The Gate

Hi Knabo,

I’m going to ask you to organise direct experience now and please direct it towards re-examining the following questions. Try not to get hung up on the inadequacy of the words required to communicate and I will make sure to give maximum latitude in any further response the answers generate. Please understand there’s no trick, this is merely a diagnostic tool. Your directness and honesty is appreciated.


1. How does it feel to see through the illusion of a separate self?
2. What’s the difference from before you started this investigation?
3. Please explain in full what this illusion is and how it works from your own experience.
4. How does it feel to see this?
5. What pushed you across the line?
6. Do you decide, intend, choose or control events in Life? Do you make anything happen? Give examples from your own experience.
7. Do you have anything to add?

Hi again,

Just to let you know that you can take your time over the next couple of days, if you like, as I will pretty busy till Wednesday this week.

Cheers,
Michael

1.How does it feel to see through the illusion of a separate self?

It feels like I have nothing to do. I have no books to read, I have no ‘self improving’ to do. I have nothing to search for. This is good since I did not know what I was searching for in the first place.

2. What’s the difference from before you started this investigation?

Before I started this dialog I was coming up with a new theory of existence every couple of weeks. I was reading two or three books at a time. This was fun, but I ended up going in circles.

3. Please explain in full what this illusion is and how it works from your own experience.

The illusion of a separate self is a concept that becomes more important than experience. Experience is, in fact, ignored for the most part. The illusion is self replicating in that any “answers” you find are still part of the illusion. It is not to say you will not see changes in your life or feel better about your existence. But all this is manipulating an illusion. Then we compare the illusion of our separate self to our own illusion of other separate selves. It can become very consuming.

4. How does it feel to see this?

There is an unburdening that occurs. As I said, I have nothing that needs doing.

5. What pushed you across the line?

Once I realized that any “truth” I discovered was actually another concept. This caused all the illusion I had been built up to fade away.

6. Do you decide, intend, choose or control events in Life? Do you make anything happen? Give examples from your own experience.

It is very clear that decisions, intent, and choosing are all done before awareness is processed. Awareness only sees the resulting actions and then assumes that some choice was made. I have no direct evidence that “choices” are made. There is nothing that awareness can do to directly make things happen. Awareness is a great feedback tool that can influence future decisions. Typically you only have to touch a red hot stove once. From my experience with “me” the body will go on about its business and the self’s internal dialog will claim responsibility. The “self” will try to predict future actions and then quickly make rationalizations when it got it wrong. It is all kind of funny to watch now.

7. Do you have anything to add?

It is interesting that all this time seeking change I was creating a static illusion. Once you see though the illusion and see the ever changing world then change just happens.

Hi Knabo,

No time to reply tonight. I've asked other guides to audit our conversation and should get a few more questions soon.

Regards,
Michael

Hi Knabo,

I've asked other guides to view and comment. It's safe to assume that they haven't read the entire conversation, but what was read highlighted the following questions. Please respond:

Q1 Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

There are a lot of "I's" in response to Q1 "What is it that has no books to read, or 'self improving' to do?"

Also the response to Q7 - "What is it that was creating a static illusion?"

When you say

I've asked other guides to view and comment.

what was it that did the asking?

We can do this all day.

I don't know what other language to use here. This one will try to use less "I"s in the concepts that are put in this reply

When the illusion of a separate self is created there seems to be an intent of doing. The separate self seems to judge and compare and generate all kinds of tasks that need doing. These are all imaginary and may or may not actually happen. Reading and searching is on the task list as well as "improving". The separate self is born of illusion and wraps itself in layers of more illusion. The observation is the separate self wants things to always be the same, hence the static illusion. But the world seems to change all the time and the illusion has to be rebuilt.

To see through this is to be freed from continually rebuilding the illusion.

When you say

I've asked other guides to view and comment.

what was it that did the asking?

We can do this all day.

I don't know what other language to use here. This one will try to use less "I"s in the concepts that are put in this reply

Bravissimo. This is usually the point where we all start talking pronoun-free for a while, till it wears off. ;)

Hey there,

This is the part where experiential enquiry bumps uglies with bureaucracy. Please be patient.

While we’re waiting, let's share a forensic moment about this process:

You and I (...what are they...?) have walked around in circles for a while already, on the lookout for that sign that isn't recognised til it appears. As the no-thing holding this end of our communal stick, there has been no single event but increasing clarity, dropping of tension and increasing confidence in the responses coming back from the other end there.

