GETIT!

[Matthew]

Very well.
Whatever the expectation is, let it drop. It really does not matter whether an expectation is "reasonable" or not.
Expectation=Thought will always tell "Nah. That's not 'it'".. And here we go again :-)



So it has become clear that there is just thought appearing. And it has become clear that a thinker of thought cannot be found.
The only thing which could be found in that regard is thought about a thinker.
But a thought cannot think other thoughts.
Is that clear so far?


If so, have a look at this:

So there is a wish remaining for things to be different.

‪You bet! Absolutely there is a wish for things to be different.‬

Looking for a self, we find no thing, no one.
Looking for a thinker, we find no thing, no one.

What wants things to be different?

There is thought with the content "Wish for things to be different". Sure.
But can you look a little closer here?
Is there something behind this thought, which ACTUALLY wants that?
Something which actually has that wish?

What wants things to be different?

[Kixem]

Hi Matthew,

Whatever the expectation is, let it drop. It really does not matter whether an expectation is "reasonable" or not.
Expectation=Thought will always tell "Nah. That's not 'it'".. And here we go again :-)

For Pete’s sake, how in the world then will you know if/when the truth about self has been seen??

But a thought cannot think other thoughts.
Is that clear so far?

‪A thought cannot think other thoughts. ‬

Looking for a self, we find no thing, no one.
Looking for a thinker, we find no thing, no one.

‪I don’t know how to hold these propositions. ‬

But can you look a little closer here?
Is there something behind this thought, which ACTUALLY wants that?
Something which actually has that wish?

‪No, I can’t see anything behind the thought, but what there is, for sure, is a strong, definite, unmistakable desire for things to be different. ‬

What wants things to be different?

‪What if, just what if, what I’m looking to detect/see, is really impossible to see. Just like my eyes trying to see my eyes, without a mirror? The fact that I cannot see my eyes doesn’t mean that they don’t exist. It means that it’s impossible to see them. Just saying..‬

[Matthew]

Whatever the expectation is, let it drop.

For Pete’s sake, how in the world then will you know if/when the truth about self has been seen??

It will be known. There will be no doubt.
But it will not be like ANYTHING that could be expected. It is simply beyond expectation.
It is beyond anything, you expect could happen to a "me".
Therefore, any expectation will prevent this already true simplicity from being recognised.

If you TRULY want to go through this until the end, you have to follow the pointers no matter what happens.
Be open and wide to whatever presents itself.
And one if the most important aspects within this exploration is to see expectations for what they are and, by that way, to let go of them.


How could seeing what is true already and what ALWAYS has been true suddenly change things "around you"?
There never was a self.
Not during spacious, light times. Not during difficult times.
How should the recognition of something that has always been true suddenly change how things behave?


There are "bad" things happening.
("Bad" of course just a label by thought for something that is neither bad, nor good by nature)
And these things, "good" or "bad", will keep happening no matter what.


The question is:
Do these things happen to someone?
Or do they happen to no one?

What if, just what if, what I’m looking to detect/see, is really impossible to see. Just like my eyes trying to see my eyes, without a mirror? The fact that I cannot see my eyes doesn’t mean that they don’t exist. It means that it’s impossible to see them. Just saying..‬

We are not going to argue whether eyes exist or not. That is not what this is about.
This is about following the pointers and ONLY looking at actual experience.
ALL you've learned is of no interest here whatsoever.

When looking only at actual experience..
While not relying on memory/thought.
How is it known that there are "eyes"?

[Kixem]

It will be known. There will be no doubt.
But it will not be like ANYTHING that could be expected. It is simply beyond expectation.
It is beyond anything, you expect could happen to a "me".
Therefore, any expectation will prevent this already true simplicity from being recognised.

‪Expectations provide some security and acknowledgment and reinforcement to the self..‬

If you TRULY want to go through this until the end, you have to follow the pointers no matter what happens.

‪What does that mean? What pointers? Where are the pointers?‬

And one if the most important aspects within this exploration is to see expectations for what they are and, by that way, to let go of them.

‪Yes, of course, although sometimes expectations creep in “unexpectedly” and without being noticed, and they stick and it’s hard to drop them. ‬

Fully known and understood.

The question is:
Do these things happen to someone?
Or do they happen to no one?

Ah, that’s the nut to be cracked..

We are not going to argue whether eyes exist or not. That is not what this is about.
This is about following the pointers and ONLY looking at actual experience.
ALL you've learned is of no interest here whatsoever.

