Let's do this!

[Armstrong]

The audio is about 20 minutes long. I suggest you find 30 minutes or so to work through it.

[danl]

Ok, will do.

[danl]

I was in a wreck yesterday. No time for anything but direct experience for the few seconds it took to see the oncoming collision followed by the airbag deflate after it hit my face. Not trying to make excuses, but I didn't get to the audio today.

[Armstrong]

Right now, in direct experience, what trace is there of the past?

You're talking about yourself as if you're a person that got in an accident recently, also has a lot of obligations and therefore can't be bothered to investigate things.

You seem to be assuming that you can't do this now, but you'll get to it later.

Is that your assumption? Where did it come from? Did you decide to assume things that way?

[danl]

I did put other obligations first. Right now, the only trace of the past is soreness in the body.

I did go through the audio today, taking time to pause and investigate. I didn't find a thinker or doer. I can't describe things I taste except as it relates to something else. Thoughts come from what is being experienced, and from other thoughts.

I don't find a boundary of self. There is a sensation on the skin but it doesn't go deeper. The eyes see images, that is all. Sounds are heard and I can't tell that they are outside of a self that hears them.

When looking for a self there is only awareness of looking.

[Armstrong]

Ok. Is this novel? Did you get what you came for?

Do you have the sense there ought to be more to it? If so, can you describe that in terms of your direct experience?

[danl]

Not novel. It's simple and that's refreshing.

Did you get what you came for?

Yes, but feel it's only the beginning.

Do you have the sense there ought to be more to it? If so, can you describe that in terms of your direct experience?

No, not in direct experience. It is already complete.

Thank you for your patience and persistence!

[Armstrong]

Any further questions? Anything seem odd?

[danl]

Nothing odd. There is still a sense of self. Nothing has changed. I still get sucked into the activities of the day. Does continuing to practice looking through direct experience change anything?

[Armstrong]

I'm not sure. It might be best if I asked you a few more questions.

Can you describe how your "sense of self" works, in terms of direct experience? What is it like to get sucked into the day'sactivities? What is it like when you aren't? Do you have any control over it? Please describe.

[danl]

With the days activities there is a lot of thinking, planning, and distractions; knowing that much of the success or failure falls to me. So there is the feeling of responsibility. This isn't something I want to escape, but it's easy to lose sight that this is just a feeling, and thinking. It's also natural/habitual to think that I helped make this happen or fail. I'm at times engrossed on a project and tune out everything else. During these times I may not be aware of direct experience such as hunger or discomfort.

When doing the exercises with direct experience it is more obvious that there is no self feeling the sensation on the skin, or hearing a sound, etc. When going for a walk I'm aware of sights, smells, temperature and not caught up in thoughts.

If there is any control it is choosing what to focus on, and that is really just labeling.

[Armstrong]

Thanks for your response!

What is "feeling of responsibility" in d.e.? Eg moment to moment, is it tension in the body, a series of thoughts related to a stimuli, followed by action?

Eg I read your response, thought, "I need to focus and respond" and momentarily I was engrossed and started tapping out an answer. Then I saw some spelling errors, felt frustrated and tapped to fix things. When that happened my fixation on answering the substance went away - the focus was on tapping precisely. From task to task, "I" didn't fix my attention on one thing or another, like a guy punching buttons or pulling levers. When I did each task, I couldn't tell you how I did them, or that I was going to do them before I did.

Could you please try to describe what it is like to do some of your daily activities in detail, as I just tried to do? Particuparly the frustrating or otherwise negative ones? What happens in your body - in terms of tension - as you go about tasks?

I get that when engrossed in a task you may not feel hunger or your feet on the floor. What is your experience then? There is some experience, isn't there? A bunch of thoughts? Is there a "you" thinking them? Do you decide where and when your attention goes wherever it goes? How does that work?

[danl]

Yes, I'll pay attention to this tomorrow and let you know. Your example is helpful. Looking back, it seems it is only the experience of thoughts but I bet there is more such as tension in the shoulders, etc. and want to be sure.

Thanks

[danl]

I tried to pay attention today when I was working on time sensitive items and interrupted. I noticed that I was relaxed and simply changed focus, however I can watch closer because my attention is primarily on the task at hand and not much else. I didn't pay attention as often as I wanted today. There were brief moments, and this happened more when things slowed down. I'll continue.

[Armstrong]

OK. If you look at our exchange above, it seems you reported a "problem" and I essentially asked you to pay more attention to the phenomenon and whether or not you control what you pay attention to, how much etc. - and if so, how you do that.

Another way to look at it is try to figure out if attention is a thing that you manipulate. One way to examine that is to do things like walking, reading, talking and notice what stimuli you're repeatedly noticing and whether or not or how you - the thing experiencing that - control that.

Eg walk and get food - notice what stimuli you're noticing (sight, pressure and where your body is in space).
Read and email - sight and thinking.

And then try to see if you control your experience as you do activity A versus activity B.

Another way: if you are reading something and you get interrupted, do you rearrange your attention so that you pay attention to the interruption? If so, how do you do it?