As an educator, I understand that this could be evidence of plain old study, mirroring or even osmosis, but as a long-term (yet undisciplined!) student of Truth and, of late, Jed McKenna, I know it doesn’t matter. In the words of Mooji, “The needle is in. The mind may flop about for a bit, but the medicine will do its job.” It cannot not do its job.

Only you can really know where you're at. While imperfect, the process is useful for both participants (which is why I did that and now do this) but I can see from your posts that you already grok that the only validation that truly matters here (irony noted) is your own.

From this side, my enthusiasm to participate has been greatly aided by mentally scrubbing the term “spiritual” from all references to this unTruth-expunging process, giving it a clinical, unfiltered clarity. This isn’t mystical, it’s real science, unfettered by neither god nor untested premiss.

There is no gate and to destroy that whole idea is to insert a trace algorithm into the thought that thought there ever was one. Twist and turn as it may, it can never, ever escape the process, the expanding field of focused awareness, that is inexorably raising the houselights in what has has long been the dark province of fear.

Jed wrote that, “Duality is a tangled forest in which many self-styled freedom seekers wield the machete of discrimination with all the effect of a butter knife.” I may not wield a machete, yet, but I’m grateful for Ilona's process, that is helping to sharpen this butter knife... to the point where I’m up in the lookout, eyes peeled for my white whale, into which I know it must be plunged.

I am exceptionally grateful also for your participation in this process and wish for you whatever it is you wish for your…self.

6 times out of 10, thoughts insist there must be Some_Thing that is aware
3 times out of 10, thoughts recognize Some_Thing does not exist, and so there must be No_Thing that is aware
1 time out of 10, awareness just is

...yes...but... thought KNOWS jack. thought works with memory, not raw experience. it builds castles in the clouds...bypassing thought: what does DIRECT EXPERIENCE suggest, without inference?


"Watch out for that first step, doc. It's a doozy!" - Bugs Bunny

I agree, thoughts are only of concepts. Words are only concepts. Direct experience is through awareness before judgement, before concepts, before anything is written.

Let me rewrite this answer:

1.How does it feel to see through the illusion of a separate self?

It feels like the separate self has nothing to do. The separate self has no books to read, no ‘self improving’ to do. The separate self has nothing to search for. This is good since it did not know what it was searching for in the first place.

I still need to use the concept of a separate self to communicate with the perceived fellow entites around me. When someone asks, "What did you do over the weekend?" I need to be able to answer in a way that does not alienate me like " I went to the fair" not " The awareness felt the shape of a wind storm"

Hmmm... I had to think about it some, but like your re-response to the question. I (which is the term of convenience for the non-entity that appears to be marshalling the words together in this post) agree totally that seeing through the illusion and the illusion dropping away, while apparently aspects of the same phenomena, are not necessarily simultaneous and has not been the case here either.

And indeed, how would one continue to function or even exist in society spouting the kind of
mystical sounding rubbish we've been making fun of?

I think that we've made enough disclaimers about the dissonance between reality and linguistic convention throughout this process that we (the term for the paired exchange occurring in this thread specifically, but alluding also to any who make this journey in this forum) shouldn't need to do this anymore...

But hey, just killing time here... :)


"Watch out for that first step, doc. It's a doozy!" - Bugs Bunny

I have been giving some more consideration to this question:

Please explain in full what this illusion is and how it works from your own experience.

It seem the first three years or so of life I survived with pure awareness. I only say this because I have no memories of this period yet apparently I made my needs known. Maybe my awareness was not so big, more related to basic needs, but it was there. Then as the (I will call it) mind developed I was able to create memories and compare current objects to my memories of objects and project these memories into the anticipation of future objects. This is where the "I" began. The "I" was another object that I could remember and project into the future. It really is not much different than other objects. All are imaginary since they exist in my memory and future projection. The mind tries to predict the movement/actions of objects. Tries to solidify the relationship of this object to that object. The main difference being is that this object called "I" seems to be the nexus of my sensual awareness, so it seems more intimate and therefore more important somehow.

I like your description.

Now, Knabo my friend, even though we have satisfied all the established Q&A pathways of this process, I feel suddenly moved to to ask you a final question. Please get real quiet and look inward with this question to light the way in:

"What's missing?"

What's missing?

I have let this question float for a few days. It seems there is an answer but I can not put it into words.

From the opening page:

a global movement of people helping others to see through the illusion of self

The self is illusion, but what is doing the seeing?

As far as the purpose of this discussion, the opening of the awareness to the illusion, this is complete. What could possibly be missing?

There does seem to be a gap between seeing through the illusion of the separate self and full awareness of life living itself. I realize as soon as I ask the question, "What's next?" that the step will show itself, or not, when appropriate.