In need of a guide

[Xain]

How does seeing that there is no 'I', no 'me' that has control over anything make you feel?

Xain ♥

[Robwreck]

How does seeing that there is no 'I', no 'me' that has control over anything make you feel?

A bit scared. That same sort of fear feeling in the gut that I wrote about previously.

It is like I can't understand yet what that would mean. It would mean I never had control ever. That's a lot to process, if it can be.

[Xain]

It would mean I never had control ever. That's a lot to process, if it can be.

I don't want you to think about this - I want you to KNOW.
Is there anything there in your experience right now that you feel is in control. Don't think - LOOK.
What controls the fingers on the keyboard?
What reads this message?
Is there even anything that is doing this investigation? Or is this investigation just happening?
Is life just 'happening' with no controller? Don't think - LOOK! Is there a controller?

Xain ♥

[Robwreck]

When I look, I get the answers:

Is there anything there in your experience right now that you feel is in control. Don't think - LOOK. No
What controls the fingers on the keyboard? Nothing, it seems to just happen
What reads this message? Nothing, there seems to just be reading
Is there even anything that is doing this investigation? No. Or is this investigation just happening? Just happening.
Is life just 'happening' with no controller? Yes. Don't think - LOOK! Is there a controller? No.

Yet it only seems to last for when I look. So I ask "Is there a controller", and I look, and the sense is No, there is not. But after that sense or feeling, things go back to how they were. Maybe I am not seeing as clearly as I believe?

[Xain]

Yet it only seems to last for when I look. So I ask "Is there a controller", and I look, and the sense is No, there is not. But after that sense or feeling, things go back to how they were. Maybe I am not seeing as clearly as I believe?

This sounds like an expectation.

What is this 'I' that is not seeing it? Have a look. Can you find that one?
Is there anyone there who doesn't 'get it'?

Xain ♥

[Robwreck]

What is this 'I' that is not seeing it? Have a look. Can you find that one?
Is there anyone there who doesn't 'get it'?

Xain, I can't find the I that does not see it when I look. There is no one there that doesn't get it. There is nothing there when I look.

[Xain]

What then does this mean?
How does it make you feel?
What comes up?

Xain ♥

[Robwreck]

Xain, I did not reply much yesterday. It was a very odd day. I am not far from Boston in the US and got caught up in following the events of the capture. I attempted to look at the questions above but was very distracted.

What then does this mean?
How does it make you feel?
What comes up?

Today I feel a little indifferent to the idea that there is no I. There isn't the same fear I talked about before. I kind of feel like it is no big deal, there being no I.

But I also get a nagging thought sometimes that I want to share. I wonder sometimes if I am not looking correctly. How does one look? I usually find myself repeating your questions in my head, closing my eyes and being still. I try to notice anything that comes up, either fears or thoughts. Honestly, I find myself then falling into the pattern of almost visualizing all this. Like I "see" my thought, a thought like "There is no Rob" And then I look to see if I can find or feel a Rob, and I sort of visualize not finding it, like and empty spot, just air. It is hard to describe, but I think the general idea is that this ends up being visual in the mind for me.

Do you have any tips on how to look? Should I avoid visualizations? Should I close my eyes? Should I try not to think? I don't want to get too caught up in the details, but I have noticed that I also "look" following the same method or pattern and maybe that just isn't working.

I also just wanted to say thank you again for doing this. I really do appreciate it.

[Xain]

Forgive my delay in replaying - I have had a number of things to deal with recently.

Today I feel a little indifferent to the idea that there is no I. There isn't the same fear I talked about before. I kind of feel like it is no big deal, there being no I.

Good. What is here is always here.

But I also get a nagging thought sometimes that I want to share. I wonder sometimes if I am not looking correctly. How does one look?

Perhaps a better question, how does one NOT look?
Seeing is here. Hearing is here. Tasting, smelling, touching is here. Covering the eyes, covering the ears might dull these to a degree but is there the possibility to switch them off? Try it if you like - Switch 'hearing' off.

We are conditioned to 'think' of answers. What we are asking here is to LOOK.

Say we were out walking in a forest, and I said to you 'There is a Deer here, can you see it?', you would probably go very quiet and still, look all around, search and examine your current experience with a concentrated focus all around, your mind would go still. This is looking in Direct Experience.
Notice 'thinking' blocks looking into your Direct Experience.
If I asked you just as before 'Can you see the deer?' and mind started saying 'Hmm, Is my eyesight good enough to see a deer? Are you certain I must look for a Deer, and not an Elk, Caribou or Moose? I wonder if I might accidentally see a tree that LOOKs like a deer and fail in my task? All thinking. All stopping you from actually looking.
In truth, you either see a Deer or you don't - It is that simple - Drop the mind completely.

