Unsure what this is?

[Stacyg888]

Were your eyes closed? Really go to the sensation with the eyes closed. With the eyes closed, how do you know where the hand ends and the steering wheel begins? Is it a thought superimposing the visual of a hand? What is there in DE without that thought?

Yes, eyes closed. I could tell where hands end and steering wheel begins without thought because I have nerve endings in my hands that I can sense with. Maybe I am not understanding this right.

I also tried the exercise in bed, sensing where my body was and what was bed - but I think I fell asleep and started dreaming because my body and the bed became one. Lol. That hasn't happened again.

Does this sensation that appears to you as a separating line have a location? What is this location with respect to/relative to?

The location is the knowing of where my body ends from what I can physically feel.

I'm not sure I understand where we are going with this. I don't seem to be progressing. I do enjoy the exercise of feeling a lie or feeling the lightness. I think I can become better at that one.

Often subconsciously the ego structure is scared of even experiencing lightness because it has identified with contraction for so long, so there is a lot of resistance, which appears as another layer of contraction. Like an onion, its like contraction followed by lightness of seeing, followed by fear of seeing, followed by lightness of seeing, where the fear gets smaller and smaller by every layer, until seeing fully takes over.

Thank you for this explanation, that is helpful!

[ankitawho]

Hi Stacy,

Our practice in DE is radical. It includes ALL concepts, ALL beliefs.

Yes, eyes closed. I could tell where hands end and steering wheel begins without thought because I have nerve endings in my hands that I can sense with.

What are these nerve endings you speak of, in DE?
What is the DE of nerve endings in terms of the only 6 things that constitute DE:
- Seeing
- Hearing
- Sensing
- Tasting
- Smelling
- Thoughts Arising (but not their content)

Do you feel there is anything other than Direct Experience..? That "nerve endings" lie outside of DE? Who is saying that? Is that a thought?

Nerve endings too (like everything) is a concept, that is supposed to explain how reality works. I invite you to start questioning these ingrained beliefs as oversimplified explanations for an incomprehensible, infinite reality.

I don't seem to be progressing. I do enjoy the exercise of feeling a lie or feeling the lightness. I think I can become better at that one.

You are progressing, we are questioning blind spots. Its wonderful you have found a flow with that exercise, that one in itself can unravel absolutely everything for you, with no other pointer ever needed.

We will try boundary exploration one more time after this, and if you still feel stuck, we can move on a diff exercise and come back around to this later.

[Stacyg888]

Hi Ankita,

Can you please take me through another DE example, maybe something like watching TV or doing something, rather than an object like an apple?

To me, DE is just labelling feedback from my senses without the usual running commentary of thoughts.

What are these nerve endings you speak of, in DE?
What is the DE of nerve endings in terms of the only 6 things that constitute DE:

I'm not sure how to answer this. I suppose nerve endings are sensations, touch.

Do you feel there is anything other than Direct Experience..? That "nerve endings" lie outside of DE? Who is saying that? Is that a thought?

Other than DE is the Me who is experiencing everything. I keep coming back to my original question of who is doing this? It still feels very much like that's Me. And Me is more than just a thought, Me is just about everything. How do I get past this?

[ankitawho]

Other than DE is the Me who is experiencing everything. I keep coming back to my original question of who is doing this? It still feels very much like that's Me. And Me is more than just a thought, Me is just about everything. How do I get past this?

As long as there is an "object" out there, there will be a "subject", a "you" in here. Looking at the object then becomes important, and is not something we can bypass.

You don't have to hesitate with any answers, that's the beauty of DE. You only report your own direct experience. Sometimes the DE is an "i-dont-know" thought... that's the best one :)

I'd like to ask you to look at the resistance of pursuing the object exercises, and sit with this question: Why is there a need to shift away from them? What would "progress" look like, that is not happening according to the mind? Who is saying these things in your DE?

Can you please take me through another DE example, maybe something like watching TV or doing something, rather than an object like an apple?

