seeking guidance

[jake711]

Here is what is perceived right now:
There is a screen, two hands typing on a keyboard, the sensations of breathing and a beating in the chest, blinking.
The sound of the keys when pressed, the sound of a breath going in and out.
Muffled sounds of the city mix with the hum of the refrigerator, or are they one?
The sensation of touch , the sensation of warmth.

Thinking happening. Observing happening. Thinking of the pointing exercises happening. Letting go. Looking.
Still, simple looking.
What is there, right here, right now?

Everything (every thing) appears in this.
All is this.
A "me?" An “I?"
Thoughts OF a “me”, of an “I”.
That is all there is to identity.

Thinking of “my problems” happening, right now.

Clarity: All problems are problems of relationship.
Are problems real, when there is no one who can have a relationship with no one else?
Is there a problem when there is only this, not this & that?
Their realness only appears to be real.
There are no problems. Just events, happening - by themselves.

Back to looking. A drive, a passion to see, to find.
Again, there is nobody to be found.

Can an old belief get reinstated, when it’s seen that it’s just that, an old belief?
Can something once seen, be made unseen again?
NO.
Absolutely not.

Doubtful thoughts still arise in THIS.
The willingness to look more and deeper.
Look!
This nothingness is "open."
Amazing.

[smudge]

Thanks,

Thats great hearing about what IS present, a lot hey!

This nothingness is "open."
Amazing.

Yes!!


When the “I” has been seen through, fully and completely, what's left? are there any doubts at what has been SEEN, not conceptualised but SEEN?

Look froward to hearing

[jake711]

When the “I” has been seen through, fully and completely, what's left? are there any doubts at what has been SEEN, not conceptualised but SEEN?

There is nothing.
An open nothing.

It is seen that there is no purpose (in life).
Thoughts of hopelessness and despair arise, for no one (?).
An uncomfortable feeling in the body. Low energy.

An abyss.
Empty.
Open.
Wide.

There is no doubt per se but thoughts of doubt, in waves.
Stories collapse as soon as they come up.
Yet, they keep coming up.

“I” cannot claim to have certainty on seeing THIS.

More looking. A feeling of “being between the chairs” arises in this.
More looking.

[smudge]

What would it look like AND how would it feel if there were no doubt and you 'got it' (your words from an earlier post)?

Just say what comes right now........

[jake711]

Hard to say.
It probably be the same.
Just without thoughts of doubt happening.

[jake711]

just this.

[jake711]

cannot find ANY words to describe THIS.

[smudge]

I asked:
What would it look like AND how would it feel if there were no doubt and you 'got it'

You said:

Just without thoughts of doubt happening.

sounds like you need more time to answer my question more fully, thats fine, best to be thorough here as its around expectations versus reality, sounds like what you expected isn't what is happening and therefore it can't be authentic, that sound about it?

Look forward to hearing more...Smudge

[jake711]

What would it look like AND how would it feel if there were no doubt and you 'got it'

I am struggling with the question as it is hypothetical in nature but I try to answer as best as I can:

The thoughts about a “me getting it” or this being anything to “get” would come to a halt or die off, I assume.
The energy of “waiting for some kind of event to happen” would dissolve.
It would be seen that this is it, that this is enough and therefore this energy would lose momentum.
The question of “how would it feel?” I cannot answer, really. My best shot would be: I don’t know.
I don’t know anything.

All of this is conceptualizing about something which is thought ( by no one) to be not (yet) clear here and carry expectations in themselves.

There is a sense of simplicity in this entire investigation.
The looking itself will reveal more, or not!
It’s not in anyone’s hands to see this, or not seer this!

...sounds like what you expected isn't what is happening and therefore it can't be authentic, that sound about it?

You hit the nail on the head, Smudge!
But expectations are just that: expectations.
Now, it is seen clearly that the expectation at the core is “Seeing” and “Clarity.”
What remains if these concepts fall away, too?
Can they be dropped? Who “owns“ them in the space, in this open emptiness?
Who needs an answer?
MORE LOOKING.

[smudge]

Jake, this is great,

Now, it is seen clearly that the expectation at the core is “Seeing” and “Clarity.”
What remains if these concepts fall away, too?

But expectations are just that: expectations.

The thoughts about a “me getting it” or this being anything to “get” would come to a halt or die off, I assume.
The energy of “waiting for some kind of event to happen” would dissolve.

Is there fear present? I hear you do see and it also sounds like there is doubt (which you have just seen through above) and now it sounds like we have hit fear, an important stage, lets hear from the fear, turn towards and listen and write. You could begin by writing 'i fear that.....see what comes....

We will work with what comes up with kindness and Direct experience, but for now just give the free fear a voice.

With Kindness,
Smudge x

[jake711]

I fear that…
…all there will remain is emptiness and vastness (which appears rather intimidating than “freeing.”)
…I cannot function in “my personal and professional life”, and that all “drive to DO will stop.” (it definitely has for now.)
…this body/mind will end up on the streets/in the psychiatry.
…”I” kind of “threw my live away”
… this recognition will effect my relationship with my beloved wife and that she will leave me.
…“others” don’t want to be around me, work with me because of the way “I am (not anymore).”
…I will not be able to make friends here (in the US) because all there is, is emptiness/vastness…something that clearly is enough in itself (-in it’s emptiness.)


All these fears are thoughts appearing in this, and they come at a staggering pace and run on automatic, screaming for attention!
Thoughts say: “There is no way that you were not in charge before the seeing!” (THERE IS AND NEVER HAS BEEN A YOU.)

The realization of things being what they are and happening by themselves arose gradually, it seems.
I see the stupidity and back-ward-ness of all this, yet these thoughts appear in a very “convincing” way.
That’s as best as I can put it. A total mind fuck! (Excuse my french.)
A thought havoc!

It’s almost like one of the characters in the Matrix movie, the one who wants to go back into the dream, back into the illusion …
with all it’s polarity, drama, success and failure.
Except here, there is no one to go back to anywhere.
Emptiness.
You wrote (in an earlier post) that IT is also full (or that there is fullness).
Unfortunately that is not the way it is experienced/seen here.

I say it again: There is a clear seeing that the dynamic of seeking has built layers of expectations (that seem to trigger fears) and now the utter simplicity of THIS does not seem enough-for no one.
Doesn’t make a lot of sense, I know… but it’s as best as I can put it.


Thank you for your help, smudge.
You guided me in seeing that “there is no one.”
I appreciate your time and patience.
Now, there’s a lot of “cleaning up” that has to happen, it seems.

[jake711]

Ps.: sorry for the typos!

[smudge]

Dearest Jake,

Please allow me to accompany you until we are through, is that OK?

So, the fear is trying to protect you from disappearing into a nihilistic vacuum where you will go mad, become totally inactive, alone and ineffective. Now, thank the fear for offering such a lot of protection (actually do this)....let me know what fears response is. Can you give permission for the fear to go now? (if you think this is all a bit dualistic, just humour me and go with it, nihilism is dualistic too!)

Lets keep moving slow and kind, no rush, it's all happening just as it needs to.

Much kindness

Smudge

[jake711]

Thank you for accompanying me until we're done (whatever that means).
Right now there's a lot of confusion and yes, fear. I kindly ask it what it is it is protecting, to reveal its purpose and will report back tomorrow.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[smudge]

I am glad we can stay together until we are through Jake.

Fears purpose seems clear. Now, it is about saying thank you with much kindness and understanding and seeing if the fear is still needed. If not bow to it and give it permission to go.

Warmth,
Smudge