‪I have learned nothing. I know nothing.Have nothing to offer in a way of wisdom.I was trying to be the devil’s advocate in order to shed some light into my own confusion. ‬

When looking only at actual experience..
While not relying on memory/thought.
How is it known that there are "eyes"?

‪My beautiful, little, seventy-year-old brain is in flames as it has gone into overdrive..‬
‪“I” is not getting it..‬
‪Please, grub (the non-existing) “me” by the neck and drag “me” to where what is to be seen is seen..Please.‬

[Kixem]

Ho Matthew,

And one if the most important aspects within this exploration is to see expectations for what they are and, by that way, to let go of them.

‪Yes, of course, although sometimes expectations creep in “unexpectedly” and without being noticed, and they stick and it’s hard to drop them. ‬

[Matthew]

When looking only at actual experience..
While not relying on memory/thought.
How is it known that there are "eyes"?

‪My beautiful, little, seventy-year-old brain is in flames as it has gone into overdrive..‬
‪“I” is not getting it..‬
‪Please, grub (the non-existing) “me” by the neck and drag “me” to where what is to be seen is seen..Please.‬

Let us approach this in a comfortable way :)

When you STOP and look at what is here right now, can you find anything more than
The seen
The heard
The smelled
The tasted
The sensed
And observed thought
?

Is there something more to actual experience?
If there is something "more" or something "else"...
How is it experienced? May it be just a thought about "something else"?

[Kixem]

When you STOP and look at what is here right now, can you find anything more than
The seen
The heard
The smelled
The tasted
The sensed
And observed thought
?

Nope. Mind is mind-ing, body is body-ing(There must be a heart beating in this right here body; I can’t hear it or sense it. A red liquid must be circulating in the aforementioned body; I can’t sense that either.)

Is there something more to actual experience?

I don’t know.

If there is something "more" or something "else"...

I don’t know.

How is it experienced? May it be just a thought about "something else"?

‪There’s no experience of anything other than as just a thought. ‬

[Matthew]

Is there something more to actual experience?

I don’t know.

If there is something "more" or something "else"...

I don’t know

If you don't know, please have a look!
Right now.
Look at what is here now.

Can ALL of experience be described with the terms
Seeing, Hearing, Tasting, Smelling, Sensation and observed Thought
?

There must be a heart beating in this right here body; I can’t hear it or sense it. A red liquid must be circulating in the aforementioned body; I can’t sense that either

Is that something which can be found in actual experience?
Or is it just thought labeling sensation as such and memory suggesting that there is something, which cannot be observed?

Could it be known right now, while only looking at direct experience, that there is a red liquid in the body?
Or would you have to rely on memory(thought) to know about that?

[Kixem]

Hi Matthew,

Can ALL of experience be described with the terms
Seeing, Hearing, Tasting, Smelling, Sensation and observed Thought
?

‪If “actual experience” means what can be acknowledged as existing/operating/true in this present moment, perceived by the five bodily senses and the mind, (what else could it mean, duh ..)and not something existing but not perceivable by the senses, then yes, all experience can be described by the senses and observed thought. ‬

Is that something which can be found in actual experience?

‪Yes, on further consideration, I do sense the heart beat at times of prolonged quietness as a periodic vibration.‬

Could it be known right now, while only looking at direct experience, that there is a red liquid in the body?
Or would you have to rely on memory(thought) to know about that?

‪Yes, both. I have to remember that there’s blood continuously circulating in my body and I have to be careful not to accidentally cut myself because the stuff is going to come out and make a bloody mess and ruin the carpet. I don’t see it (and I’m glad I don’t)but I know it’s there. ‬

[Matthew]

Very good!


To be transparent:
We are not trying to engage in reductionism here.
It is important to be clear, what actual experience is and how to look at it.
Since it provides us with a clear and sober way to look at things.
To look at things as they are and to see things as they are.


So when I ask you to look at actual experience (99% of the time, haha), I want you to go completely blank and only look at what presents itself here now.
We can observe thought, since it is no less part of experience as colour and sound.
What we are NOT interested in here, is the content of thought.



Let us go a little deeper into actual experience!
In a relaxed and joyful way.

Is that something which can be found in actual experience?

