eyes wide shut? lets open them

[MerlinC]

how does that make it a center?
where's the you and control in that operation?
so thoughts say something and then is acted out by the body, then it says I did that action, wheres the evidence that thoughts do anything?
does direct experience of here and now support such claims?

[sophie1]

The proof is that many actions won't happen if thoughts' decision is not to act. You are cooking and trying to see if there is enough salt in the dish. Your mind/ thoughts evaluate and make decision. Only then the command is given to your hand to reach for the salt. The hand doesn't just acts on it's own. In this way mind controls the body. No "me" is needed for that. If I do it in here and now, I can see that mind's decision to act activate the body in corresponding direction. How does it make it a center? May be it's not a center but "act now" function of the brain. I hope it is clear to you, because it's not very clear to me :)

[MerlinC]

so there isnt a you but you control the body?

[MerlinC]

where is control for you?

[sophie1]

If there is no "me" there is no "me" to control the body. Thoughts seem to control the body sometimes but "I" am not the thoughts. So there is no control by "me".

[MerlinC]

Great! so who do thoughts belong to and who controls them?
Finding truth is the name of the game, thats why we ask questions to find out the truth even to things that seem like no brainers to us, no stone left unturned.
are you trying to stay present these days?

[sophie1]

Thoughts don't belong to anyone. They follow each other creating an illusion of control but it's not a real control. For example, if there a thought to change direction of thoughts, this thought is a consequence of a chain of other thoughts. It's more like a free flow rather that control. I am always present even if i seem to be not present. Even if "I" seem to be lost in the thoughts, actually awareness is present to the thoughts. But i know what you mean. Yes, i stay more in the moment lately.

[MerlinC]

And how does the body respond to thoughts happening?
can thoughts think?
is awareness you?

[sophie1]

The body responds differently to different thoughts. Thoughts can be followed by various sensations in the body or by actions of the body. Sometimes there seems to be cause-effect relationship between them as I said before. Thoughts can't think. There is no me, but there is awareness.

[MerlinC]

how does thought do these things? like move a body to its will?

[sophie1]

We can explain it through my previous example. You are cooking and trying to see if there is enough salt in the dish. Your mind/ thoughts evaluate and make decision. Only then the command is given to your hand to reach for the salt. The hand doesn't just acts on it's own. In this way mind controls the body.

[MerlinC]

Try doing this experiment
Tap with two or three fingers on the leg. Tap, tap, tap. Then, hold the fingers positioned ready to tap. Just waiting in the air for a command to tap.

Looking at the fingers in the air, is it known when they will tap? Can the thought “tap now” quite happily show up and yet the fingers remain in the air?

See if you can notice the moment when the command is issued and from whence it comes such that the fingers simply have to obey. Notice if other commands to tap can be issued which have no affect on the fingers, leaving them remaining in the air.

Is it true that in direct experience there is no command that can be issued to make the fingers tap?

What causes the finger to tap? Anything? See what can be discovered in experience rather than thought.

[sophie1]

This idea to tap came from you in the form of thoughts. It caused the finger to tap. Then you introduced another thought that is

Can the thought “tap now” quite happily show up and yet the fingers remain in the air

So the new idea is for fingers to remain in the air while the thought "tap now" is here.
Both tapping and remaining in the air are ideas in thought form that the fingers follow.
If I say my fingers "you have to obey" when I say "tap", they will tap. If an idea comes to remain in the air even though the command "you have to a obey" comes, they will follow. In other words, an idea not to follow the command is also a thought, so the experiment doesn't prove that the fingers are not following the command.

Is it true that in direct experience there is no command that can be issued to make the fingers tap?

For now I can see there is a command that can be issued to make the fingers tap

What causes the finger to tap?

Your idea translated into a command caused the finger to tap. The command is not necessarily in the word form, because sometimes things happen quicker than words form. If you see it in slow motion, the idea to tap comes from you first, the decision to follow your idea follows, the decision to act right away is there and then there is an action.

[MerlinC]

how does thought force the body to do things?

[sophie1]

Many times the connection between body and mind is very fast. If I look at my experience in slow motion it happens like this: an idea comes to mind in the form of an image of body movement, then there is something like a command "do it now", then there is a little effort to translate it to a movement and then actual movement happens. The command "do it now" happens without using the words, it is more like an intention.