Seeking the end of Seeking

[Govinda]

Hi again,

What do you want to look at?

I want to look through myself at my true self.

I would like some simple comment from you on a regular basis on the daily exercise of "finding where 'you' stop, and experience begins.

Nothing to find

[Hopefulness]

Hi again,

I want to look through myself at my true self.

Is there a "false self"? Please describe.
Is there a "true self" Please describe.

[Govinda]

Hi Again, I have been on Satsang meetings the last two weeks and my smartphone was defect. Now we can continue here and finish off this work hopefully.

I want to look through myself at my true self.

Is there a "false self"? Please describe.
Is there a "true self" Please describe.

I guess there is neither a false self nor a true self. These are just stories.
Metaphorically the false self is the illusory separate I created by thoughts and the true self is undivided reality.

Of course no one is looking at or through something. These are mere stories. Natural, undivided Reality already is here. Everything else is thought.

[Govinda]

I would like some simple comment from you on a regular basis on the daily exercise of "finding where 'you' stop, and experience begins.

Undivided hereness.

[Govinda]

Can you answer me a question please? "Teachers" often speak about pre-consciousness or pre-perception which is before consciousness or perception and "this you are" but it can not be perceived nor experienced. What do you think is meant by this?

It sounds hyper mystical therefore I do not trust it. To me these phrases more seem like statements the mind can not grasp and as a consequence the habitual thinking stops and reality can be seen without mind layers.
This doesn't mean that there is a mystical "self that you are" hidden somewhere. How do you see?

[Hopefulness]

Hi again,

"Teachers" often speak about pre-consciousness or pre-perception which is before consciousness or perception and "this you are" but it can not be perceived nor experienced. What do you think is meant by this?

Never heard of it. Don't have any idea what it is, other than some kind of Zen koan maybe.
"Pre" anything is a story about some imaginary thing "before" this present moment, which is all there is.

It may be a helpful tool though if it somehow forces observation of thought content, and the recognition that you are not those thoughts, that there is only experience happening, and thoughts are just more objects arising in it.

[Govinda]

Hi again,

"Teachers" often speak about pre-consciousness or pre-perception which is before consciousness or perception and "this you are" but it can not be perceived nor experienced. What do you think is meant by this?

Never heard of it. Don't have any idea what it is, other than some kind of Zen koan maybe.
"Pre" anything is a story about some imaginary thing "before" this present moment, which is all there is.

It may be a helpful tool though if it somehow forces observation of thought content, and the recognition that you are not those thoughts, that there is only experience happening, and thoughts are just more objects arising in it.

Makes sense. Objects and observation still imply separation which is a story apparently, isn't it?

What do you think is meant by "no-thing being everything"? "No-thing" like "pre-xy" also seems to clear thoughts as the mind can not imagine it.
As thoughts stop the boundlessness of This which can hardly be described seems to become more obvious.

[Govinda]

Now in any circumstance, any situation, in the past or in an imagined future can there  

ever be a you which is not an idea, thought, or habit? In this very moment, is there a “you”  

which is not an idea? The truth is really simple and obvious. It takes a little courage to look,  

but once recognized it will become clear. Look in immediate experience. Is there a self, other  

than habitual thoughts of a self? Has there ever been anything but a story about you?  
I.C.

Don't think so. All stories.

Can you find a line that divides  

here from there? I.C.

No

I would like some simple comment from you on a regular basis on the daily exercise of "finding where 'you' stop, and experience begins.

Silence.

[Govinda]

I would like some simple comment from you on a regular basis on the daily exercise of "finding where 'you' stop, and experience begins.

Don't know.

[Govinda]

Are you really in control of the actions you experience? Do “you” send messages to  
your muscles telling them to operate? To your eyes telling them to see? To your brain telling  
it to understand? Do you tell the wind to blow or the sun to shine? Aren’t these happening all  
by themselves, without a story of “you” required to make them happen?  
I.C.

Everything happening on automatic, uncontrolled, by themselves. No doer, no controller, no self involved.

[Govinda]

Muscles working on automatic. Seeing happens on automatic. Thinking happens on automatic. Feeling happens on automatic. Without a self involved. Like a very complex robot or a dream.

[Hopefulness]

Hi again,

Muscles working on automatic. Seeing happens on automatic. Thinking happens on automatic. Feeling happens on automatic. Without a self involved. Like a very complex robot or a dream.

Yep. No need for you, the arrogant narrator.

[Govinda]

Yep. No need for you, the arrogant narrator.

Yes, I am a very arrogant narrator. Believing to be the center of life and being in control of it and responsible of everything that seems to happen. Which is a story evolving uncontrolled without a center or owner. I guess. Unsubstantial, non existent Story in undivided reality.

I would like some simple comment from you on a regular basis on the daily exercise of "finding where 'you' stop, and experience begins.

Undivided, undescribable, unknowable, unreachable, unloosable, unchangeable This without beginning and ending. Unowned.

[Govinda]

Yep. No need for you, the arrogant narrator.

Funny truth that you call me, the arrogant narrator. Which is more story than truth maybe but funny still.

[Govinda]

I, the arrogant narrator feel very disrespected and devalued and he wants to be respected and honored (in the story)