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[seeing clearly!]

Hi Kevin,
Wow! That statement about the loss of arms and legs felt like running into a pole. I am going to sit with the loss of the rest of me as an excercise and see what is present. It may be difficult, but worth an investigation. As always thank you much for guiding me along this journey, I truly appreciate it.

Regards,
Larry

[KevinD]

:)

[seeing clearly!]

Hi Kevin,
Seeing my self as no body and then no head either as an excercise has caused me to see better how "reality" around us is so constructed by thought, opinion, and feeling. Quite interesting. Even though there is a persistant effort to create an" I".
Regards,
Larry

[KevinD]

Hi Larry,

You've come to the conclusion that the I is just an illusion.
It's equivalent to Santa Claus--a phantom.
How is it that you can create something that doesn't exist, never did?

Best,
Kevin

[seeing clearly!]

Hi Kevin,
Yes, slippery thing this mind. Even so, there still is a persistance of the mind to create a "self" using any thought, or emotion, or sensation it can. I can say that I am surprised that once the realization hit of my illusionary self sensation, I did not get what I thought would be confirmation. You know, the blissed out eurphoric look in my eyes, bells going off, whistles in my head etc. I will say that I get odd mini chills and a humerous, "oh wow", from time to time. Kevin, you may be able better than I to see if I have indeed passed the Gate thats no Gate. I really am appreciative of you and this wonderful website which has been so awesome for me. Please give any coaching about being able to live from "no self" you may feel I need to understand.
Thanks,
Larry

[KevinD]

Hi Larry,
Wow, that's really great stuff.
It sounds like a very profound experience.

Let's do a quick recap.

With 'you' revealed as a thought story, what remains?

What experiences?

What thinks?

What does?

What is aware?

Nice work,
Kevin

[seeing clearly!]

Hello Kevin,
There is an unconnection to the story (history ) of this life. What's left in the space is a directness of seeing as seeing, hearing as hearing emotions as emotions appearing and disappearing. There is life experiencing through this body in all of it's many dimensions. There is no controlling element orchestrating anything. Thoughts come and go from the space of mind, labeling, assessing out of nowhere. There is perception of movement which shifts into and out of life experience yet there is no owner . What is aware? Undivided life, being aware of itself. I am aware of an ocean of awareness, aware of it/her/himself through me. Forever Eternal Yet, there is no me to own it. Only to Love and be grateful for the life that is present.

Deep regards,
Larry

[KevinD]

Delicious responses, Larry.

I love the clarity.

Let me run some questions by you before I ask my colleagues to review this thread.

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work? What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.

6) Anything to add?


Nice work,
Kevin

[seeing clearly!]

Hi Kevin,
Well, after going through this inquiry into the matter of there being a 'self', 'me' or 'I' none have been found. It is surprising to come to the realiztion that there was never a 'self or 'me in reality. On a social level however there is a false sense of one created because of the thoughts, ideas, assessment of others etc. In this case, around 6 or 7 years of age, this sense of me as a separate being was generated.

Thoughts, emotions and sensations get wedded and the false notion of a permanent core shows up. In my case the attention keeps referring back to the "story" of my life over and over until it appears as a real thing. Conflicts arise when my storyline runs into conflict with others. When awareness zeros into the story a false sense of a separate being is formed.
Now there a noticing of awareness moving between noticing thoughts and times when awereness is just observing sensations and the physical world around. I notice that there are less buzzing thoughts clammering for attention. kinda nice. When anger arises and I take a moment to notice the attachment to a story occuring, there is defusing of the emotion.
Since starting this dialogue with you I have noticed a new sense of peace and a letting be of trying be other. I am enjoying the physical world around me with no attachment to it. People are a lot more enjoyable to experience. I get feelings of gratitude and joy at the precess of Life we all share.
During our conversation, Kevin, at one point I said that I was 'stuck'. You said, "If there is no "I" who could be stuck. That began the opening process for me. Then when I did the exercise eliminating arms and legs in the attempt to find an "I", that further caused a noticing of no place where there is a solid separate inner being called 'me'. When the realization of no 'me', came the question arose, Who owns anything in an absolute sense? That was a little unnerving. So in hindsight, a lot of ongoing questionings and looking into this life provided the space needed for seeing who I am not.
Now, as to intention, decision, freewill,choice and control? Hummm. I observe life as occuring as it does. I have no control over it all. Thoughts come and go and actions follow as they do given the circumstances present. I am responsible for what comes out of my mouth as declarations and commitments given to people. Not sure how all this works. Just glad that it does. Kevin, please give any claification which may be helpful.

