passing through the gate

[forgetmenot]

Hi Simon,

Thoughts, sensation, colour, sound, smell and taste are AE and cannot have a knowing.

Yes, Thoughts, sensation, colour, sound, smell and taste do not know anything.

So, are you aware of thoughts, sensations, colour, sound, small and taste or are they just known to you?
Is there a dividing line, say, between a sound (AE) and the knowing of the sound, or is there just knowing/known?
In other words is ‘knowing’, separate from what is ‘known’, or are they one and the same?

Okay just to clarify the difference between AE of thought and content of thought.

If you were in a desert, dying of thirst, could you quench your thirst just by thinking about water (thoughts) or would you need to drink ‘real’ water?

Let’s say I’m with you in the desert and offer you two options:
(1) In my left hand there is a piece of paper with the word ‘water’ written on it, and
(2) in my right hand there is a bottle of water.

Which one would you choose to quench your thirst, the label or the water?
So, can the label ‘water’, which is actual experience (AE) of thought, quench your thirst?

Labels are ‘real’ as appearing thoughts but its ‘content’, what the thought is ABOUT is not ‘real’ and is NOT the AE of ‘content’.

Is this clear?

Kay
xxoo

[Simon]

Hi Kay,
Yes it's clear the AE of thought is real. The contents of thought is not.

Simon

[Simon]

Kay,

What exactly is it that is having the experience of seeing a car ?

The AE of seeing the a car is happening to no one, awareness / knowing is aware of the experience of seeing a car.

What exactly is getting triggered?

Nothing is being triggered, wrong chose of words.what I meant is that experience is happening continously as is thought and awareness/knowing is ever present.
Simon

[Simon]

Are you aware of thoughts, sensations, sound, taste, smell, image/colour or are these just known ?

Whenever the experience of thought, sensations etc arise awarness/knowing is aware because it is ever present.

Is there a dividing line between sound (AE) and the knowing of sound, or is it just knowing/known

There is no dividing line it is just knowing/known.

[Simon]

Is knowing separate from what is known or are they the same?

It is the same.

If you were in the desert dieing of thirst would the thought of drinking the water quench your thirst or would you need to drink water?

Drink the water thirst is the AE not the thought

So can the label of water actually quench your thirst ?

No, the action of drinking the water (AE) will.

Simon

[forgetmenot]

Hey Simon,

If you were in the desert dieing of thirst would the thought of drinking the water quench your thirst or would you need to drink water?

Drink the water thirst is the AE not the thought

So yes, although the label ‘water’ cannot quench the thirst, only drinking ‘real’ water will.

Let’s take that a step further to what actually is…to what the AE of thirst and drinking water actually is.

Drinking water is not actual experience.

The label ‘thirst’ is AE of thought and not the AE of thirst.
The sensation labelled “thirsty’ is the AE of sensation and not the AE of thirst
The image labelled ‘body’ that is ‘thirsty’ is AE of image and not AE of thirst.


The thought “I am drinking water” is the AE of thought and not the AE of an “I drinking water”
The sensation of ‘drinking/swallowing’ water is the AE of sensation and not the AE of drinking/swallowing
The sensation labelled ‘cool water’ is the AE of sensation and not the AE of cool water
The image of an “I, drinking” is AE of image and not the AE of someone drinking.

So what is the AE of thirst? There is no thirst

1) Can a separate individual be found that can be thirsty?
2) What is really there in actual experience is label + sensation + image.

What is the AE of drinking water? There is no entity drinking water

1) Can a separate individual be found that is drinking water?
2) What is really there in actual experience is thought + sensation + image.

Is this clear?

Kay
xxoo

[Simon]

Hi Kay,
Yes all of this is clear, there is no one feeling thirsty, hungry, tired etc it is all AE thought, sensations and image/colour glued together by thought to create the illusion of an I that is.

Simon

[forgetmenot]

Hi Simon,

That's great that all that is clear and you are very clear between the difference of actual experience of thought and content of thought.

Let's move on!

Here is another exercise looking at control, decisions and choices.

1. Place both hands on a table in front of you, palms down.
2. When you have done that, rest for a moment and then raise one hand in the air but not the other.

