New registrant seeks Guide ☺️

[Steve101]

Hi Theta, you seem to naturally go to DE now, excellent. The next pointer is my favorite….enjoy:

Palm Flipping Exercise

1. Hold your hand in front of you; palm turned down.
2. Now flip your palm over and then back over and then back over again...and so on.

Watch it very closely:

Don't go to thoughts – examine your actual experience.

Do this as many times as you like, and each time inquire:

How is the movement controlled?

Does a thought control it?

Can a ‘controller’ be found in or behind the eyes?

Can a ‘controller’ of any description be located?

How is the decision made to turn the hand over?

Now using labeled thought, give your hand the command to flip over but DO NOT act on the thought, do nothing. What happens?

Now do the same but DO NOT think about it, just have AN IMPULSE to flip the hand to the over. What happens?

Who or what chose which hand (left or right) for the exercise?

Can you find a separate individual or anything that is choosing when to turn the palm up or down?

[Theta11]

Side note: I am so appreciative of the time you volunteer to assist as my Guide.🥹

Now, to the exercise.

This one reminds me of those Headless Way exercises.

How is the movement controlled?

The movement is happening very fast.
Though the exercise is done due to my will and volition, I find no manager behind my eyes or anywhere else that’s controlling the movement

I am not thinking thoughts control the movement.

Once I start thinking he exercise the hand just turns over.

Given the thought, NOT to act, nothing happens.

Bypassing thought but acting upon IMPULSE to flip the hand….the hand flips again

Hmmmmmm.
Left or Right hand was chosen randomly/logically due to accessibility ????

Can you find a separate individual or anything that is choosing when to turn the palm up or down?

No. I cannot.
It’s as if WILL accepted the challenge and the body performed the task automatically / robotically. //_\

[Steve101]

Hi Theta,

Side note: I am so appreciative of the time you volunteer to assist as my Guide.🥹

You are very welcome. I think that we are getting close but we need to ask the tough questions now.

Though the exercise is done due to my will and volition

You THINK you have a will? What makes you THINK you have a will? The self does not exist so who owns and exercises this ‘will?’

Many come to this inquiry wondering what the benefits are. There are no benefits! Who is it going to benefit? THERE IS ONLY SEEING WHAT IS REAL. The SELF is composed of a series of thoughts around the IDEA of self. What is an IDEA…it’s a thought. In this series of thoughts there are gaps…by definition. What is there in the gaps that is ever present???

[Theta11]

You THINK you have a will? What makes you THINK you have a will? The self does not exist so who owns and exercises this ‘will?’

That’s the pitfall that keeps trapping the illusory “me”—

Knowing there’s no self in existence yet still, from habit, attributing to it powers (like will) it can’t possess.

So, living 100% from DE -direct experience,
verb-ing rather than self-ing,
Is this the key to stabilizing?

[Steve101]

Hi Theta,

So, living 100% from DE -direct experience,
verb-ing rather than self-ing,
Is this the key to stabilizing?

Even after awakening old patterns can persist. It sounds like you are looking for absolutes (“100% DE) of which there are none. These thoughts come from the perspective of a thought generated self that is looking for benefits. Is this true?

The self WANTS to SEE but reality just IS without selfish desire.

When you drop the quest for knowing and just LOOK….knowing arrives.

How do we KNOW what is real and what is not real?

The false self would like nothing more than to finally discover the formula and then point back at it and say, ‘yes that’s it, that’s the way.’

When it does come, it will come as a realisation, a deep knowing minus the labels and conceptual understanding. What is a realisation? What is a deep knowing?

[Theta11]

Got a notice of a reply but all I see is your post from this morning that I responded to.

Though there was a notice I don’t see anything new from you.
Not do
I see my reply from this morning.

I’m a bit confused.

[Steve101]

I don’t see a reply to my last post. Can you take another look please.

[Theta11]

No prob. I will repost it.

Have had issues getting back to the forum all day after receiving error messages about the SERVER //

…perspective of a thought generated self that is looking for benefits. Is this true?

I know this is not true.
Yes. Old patterns are still present.

The self WANTS to SEE but reality just IS without selfish desire.

I get it that reality just is

drop the quest for knowing and just LOOK….knowing arrives

Doing more LOOKING now.

How do we KNOW what is real and what is not real?

At this point I’m unsure.

[Steve101]

Hi Theta, there seems to have been problems with the forum all day. I’ll post tomorrow.

[Theta11]

Very well.

[Steve101]

The self WANTS to SEE but reality just IS without selfish desire.