Thanks,
Larry

[KevinD]

Hi Larry,

I've reformatted this so it's easier to see which questions you've answered.
I have a sense you've seen the true nature of self, and the folly that it is separated in any way.
Your questions around control aren't unusual. It usually takes folks a bit of time to realize fully that control is beyond the grasp.

I'm going to send this to my colleagues for review and see if they have any questions about this thread.
Please be patient, they've got a lot of threads to go through.



Hi Kevin,

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

Well, after going through this inquiry into the matter of there being a 'self', 'me' or 'I' none have been found. It is surprising to come to the realiztion that there was never a 'self or 'me in reality. On a social level however there is a false sense of one created because of the thoughts, ideas, assessment of others etc. In this case, around 6 or 7 years of age, this sense of me as a separate being was generated.

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

Thoughts, emotions and sensations get wedded and the false notion of a permanent core shows up. In my case the attention keeps referring back to the "story" of my life over and over until it appears as a real thing. Conflicts arise when my storyline runs into conflict with others. When awareness zeros into the story a false sense of a separate being is formed.

Now there a noticing of awareness moving between noticing thoughts and times when awereness is just observing sensations and the physical world around. I notice that there are less buzzing thoughts clammering for attention. kinda nice. When anger arises and I take a moment to notice the attachment to a story occuring, there is defusing of the emotion.

3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

Since starting this dialogue with you I have noticed a new sense of peace and a letting be of trying be other. I am enjoying the physical world around me with no attachment to it. People are a lot more enjoyable to experience. I get feelings of gratitude and joy at the precess of Life we all share.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

During our conversation, Kevin, at one point I said that I was 'stuck'. You said, "If there is no "I" who could be stuck. That began the opening process for me. Then when I did the exercise eliminating arms and legs in the attempt to find an "I", that further caused a noticing of no place where there is a solid separate inner being called 'me'. When the realization of no 'me', came the question arose, Who owns anything in an absolute sense? That was a little unnerving. So in hindsight, a lot of ongoing questionings and looking into this life provided the space needed for seeing who I am not.

5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work? What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.

Now, as to intention, decision, freewill,choice and control? Hummm. I observe life as occuring as it does. I have no control over it all. Thoughts come and go and actions follow as they do given the circumstances present. I am responsible for what comes out of my mouth as declarations and commitments given to people. Not sure how all this works. Just glad that it does. Kevin, please give any claification which may be helpful.

Thanks,
Larry

[KevinD]

Hi Larry,
One of the guides has a great question about control.

"Where is the separate individual who has no control over life but is responsible for 'what comes out of his mouth as declarations and commitments given to people?' "

Please be as specific as you can.

Thanks,
Kevin

[seeing clearly!]

Hi Kevin,
Gonna spend time letting what the guide asked about control settle in. Thanks so much.

Larry

[KevinD]

All good

[seeing clearly!]

Hello Kevin,
Here is a clarification on commitments and promises to others. I am clear there is no solid harecore 'me' anywhere. In the inquiry, none has ever been found. Also, I now understand that I can really control nothing and never could. In interactions with others on a social level however I feel that language is what creates social paradigms. Commincation needs to have authenticity about them to create harmony among others. That's what I meant in my previous comment. I welcome any coaching. Thanks.

Larry

[KevinD]

Hi Larry,
A follow up question from one of the guides:

"Who takes care of the communication being authentic so it will create harmony among others? Please don't answer from memory but from the next opportunity that arises. Look."

Thanks,
Kevin