselves' - because we are obsessed with agency.
Everything has agency. The sky is unhappy, the computer doesn't want to work. :D

And of course, we have assigned agency to "MEEEEEEEE".

It's the complexity of human actions that makes it seem a little bit different. Like, why would someone watch football if there wasn't a kind of person/personality that is interested in football? It feels like this might just be "willed confusion" on my part.

The thing about agency has definitely stuck with me, though.

Cool. Hmmmm, what if. Re-writes history doesn't it. Are you saying that "I" didn't score that goal where "I" dribbled around 6 defenders. :)

Just as much as there is someone making grass grow left or right, I guess. :)

Excellent stuff to keep it light, and to respect where these things lead, and what shows up. Its very interesting what happens, when we take off the reins in wanting to be THIS WAY, and OPEN UP to how it is, and how it moves.

And to give ourselves a break, and feel some appreciation for the road we've been on. Life's tough enough without getting on our own case.

Let's stay with this approach for a little longer. Opening up the doors to how it is, a kind of radical welcoming of you - not wanting to be any other than you.

Continue to explore, and please share as you go.

With much love,
John

Sure. One experience was when I felt like I needed to "do" something, like the exercises before, it felt almost like an urge. But then I "kept it light", and noticed that that again was just running away from something, trying to get somewhere else than where I currently am. That felt very relieving.

I had moments where I noticed that there wasn't a "me" that "wanted to do anything". Like, I was lying and bed and thinking "I want to do blah/X today/soon" and noticed that such a "me" just wasn't there. There was just what was happening in that moment, and in future moments there would be "just" stuff happening without anybody directing it (like arms moving).

I had a few more such moments, but when I "kept it light", I noticed that somehow again there seems to be a strong sadness appearing, and all that noticing (while not necessarily wrong) was used to "get" somewhere, and away from here.

It feels like there is fear of there being no control over life. That would mean that there is no way to arrive at/achieve/gain the things one wants to/improve one's own situation. Like, there are people who are simply better off than others with no way to change it, and that evokes a very desperate feeling. It also feels like there would be a "loss of self" if accepted.

Will share more when more pops up.

Many Thanks,
Felix