Let's try this one:
Sit quietly for about 20 minutes and notice the arising thoughts. Just let them appear as they appear. Try your best to COMPLETELY ignore what they are saying and just notice how they appear without you doing anything at all.

Now, please write down 5 consecutive thoughts here.

From DE, answer:
Where are they coming from and going to?
Did you do anything to make a particular thought or thoughts appear? Could you have done anything to make a different thought appear at that exact moment instead?
Can you predict your next thought?
Can you select from a range of thoughts to have only pleasant thoughts? Can you choose not to have painful, negative or fearful thoughts?
Can you pick and choose any kind of thought?
Is it possible to prevent a thought from appearing?
It seems that thought has some logical ordered appearance, but look carefully and just notice if there is an organised sequence? Or is that just another thought that says ‘these thoughts are in sequence’ or “they take content from previous thought”, or that ‘one thought follows another thought’?

Remember to answer each question one by one. Take your time :)

[ankitawho]

Excuse the "Now, please write down 5 consecutive thoughts here" in quotes please :) Meant for it to be in blue.

[Stacyg888]

Why is there a need to shift away from them? What would "progress" look like, that is not happening according to the mind? Who is saying these things in your DE?

The need comes from the practical side of me where everything needs a purpose or a reason. If there was no subject and no object, it would all just be. Progress looks like just being. As for who is saying these things, if it's not Me then I have no idea.

]From DE, answer:
Where are they coming from and going to?
Did you do anything to make a particular thought or thoughts appear? Could you have done anything to make a different thought appear at that exact moment instead?
Can you predict your next thought?
Can you select from a range of thoughts to have only pleasant thoughts? Can you choose not to have painful, negative or fearful thoughts?
Can you pick and choose any kind of thought?
Is it possible to prevent a thought from appearing?
It seems that thought has some logical ordered appearance, but look carefully and just notice if there is an organised sequence? Or is that just another thought that says ‘these thoughts are in sequence’ or “they take content from previous thought”, or that ‘one thought follows another thought’?

Remember to answer each question one by one. Take your time :)

Thoughts come and go, seemingly from nowhere. I can direct my mind to think of a certain topic but not predict what the next thought would be or make a specific thought appear at any given time. I can choose to have happier thoughts but not specific thoughts, or maybe just one specific thought then the next one is unpredictable again- eg pink elephant makes me think of a pink elephant but I don't know what the next thought will be. I can't prevent a thought, no. For a short time thoughts might be a little ordered but never for long - I actually see them as ordered, not just a thought that they are.

But overall, I am starting to see that I have very little control over my thoughts, maybe less than 5%. Now what? Haha

[ankitawho]

Hi Stacy,

Please really write a series of 5 consecutive thoughts. When you don't, you answer from memory and we want to be as raw and direct as possible.

For a short time thoughts might be a little ordered but never for long - I actually see them as ordered, not just a thought that they are.

Once again, is there an ordered sequence, or is there a thought that says "This is an ordered sequence, although not for long"?
Who is the decider? Is the decider a thought?
Please really write down the thoughts and then look:
Does this deciding thought know the content of the previous thoughts? If not, how is it deciding and declaring so confidently?


Please LOOK.

[Stacyg888]

Series of thoughts:

I put too much water in my oats, it's a bit sloppy.
I'm tired because I woke up too early, I'll have a nap soon.
Then I can go for a run.
What else should I do this morning?
I'm glad I don't have to work this weekend.

Once again, is there an ordered sequence, or is there a thought that says "This is an ordered sequence, although not for long"? Who is the decider? Is the decider a thought?

The decider could be a thought , sure. I am willing to acknowledge that now.

Does this deciding thought know the content of the previous thoughts? If not, how is it deciding and declaring so confidently?/quote] Yes, I think the deciding is aware of the previous thoughts, it just heard them.

Ankita, I am not sure I understand how this is helping. Since I had more success with the truth/lie exercise, are you able to give me some questions that will help me Look that way?

Thank you. Have a great weekend.