‪Yes, on further consideration, I do sense the heart beat at times of prolonged quietness as a periodic vibration.‬

Please close your eyes and go with all attention directly and deeply into that sensation.
Does this pure sensation tell anything about "heart"?
Where does the idea come from, that pure sensation has something to do with "heart"?

Is there a sensation anywhere, that tells something about "Me"?

[Kixem]

Hi Matthew,

So when I ask you to look at actual experience (99% of the time, haha), I want you to go completely blank and only look at what presents itself here now.

Thank you for the clarification. Very helpful reminder.

Does this pure sensation tell anything about "heart"?

‪No. If I had never heard of “heart”, the sensation of beating in the chest area would tell me nothing about “heart”. (But I have heard about heart, and I even have seen heart, not mine though. True, there’s some measure of deduction and inference involved, but still I cannot pretend that because I don’t see my heart(thank god!!..)there’s no heart, just some unassigned sensation..) ‬

Where does the idea come from, that pure sensation has something to do with "heart"?

‪Memory of having heard about it..‬

Is there a sensation anywhere, that tells something about "Me"?

‪No. Memory of having heard about it..and arbitrarily labeling various unclassified body sensations and responses to external stimuli as “me”..‬

[Matthew]

Very well. To deepen this, I would like you to do this nice little excercise.




Find a quiet spot and a quiet moment. Sit or lay down, close your eyes and relax. Relax.
Can you attend to sensation only? Just noticing sensation as it arises and passes?
And there is of course most of the time thought labelling sensation, giving it "meaning".


Thought will describe the situation as "You or your body lying here on a sofa"
But can you attend to sensation exclusively, not minding these labelling thoughts?

There is a sensation, thought will label it as "soft pressure against the back".
But does pure sensation tell anything about "pressure", "soft", or "back"?

Dive into sensation in a relaxed and joyful way.
Having arrived there, please have a look at these questions:



Can it be known, how tall the body is?

Does the body have a specific shape or size?

Is there a boundary between the body and the ground? Is there a ground?

Can it be known how many toes there are? Are there even toes?

Does pure sensation have a distinct location?



Please answer the questions in blue individually.
And as always: Enjoy!

[Kixem]

Hi Matthew,

Can it be known, how tall the body is?

Heck, no..so irrelevant and meaningless..

Does the body have a specific shape or size?

..an amoeba..a glob(a lump of a semi-liquid substance)..

Is there a boundary between the body and the ground? Is there a ground?

Labels..labels..concepts..(it seems everything, on its own, has substance/validity, but it loses it when one tries to impose relationship to other things, or something like that..)

Does pure sensation have a distinct location?

Hard or impossible to pinpoint.

[Matthew]

Can ALL of experience be described with the terms
Seeing, Hearing, Tasting, Smelling, Sensation and observed Thought
?

yes, all experience can be described by the senses and observed thought. ‬

Can it be known, how tall the body is?

Heck, no..so irrelevant and meaningless..

So we see that "body size" for example is the actual experience of THOUGHT, not the actual experience of sensation.
Since sensation tells nothing about body size, it is just thought telling this story.

Does pure sensation have a distinct location?

Hard or impossible to pinpoint.

So we see that "location" is the actual experience of THOUGHT, not the actual experience of sensation.
Since sensation tells nothing about location, it is just thought telling this story.

Is that clear?
Can you work with this way of expression?



If so,

What is the actual experience of "I", "me", "mine"?
What is the actual experience of "not I", "not me", "not mine"?

Seeing, Hearing, Tasting, Smelling, Sensation and observed Thought

It became clear, that "me" has nothing to do with pure sensation.
"I", "me", "mine"...
"Not I", "not me", "not mine"...
So where are and what are all these things?

Can they be seen? Where exactly is "I" in seeing?
Can they be heard? Where exactly is "I" in hearing?
Or are they thought content?



Looking forward to your reply!

[Kixem]

Hi Matthew,

What is the actual experience of "I", "me", "mine"?
What is the actual experience of "not I", "not me", "not mine"?

‪I don’t know. I can’t find an actual experience, based on the definition we’ve already agreed upon, of all these terms, “I”, “me”, etc. There’s no sensation connected or pointing to any of these words.‬

So where are and what are all these things?

Words. Personal pronouns. Existing in thought.

Can they be seen?

No.

Where exactly is "I" in seeing?

Nowhere. Seeing cannot see “I”.

Can they be heard?

No.

Where exactly is "I" in hearing?
Or are they thought content?

Clearly.