The Gate

Hi Michael

Im glad that I came to the forums to be guided in the right direction.

Me too! :-)

About the six further questions . . .

Sure you can ask the questions. I would like to take 2 or 3 days to let things settle before I answer them.

No problem at all - There is no rush.
The six questions are also part of the guidance, and may weed-out any small areas that you may be unclear on.
I can mention more about the 'further things to examine' after the questions (and confirming you've seen 'no self' for certain).

Do you still have realizations? I know this is different for everybody but is there sort of a timeframe for when things get settled?

Every realisation is different, as is every path that people take.
Yes, I still have realisations but the things I am looking at right now in my own path are very subtle (for me) and are taking me some focus and time to get a handle on.

Yes, this is the same with emotions right? Last night some unpleasant emotions came up, but then i checked and there was no self making them and no self to change them.

Nice.
Well this is for further examination, but let's consider - What is an emotion?
My take on it would be that it is a sensation (which is not linked to an inherent 'I' or a 'body') coupled with further thoughts.
The further thoughts would be 'I am feeling this' and 'I am feeling this emotion because (and a reason)'.
Pleasant emotions would have a positive reason, and unpleasant emotions would have a negative reason.
Notice perhaps the two subtle thoughts - The sensations are happening to ME, and the sensations are happening BECAUSE.
There may still be a subtle belief that there is something 'here', a mechanism through which things operate whereby thoughts and experiences are labelled good or bad and are converted into pleasant and unpleasant emotions somehow.
Does that make sense?

There is some fear of falling in some kind of void or becoming apathic, but yeah thats just thoughts

There can be, and this can be because of 'pushing too hard' to one particular side.
We go from 'There IS a me' to 'This is NOT a me' and we push the 'NO ME' too hard.
But notice carefully, 'There is no me to do something' is also a thought isn't it?
'There is no me to to anything' the same . . . notice how thoughts cause all the mayhem!

Xain ♥

I can mention more about the 'further things to examine' after the questions (and confirming you've seen 'no self' for certain).

Great!

But let's consider - What is an emotion?
My take on it would be that it is a sensation (which is not linked to an inherent 'I' or a 'body') coupled with further thoughts.
The further thoughts would be 'I am feeling this' and 'I am feeling this emotion because (and a reason)'.
Pleasant emotions would have a positive reason, and unpleasant emotions would have a negative reason.

Yes, i see its not my emotion but just sensations in the body either negative or positive, and the mind labels them? I see why a stronge sensation + label can create this sense of "my" feeling/emotion.

and the sensations are happening BECAUSE.

Aha yes thats happening sometimes! Thoughts came up like " this emotion is coming up because I am going through this process. This suggests a seperate self again thats going through the process of seeing no self lol.
I see this can be tricky, and requires focus to see.

There may still be a subtle belief that there is something 'here', a mechanism through which things operate whereby thoughts and experiences are labelled good or bad and are converted into pleasant and unpleasant emotions somehow.
Does that make sense?

Yes this makes sense.

There can be, and this can be because of 'pushing too hard' to one particular side.
We go from 'There IS a me' to 'This is NOT a me' and we push the 'NO ME' too hard.
But notice carefully, 'There is no me to do something' is also a thought isn't it?
'There is no me to to anything' the same . . . notice how thoughts cause all the mayhem!

Aha, yes i see.

Thanks again for the clear explanations Xain!

No problem at all.
Let things settle, and when you are ready I'll ask the six questions.
Like I say, the questions themselves are also part of the guidance and may bring up areas where you might not be 100% and which we can look into together.

Xain ♥

Hi Xain,

I think im ready for the questions now, things are more clear now.

There is just one fear thats there today/yesterday. Fear of becoming lazy, no ambitions/goals which is causing some resistance to "fully let go".

Fear of becoming lazy, no ambitions/goals which is causing some resistance to "fully let go".

So perhaps it's the idea that 'There no me to do anything', 'There's no me to achieve anything' - You are clinging more to 'one side' of the realisation (and there is nihilism or denial as a result).