[ankitawho]

Yes, I think the deciding is aware of the previous thoughts, it just heard them.

No *thinking* about it: please LOOK. Is a thought capable of "hearing"?

Since I had more success with the truth/lie exercise, are you able to give me some questions that will help me Look that way?

While we must return to these questions eventually, we can try out some more Truth/Lie exercises. Please try this one:

Pick up an object around you, maybe a mug, a snack or your phone. LOOK into your experience while doing so. Then read out loud these statements to you one by one, and after each, watch for any sensations in your experience:

1. I read this exercise, I decided to do it, I moved my hand to this object, I used my fingers to pick it up, I felt for any sensations, I decided to report my experience and I used my fingers to type and do so.

2. I read this exercise, I decided to do it, I allowed the body to pick up the object and report the experience.

3. I read this exercise, there was an intention to try out anything to see the no-self, so the body moved to pick up the object and report the experience.

4. There was an intention to try out anything to see the no-self, so the exercise was read, the body moved to see it through.

5. The exercise was read, and the body moved to see it through.

Which of these FEELS the lightest?
Which of these FEELS the heaviest?

[Stacyg888]

Is a thought capable of "hearing"?

No.

Thank you for the exercises! I will try those out and report back.

[Stacyg888]

The first feels heaviest and the last feels lightest. I have no idea what any of that means though.

[ankitawho]

This exercise talked about control, and what felt the lightest was the statement that suggested the least control. What does that mean to you?

The decider could be a thought , sure. I am willing to acknowledge that now.

And does a thought have the power to decide?
If it doesn't, then what does this coupled with the felt lightness of the previous exercise indicate? Where does that point you?

[Stacyg888]

What does that mean to you?

That letting go of control is the way to go, it's a better/lighter way of living. I'm not sure what that means in the context of trying to see that there is no self though.

And does a thought have the power to decide? If it doesn't, then what does this coupled with the felt lightness of the previous exercise indicate? Where does that point you?

I don't expect it does. I don't know how to answer this question. I am a bit confused about all this. But here's what I'll say:

Thoughts come and go through me, they are not me, the least control in those thoughts, the better I feel. As to what that points to, I really don't have a clue. I expect the answer should be there is no me to think but I'm not seeing that yet.

[ankitawho]

I see Stacy, thanks for the answer.

Lets try this exercise to explore the sense of self:

Try not thinking about the sense of self, but by FEELING it. Scan your body to see where 'you' seem to live in it. Is it behind the eyes? Is it near the chest area?
If you are able to locate it, keep the focus of attention on the sense of self and inquire:
Does the sense of self have a location?
Does the sense of self have a shape or a size?
Does the sense of self say or communicate anything?
If the answer is yes, how does the sense do this exactly?
Does the sense of self have any characteristics or attributes?
What is the sense of self ‘made of’? An image? Sound? Taste? Smell? Sensation? Thought?

[Stacyg888]

Scan your body to see where 'you' seem to live in it. Is it behind the eyes? Is it near the chest area?

At first I sensed I live behind my eyes (I have often thought of humans as little beings living in a postbox looking out) then I thought in my heart/chest area but when I asked myself "am I in my chest? I got that heavy feeling which tells me no.

Does the sense of self have a location?
Does the sense of self have a shape or a size?
Does the sense of self say or communicate anything?
If the answer is yes, how does the sense do this exactly?
Does the sense of self have any characteristics or attributes?
What is the sense of self ‘made of’? An image? Sound? Taste? Smell? Sensation? Thought?

No location that I could determine.
No shape or size I could determine.
It didn't say or communicate anything.
It has no characteristics, just seemed to be everywhere and nowhere at the same time.
It seems to be made up of a thought, an idea, one I have lived with my whole life.

I am totally okay with not having a self, I don't feel attached to "Stacy". I just want to see the truth and understand how life is different after I have seen the truth. Am I getting any closer to seeing it yet?


Thanks for your help and patience, Ankita :)