I also just wanted to say thank you again for doing this. I really do appreciate it.

You are very welcome. I am here with you all the way until the end of the process.

We've looked in what is controlling the body. It appears that you couldn't find an 'I', a 'me' that controlled it.
Let's look at the other thing you mentioned that 'I' is the body. The body is 'you'.
By this, I can take it that the body experiences. The body hears. The body feels etc

We say 'I hear', 'I am hearing'
Listen . . . Listen to the sounds in the room.
Look right now into pure Direct Experience.

This 'I' that hears? Is there one? Can you find an 'I', a 'me' that hears?
And where do you feel hearing takes place? Can you pinpoint a location where 'hearing' happens?
Or is there no 'hearer', no location where it happens? Just the experience alone?

Xain ♥

[Robwreck]

Forgive my delay in replaying - I have had a number of things to deal with recently.

No worries, I am just glad to have your help.

This 'I' that hears? Is there one? Can you find an 'I', a 'me' that hears?
And where do you feel hearing takes place? Can you pinpoint a location where 'hearing' happens?
Or is there no 'hearer', no location where it happens? Just the experience alone?

I liked your deer explanation. That was very helpful for me.

When I look I do not find an 'I' that hears. As to a location, it still 'feels' like in the ear but they just feel like ears, not 'my' ears. Just ears hearing. The sounds around me just arise and the there is hearing of those sounds. Indiscriminate hearing, no one or thing deciding what to hear and what not to hear.

[Xain]

As to a location, it still 'feels' like in the ear but they just feel like ears, not 'my' ears.

'Ears' are a word you have been taught as a name for a part of the body.
Do you experience 'ears'? Or is there just 'feeling'?

The sounds around me just arise and there is hearing of those sounds. Indiscriminate hearing, no one or thing deciding what to hear and what not to hear.

So does the body hear? Are you certain that there is no 'I' that hears? Just hearing alone?

Xain ♥

[Robwreck]

'Ears' are a word you have been taught as a name for a part of the body.
Do you experience 'ears'? Or is there just 'feeling'?

So ears are just a label. I see that. Removing the label, it is just a feeling.

So does the body hear? Are you certain that there is no 'I' that hears? Just hearing alone?

I'm not sure how to explain this but don't I think see the body hearing. I see hearing as just happening. If I reduce it to a body hearing it, it doesn't seem right. Like saying the body is the hearer or required for the hearing, but right now I don't see that to be the case. I see that as making a leap to 'my' body, which makes an 'I'. But, I just see hearing.

[Xain]

I see hearing as just happening. If I reduce it to a body hearing it, it doesn't seem right. Like saying the body is the hearer or required for the hearing, but right now I don't see that to be the case. I see that as making a leap to 'my' body, which makes an 'I'. But, I just see hearing.

Cool. So the body isn't the hearer. There is just 'hearing'.

So ears are just a label. I see that. Removing the label, it is just a feeling.

Great! (Mind is full of labels :-) )
At this point you could check into this more, now you've made this discovery.
In normal speaking we would say 'I feel', 'I am feeling'. So what is this 'I' that feels?
Does the body 'feel'? Is there an 'I', a 'me' that feels? Or is there just 'feeling'?

Xain ♥

[Robwreck]

At this point you could check into this more, now you've made this discovery.
In normal speaking we would say 'I feel', 'I am feeling'. So what is this 'I' that feels?
Does the body 'feel'? Is there an 'I', a 'me' that feels? Or is there just 'feeling'?

Much like there are no 'ears' to hear, there is no 'body' to feel. If I were to think "I am tired", it is just a label for a feeling, a feeling that just exists without a feeler.

[Xain]

Much like there are no 'ears' to hear, there is no 'body' to feel. If I were to think "I am tired", it is just a label for a feeling, a feeling that just exists without a feeler.

Good. So there is just 'hearing, 'feeling'. No 'I', 'me' that does it - Just the pure experience alone.

What about thinking.

Do you know what your next thought is going to be?
Can you pinpoint a specific location in your experience where thoughts appear?
In general speaking we say 'In my mind' but where is this location? Is there one?
Is there a controller of thoughts?

Xain ♥