Learning about being guided and guide others

[blackh]

Hi Nat,

No I don't believe there is a Me controlling thoughts....

Great! It seems that one is covered for now. I'm not sure how sure you are, but if you have doubts later we can come back to it.

Looking back at the "map" of identification that you wrote...

I believe I identify with all my body, mind, thought experiences.

Are you the body or are you felt to be in the body?


Steve

[Natcola]

Steve,
I believe I am felt to feel in the body
Nat


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[blackh]

Hi Nat,

Yes, most people feel like they are 'in' the body. Is there a particular place in the body where you seem to be located?


Steve

[Natcola]

LOL!!!! I meant to write I am felt to feel in the body but I know i am not the body - sorry


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[blackh]

Hi Nat,

Cool. What do you mean by "felt to feel in the body"?


Steve

[Natcola]

Steve,
I guess I meant that I believe we have a certain program in our thoughts to identify with the body and the thoughts. However working hard to destroy that as you are helping me to do I believe...
Nat


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[blackh]

Hi Nat,

Yes, we certainly do. And I really want to assist you to see what's real and what's not. I just want to get my head around how much identification and what kind of identification you have with regard to the body.

Could you write me a summary of that, please? Not what I want to hear, but what is real for you right now.


Steve

[Natcola]

Ok. What is real for me right now:
I know I am not the body as I believe that we are part is something limitless beyond a body and thoughts.
However as much as I know this I forget this fundamental belief for me and I identify with my emotions, my body and I get into believing that pain in my "body" is real and my tiredness is real and I react according to the emotions coming in that body.
I want to remember all the time that this body is not real.
I hope I made it clearer but if not I'll try harder
Sorry Steve



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[blackh]

Hi Nat,

No need to apologise. I'm just happy to be guiding you.

I want to remember all the time that this body is not real.

The body looks real to me. How did you come to the conclusion that it's not real?


Steve

[Natcola]

Hi Steve,
Sorry. We did agree to say the body was real like let's say a cup. Cause we needed to separate real and not real.
Ok so the body is real.
What kind of identification I have with my body.
For exemple I identify with a painful body from time to time.
I identify with pleasure in my body when eating something that I liked
I identify with emotions throughout the day about myself and others.
Is this more what you were looking for? This question is not about saying what you want to hear but continue this work in the same frame of mind so I can follow you if that make sense. I am trying to be clear but obviously I am not and not answering your questions very clearly...
Nat


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

[blackh]

Hi Nat,

Sorry - I meant to reply sooner.

So let's pick an emotion - any emotion that comes up for you. Notice that there's a body sensation. Can you describe what that body sensation is, where it is, and how it feels?


Steve

[Natcola]

Hi Steve,
Ok: if I feel anxiety about a situation or someone, I will feel like a rock in my stomach and a sensation of discomfort also in the stomach.... it feels awful and increase my anxiety,
Nat


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[blackh]

Hi Nat,

Nice work describing the body sensations of anxiety!

You'll notice that anxiety comes with thoughts. There are thoughts about the body sensation ("it's awful"), and there are thoughts about the cause of the anxiety.

In anxiety (or if it doesn't come up - use any other emotion), can you find anything other than body sensations and thoughts?

What is it exactly about the body sensation that makes it awful?


Steve

[Natcola]

Hi Steve,

In anxiety (or if it doesn't come up - use any other emotion), can you find anything other than body sensations and thoughts?

I did this exercise a few time and no I can't come up with anything else than body sensations and thoughts.

What is it exactly about the body sensation that makes it awful?

It takes me away from a comfortable mental and physical zone to an uncomfortable one and keep my thoughts around that area in my body.
Nat

[blackh]

Hi Nat,

Well done! This is not the easiest thing in the world to do and you're doing great!

I did this exercise a few time and no I can't come up with anything else than body sensations and thoughts.

So there is a body sensation like a rock in the stomach, and thought stories - which are not real. Some of these thought stories are about "I" - the self. This "I" - the one who might do or have done the wrong thing - the one that bad things might happen to - is not real at that moment. It is not found in experience anywhere while the feeling of anxiety is there. Am I right about that?

But, is there an actual real "I" anywhere in the experience of anxiety?
Can a "feeler" of the anxiety be found? Or, are there just body sensations + a whole lot of thoughts talking about "I"?


Steve