Why not have some more happy considerations - There is no 'me' to stop things . . . and life might move more freely.
There is no me NOT to do something. There is no me NOT to have ambitions. There is no me NOT to achieve things.
This is no me NOT to let go.

Ambitions will still appear. Things will still be achieved. Life will still go on. What is the 'YOU' that can do it wrong?
The burden of the belief of a little self, apart from life having to force things will be eased (or dropped).

Here are the first three of the six questions:

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience and understanding. Describe it fully as you see it now.

3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference (if anything) between now and before you started the guidance?

Xain ♥

So perhaps it's the idea that 'There no me to do anything', 'There's no me to achieve anything' - You are clinging more to 'one side' of the realisation (and there is nihilism or denial as a result).

Why not have some more happy considerations - There is no 'me' to stop things . . . and life might move more freely.
There is no me NOT to do something. There is no me NOT to have ambitions. There is no me NOT to achieve things.
This is no me NOT to let go.

Ambitions will still appear. Things will still be achieved. Life will still go on. What is the 'YOU' that can do it wrong?
The burden of the belief of a little self, apart from life having to force things will be eased (or dropped).

That fear is no longer present today.
I'm still doing the same things as normal, going to work, training, cooking, cleaning the house.
Yes everything is less forced and freely!

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

No i've looked at this from all possible angles and there was never a separate entity found.
Nobody making choices, doing things, no thinker.

There was the belief in a separate self before yes, a real hardcore belief. But now I look back there never was this real control there there was always trying to force something, causing suffering.

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience and understanding. Describe it fully as you see it now.

It starts at a young age when other people tell you that you are this body that can think walk around and make choices.
Also thoughts starting with an "I" seem more powerful. For example the thought: I am not good a enough can have a big impact when its believed. Believed by who? Thats hard to describe it seems paradoxical.

When I started my spiritual search at 16 years old, i guess there where some misunderstandings by misreading teachings causing in some hardcore believes. A belief like: You can becoming enlightend, you can make progress, you can have peace cause me to belief that there is a seperate self that can reach that, and had to do certain actions to get there.
I think thats what started that restlessness that was always there. I could not sit normally on a couch or hang out with friends. There was always this urge in the back of my mind searching for some insight searching or for progress.
So there was always a resistance against this present moment because it was not good enough.
Also trying to cling on to these rare moments of peace of mind.
Now I see there is nothing to cling on. Emotions/thoughts come and go.

The last days I notice that I can just sit on my couch and talk to friends and that urge to search is barely there anymore.

When i write this now it all seems so simple. Why couldnt i just see this before.

I'm grateful for this website and this guiding :)

3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference (if anything) between now and before you started the guidance?

It feels good, life feels more free. Connection with people around me is more closer. My eyes are wide open all the time and i'm sharper. Before the guidance there was already a shift happening. But there still was this frustation of missing things, having to make more progress. The thought of having to make some kind of jump to pass this gate.
And "fighting" against unwanted thoughts.

There are still negative thoughts sometimes but its clear that there is nobody thats producing the thoughts or nobody to block thoughts.
Seeing that thoughts come and go without the thoughts happening to somebody or somebody thats making the thoughts happen was the biggest relief. So thought storys and emotions are less sticky now. It's seen through pretty fast.

But I also understand what you mean with your question before:
Do you expect things to change?
I had expectations that where in the way of seeing clear.
These big expectations from reading so much spiritual texts where in the way.

Thanks for your replies, Michael.

Here are the last three of the six questions:

4) Was there something specific you looked into or something that was mentioned during this guidance that made you fully realise? - Was there a specific moment where you 'tipped over' into realising 'no self'?

5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control as you understand it now. What makes things happen? How does it work? What are you responsible for? Please give examples from experience if you can, and explain what you have realised.

6) Do you have anything further you would like to add?

Xain ♥

Was there something specific you looked into or something that was mentioned during this guidance that made you fully realise? - Was there a specific moment where you 'tipped over' into realising 'no self'?