I get it that reality just is

Do you get it?

Tell me what reality is?

A lot of people think that they ‘look’ out at the world. Are they really looking out at the world or does light just enter the eye and is then converted into signals that the brain then converts in ‘neutral data? It kind of sounds like ‘seeing’ just happens without a self being involved doesn’t it. So if you are not really looking out at the world does that mean that there is actually ‘no thing’ doing the looking?

When you look at a tree, do you need to hear the words in your head ‘Oh that’s a tree?’ or is there just the visual cognition/experience of all the attributes of a thing that once upon a time was given the label ‘tree.’

What is the difference between KNOWING and THINKING? Does the illusion of self KNOW or is it just made up of thought?

With your new understanding of what happens when we look, try just allowing ‘seeing’ to happen, allow the world to just BE without mental manipulation. Was there any evidence of a self anywhere? Do some feelings arise?

[Theta11]

Click POST REPLY and nothing happens … I’m back after an after only a few tries but the forum is still wonky.

When I said I get it that reality just is without selfish desire, I meant that reality is simply an appearance but we tend to overlay it with emotions and our personal stories.


As for what reality is, yes, the description you gave sounds like ‘seeing’ just happens without a self being involved.
My viewpoint is less about “looking out” at a world and more about seeing the world spring up within me. As consciousness I’m part and parcel of everything around me.
It still feels like someone is having the experience.


I look at a tree and grok the full visual experience without having to think about it.


The difference between KNOWING and THINKING? Knowing is instant.Thinking is a time consuming process.
As for allowing ‘seeing’ to happen without mental manipulation.

Recently I’ve practiced more with DE ‘seeing’ without focus on a person doing the ‘seeing’.
Feelings arise that I’m turning into a robot./__/

[Steve101]

When I said I get it that reality just is without selfish desire, I meant that reality is simply an appearance but we tend to overlay it with emotions and our personal stories

If the illusion of self were a thinking iceberg then the personal stories are the tip, what’s below the surface e.g. emotions are what happen when we feel our ‘thinking’.

It still feels like someone is having the experience

Let’s look more closely at this ‘someone.’

You already know that this ‘someone’ is made up of thought right? If she is not made up of thought, what is she made up of?

Thoughts come and go one after another and there are plenty of them, we can agree on that yes? There are gaps in between thoughts, if this ‘someone’ is made up of thought then does this someone temporarily cease to be in between thoughts or do you frantically grab for another thought to keep her alive? Is this someone then actually alive or just a facade covering endless peace and knowing?

We spend our lives trying to fathom who we are or find our real selves or improve our old selves. I spent my life asking the wrong questions. I should really have been exploring ‘what’ I am and not ‘who.’

Look at these questions and provide answers but then look at your own answers and ask ‘is that true’ you seem to keep going back to what you already know or THINK is the truth.

Homework: Have you read ‘the gateless gate crashers?’ If you haven’t please read through it (it’s not long) and see if anything resonates. Also, try and put more full stops in your thinking and less commas, this will give you more space for insight to arise.

So many fear the death of this ‘someone’ when they come here but how can something that doesn’t exist and never did die? You are not going to lose something, you are just going to be aware of something else.

Enjoy. Have a great day.

[Theta11]

Right-o.
Thought is not continuous. There are gaps. There is not a someone that’s actually alive.

Yes. There’s a steady succession of thoughts.

Yes. The “who” is part of the illusion. “What” we are is a better question.

Please clarify: I’m not sure what you mean by /try and put more full stops in your thinking and less commas./

I have not read ‘the gateless gate crashers’ but just downloaded and will read.
I will try to reply when I’m done. Perhaps the server situation will be better then.

Best regards
Theta

[Steve101]

Please clarify: I’m not sure what you mean by /try and put more full stops in your thinking and less commas./

Even after awakening thought with content can still happen, old residual patters can reappear and doesn’t need to be a problem as long as you see it for what it is…just thinking (why do so many people take their own thinking so seriously?). As soon as we learned language, language (label) based thought started to appear in our heads. The problem isn’t our thinking (if we see it for what it is) the problem is our thinking about thinking. If you just had a thought with a full stop at the end of it and it just passed in and out of consciousness that would be ok but many keep thinking about their thinking. In other words instead of a full stop they just ad a comma and turn a single carriage thought into an entire train.

Take your time over the next questions and even look at your own answers to the following questions and ask, ‘is that true?.’

There is no self, no doer, no controller and there never has been.

Is this true?

Is it clear?

If anything is not clear, what is not clear?