Don't go to thoughts, examine the actual experience. Do this as many times as you like, and each time inquire…

What is it exactly that is choosing which hand to raise?
Can you find a separate individual or anything that is doing the choosing?
What is it that is controlling the hand?
Can a ‘controller’ of any description be located?
Can anything be found that makes the hand move?
How is the decision made?

Kay
xxoo

[Simon]

Hi kay,

What is it exactly that is choosing which hand to raise? 

There seems to be no evidence of a what, who or anything that is choosing it just happens.

Can you find a separate individual or anything that is doing the choosing?

No

What is it controlling the hand?

There doesn't seem to be a presents of a controller

[Simon]

Can a controller of any description be found?

No

Can anything be found that makes the hand move?

No

So how is the decision being made?

There is no one to make any decision, the label hand moving is the AE of thought, not the hand moving.
The label hand moving is AE of image/colour.

Simon

[forgetmenot]

Hi Simon,

Thank you for being so diligent in looking!

What is it exactly that is choosing which hand to raise?

There seems to be no evidence of a what, who or anything that is choosing it just happens.

Yes....however you don't sound to sure as you used the word 'seems'. Perhaps looking again to double check. Let me know what you find.

Can you find a separate individual or anything that is doing the choosing?

No

Terrific!

What is it controlling the hand?

There doesn't seem to be a presents of a controller

There doesn’t SEEM to be or there isn’t?

So how is the decision being made?

There is no one to make any decision, the label hand moving is the AE of thought, not the hand moving.
The label hand moving is AE of image/colour.

Yes, the label ‘moving hand’ is AE of thought and not the AE of a moving hand
The sensation labelled ‘hand moving’ is AE of sensation and not the AE of a moving hand
The image labelled ‘moving hand’ is AE of colour and not the AE of a moving hand.

So can a moving hand be found anywhere?


So let’s move the LOOKING to ‘daily living’. If you don't drink tea of coffee..let me know and I will give you a different exercise.

Go and make a cup of tea or coffee.

As you do this notice whether a 'self' does it.
Also notice if there are many or any moments in the whole procedure of going to the kettle, switching it on, getting the cup (etc) when 'you' control the process.

How is the decision made to either make a cup of tea or coffee?
Do ‘you’ choose to add or not add milk into the tea (or coffee) or how much milk to add?
Is there a moment of choice or does it happens automatically?
Do ‘you’ make the cup of tea (or coffee) happen or it just happens?
Can a chooser be located?
If yes, where is it exactly?
And what does the chooser looks like?

Kay xxoo

[Simon]

Hi kay, Tea is perfect thanks.

So can a moving hillusionound anywhere?

There is no moving hand.

How is the decision made to either make a cup of tea or coffee?

A thought arises "I would like a cup of tea"

[Do ‘you’ choose to add or not add milk into the tea (or coffee) or how much milk to add?

There is no you, Me, or I that has a choice, "I" is an illusory thought as is the label choice.

[Simon]

Is there a moment of choice or does it happens automatically? 

There is no one to make a choice, it's part of the Simon story "I would like a cup of tea " it's just thought, there is no thing to make anything happen life is just happening.

Do ‘you’ make the cup of tea (or coffee) happen or it just happens?

There is no you everything is just happening.

[forgetmenot]

Hi Simon,

You haven't answered the last 3 questions in the 'cup of tea' exercise. Can you please answer ALL questions, in future that are highlighted in blue text.

Can a chooser be located?
If yes, where is it exactly?
And what does the chooser looks like?

Nor did you answer these questions.

What is it exactly that is choosing which hand to raise?

There seems to be no evidence of a what, who or anything that is choosing it just happens.

Yes....however you don't sound to sure as you used the word 'seems'. Perhaps looking again to double check.
Let me know what you find.

What is it controlling the hand?

There doesn't seem to be a presents of a controller

There doesn’t SEEM to be or there isn’t?


Kay
xxoo

[Simon]

Hi kay, Tea is perfect thanks.

So can a moving hillusionound anywhere?

There is no moving hand.

How is the decision made to either make a cup of tea or coffee?

A thought arises "I would like a cup of tea"

[Do ‘you’ choose to add or not add milk into the tea (or coffee) or how much milk to add?

There is no you, Me, or I that has a choice, "I" is an illusory thought as is the label choice.