It was not as what I expected, the expectation was that there would be this aha moment and everything would be clear.
Instead it was a gradual shift. But yes there where a few insights during this conversation that made me realise.

The part where we discussed thought was a realisation. I saw directly that there was no seperate self that could choose specific thoughts or block thoughts, the thoughts where completely random.

Also the part where we looked at choosing. I saw before that nobody was making choices when I've looked.
But I was stuck at not wanting to accept that everything is choiceless and we are living a robot live.
You pointed that choices are still being made, the difference is that there is no little self making these choices.

After that it became almost clear. Then there was this thoughts and ideas of having to make more progress or having to make some kind of jump over the gate.

When you said a few times, so is there a separate self? Whats next?
I realised there is not ,and there is also no self to make more progress or make a jump.

5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control as you understand it now. What makes things happen? How does it work? What are you responsible for? Please give examples from experience if you can, and explain what y

Difficult question I can not explain this clearly.
At the moment of making a decision/choice there are most of the time thoughts about it. But when the choice its made, there was nobody found that could make the choice.
I think past conditioning is responsible for a lot of choices. So for example if a good friend asks me to go out for drinks to a certain night club. There is looking at the past to see if this was fun before, looking at the current situation how im feeling.
And then a choice is made.

But sometimes its by intuition, for a example there can be a strong feeling to go outside and take a walk.
For control? There is no real control. It's just an illusion that there is a possibilty to control future situations.
Situations can be played out in the mind a 100 times. But in reality the situation will never go 100% as expected and then a lot of time there is dissapointment.
Since the shift, thoughts about situations in the future still come up. But they pass away much faster because its not so important anymore.

6) Do you have anything further you would like to add?

Not really. It feels pretty clear to me now, altough I see there is a lot of conditioning left.
Im curious for some information about what to look at after the gate.

In case doubt pops ups i just look if there is anyone behind it?


Thank you Xain for your excellent guiding.

Hi Mike

Thanks for your reply, and answering the questions.
The guides are confident you have realised 'no self' and so am I.
I will write more for you on the subjects we've discussed tomorrow.

Xain ♥

Hi once more Mike

Sorry for the delay. I am ever busy :-)
This marks the end of the current guidance. Thank you for an enjoyable conversation (and congratulations!).

When you said a few times, so is there a separate self? Whats next?
I realised there is not ,and there is also no self to make more progress or make a jump.

Yes. There is no inherent self.
But this does not dismiss the IDEA of someone making progress.
Indeed, whilst there is still suffering or still the belief that there is more to examine . . . things can still be looked into.
Nothing needs to be dismissed or rejected.

The two main areas for you after the gate are:

(4 & 5) - In relation to suffering, there is still likely to be desire and aversion to things - The constant push and pull of wanting life to be different than it is. There will still be a subtle belief that there is something 'here' that takes experiences, labels them as being negative, and unpleasant feelings can still occur because of this. This can be looked into further.

(6) - In relation to the senses, there will still be an apparent distance between the objects appearing in experience, and a subtle location where 'experience' will be appearing to happen from - This will be most prevalent in hearing and seeing.
This can also be looked into further - Note that that nothing will change - But there may be a shift to realise that there is a subtle process involved that 'generates' the assumed distance, and that no REAL distance can be found between that which is seeing, and that which is seen (taking 'seeing' as an example).

Anyway, if you are on Facebook and would like me to add you to further groups including groups for New Arrivals, Further looking, and general LU chat, please send me your name and/or facebook page link in a Private message and I'll get that sorted for you (click the red name 'Xain' and choose 'Send Private Message').

I wish you all the best for the future
Xain ♥

Hi Xain,

Sorry for the late reply.

Some doubts where coming in 2 days ago that it was not fully seen through thats why I waited with responding.

Yesterday and today im seeing clearly that these doubts where only thoughts and the only "I" that was found, was in these thought storys.

I will send you a private message with my facebook name, I would like to be in those groups.

Xain thank you again and I also wish you all the best in the future!
My gratitudes.