Creating clarity

[catwk]

Hi Rali,

Thank you so much for your prompts.

I understand now regarding the DE labels for a daily exercise!

Laying in bed:
Seeing bed, simply = colour (seeing)
Smelling pyjamas, simply = smell (smelling)
Feeling the mattress, blanket and pillow, simply = sensation (feeling)
Tasting the toothpaste, simply = taste (tasting)
Hearing the snoring, simply = sound (hearing)
Thought about sleeping, simply = thought (thinking)

When you say, that the exercise is making you to become aware, what is that that is aware? Is that awareness separate from the whatever is happening (e.g. thinking, seeing, etc)?

Right I see. What is that that is aware is the whole process being aware of itself. The awareness is not separate from what is happening! It's all a vast neverending ocean.

Is there a “I” in seeing , smelling, feeling,…? What is that “I-am-ness”? Focus on the feeling of am-ness/being, aliveness.
Can you tell if there is a being or just being?
Is life happening to a being or as being?
Is that “aliveness” any kind of object or subject? Is it even a human?
Is it what you've taken as "you"?

There is no "I" in seeing, smelling, feeling. The "I-am-ness" is just another thought coming from this whole process.

I can tell that there is just being.

Life is happening as being.

That aliveness is not any type of object or subject. It just is. It is not human because "human" is just thought.

Yes, it has been what I have been taken as "me". But now I see that there is no separate me! It is all the vast ocean or soup or process just happening, continuously, constantly.

[poppyseed]

Hi Cat

Seeing bed, simply = colour (seeing)
Smelling pyjamas, simply = smell (smelling)

Awesome! Keep them coming :)

What is that that is aware is the whole process being aware of itself. The awareness is not separate from what is happening! It's all a vast neverending ocean.

Yup! Let’s keep digging. Can you see a border that separates the awareness from thinking - where does the one end and the other begin? Is there a visible border? Or is it just the labels that make them separate? Can awareness split itself to see itself (awareness of awareness)? What is awareness? What does it look like? Is it a container for experiences?
Some kind of lone witness, an experiencer?
Can there be awareness without objects? Can there be objects (thoughts , tastes…) without awareness? Is awareness ever actually experienced or is it just an idea, an abstraction? Look also at the belief that "things are experienced". Have a look at what is happening here and now, and see whether you can really say it is experienced, or in other words, that it is an "experience." Or they just ARE? Observe them without the label "experience" and see what they really are. Please LOOK, don’t intellectualise, imagine or remember from your previous experience! Don’t leave a stone unturned!

Let’s also investigate “body”...
1. Take something cold from the fridge – like a can of cooldrink. When you touch the can, what does more accurately describe your experience:
a. Your fingers feeling cold because of touching a cold can; or
b. Coldness - sensation labelled “cold”? With eyes closed, where does the cold appear?
Observe the order in which the details appear
2. Sit comfortably on a chair. Close your eyes and relax. Pay attention only to the feeling of your body. Just notice the pure sensations, without relying on thoughts or mental images. Keep your eyes closed and look:
Can it be known how tall the body is?
Does the body have a weight or volume?
In the actual experience does the body have a shape or a form?
Is there a boundary between the body and the chair? At the point where your body contacts the chair, are there two things there, a body and chair, or one, sensation?
Is it "my" body, or is it just a body?
Is there an inside or an outside? If there is an inside - the inside of what exactly? If there is an outside - the outside of what exactly?
What does the word/label ‘body’ ACTUALLY refer to? What is the ACTUAL experience of the body?
Can the 'body' do things?

Look very carefully, especially with the last question. You can look several times during the day while doing other things (like washing hands, showering, walking, lying down, etc) before replying.
Love
Rali

[catwk]

Hi Rali,

Thank you for your message.

I haven't fully done the last question, as in taken time throughout the day to look if my body can do things. So may I please reply tomorrow with my responses?

For now, I will just add a DE of a daily activity.

On a phone call:
Seeing backs of my eyelids, simply = colour (seeing)
Smelling air, simply = smell (smelling)
Feeling chair and floor = sensation (feeling)
Tasting mouth, simply = taste (tasting)
Hearing voice, simply = sound (hearing)
Thought about friend, simply = thought (thinking)

I will respond with the rest tomorrow.

Thank you so much.

Love

Cat

[poppyseed]

Hi Cat
No problem. Take your time. Thank you for letting me know!

Love
Rali

[catwk]

Hi Rali,

Here's a DE of a daily activity, below.

Eating soup:
Seeing soup, simply = colour (seeing)
Smelling soup, simply = smell (smelling)
Feeling soup in mouth and chair, elbows on table = sensation (feeling)
Tasting soup, simply = taste (tasting)
Hearing slurping soup, simply = sound (hearing)
Thought about eating soup, simply = thought (thinking)

Can you see a border that separates the awareness from thinking - where does the one end and the other begin? Is there a visible border? Or is it just the labels that make them separate? Can awareness split itself to see itself (awareness of awareness)? What is awareness? What does it look like? Is it a container for experiences?
Some kind of lone witness, an experiencer?
Can there be awareness without objects? Can there be objects (thoughts , tastes…) without awareness? Is awareness ever actually experienced or is it just an idea, an abstraction?

When I try to separate awareness from thinking, it doesn't happen, it's just more thoughts that arise out of nowhere. So I can't really be sure whether I am actually being aware or whether thoughts are just happening. There's no visible border. I thought awareness could split itself, I thought I have had that experience before. But when I get present now to awareness splitting itself, I am just present to a whole sea of thoughts just happening constantly. There doesn't seem to be a awareness that control things, let along split itself. I think awareness is more of the same thing, it's more of the sea of thoughts simply arising. What I thought awareness looked like is a person picking and choosing what to focus on at any given moment. I thought it was a container for experiences, a lone wolf. The awareness and objects seem to blend into each other. I think there are just objects, and objects and objects. There is no such thing ad the awareness part. Last question, awareness isn't experience, it's just an idea and an abstraction or concept.

I am seeing and really getting that things just ARE.

a. Your fingers feeling cold because of touching a cold can; or
b. Coldness - sensation labelled “cold”? With eyes closed, where does the cold appear?

It still feels a bit like a. My fingers feel cold because of touching cold. Perhaps I am still holding onto the idea of a body. With eyes closed, the cold appears floating in space.

Can it be known how tall the body is?
Does the body have a weight or volume?
In the actual experience does the body have a shape or a form?
Is there a boundary between the body and the chair? At the point where your body contacts the chair, are there two things there, a body and chair, or one, sensation?
Is it "my" body, or is it just a body?
Is there an inside or an outside? If there is an inside - the inside of what exactly? If there is an outside - the outside of what exactly?
What does the word/label ‘body’ ACTUALLY refer to? What is the ACTUAL experience of the body?
Can the 'body' do things?

No you can't tell how tall the body is. The body doesn't have a weight or volume. It doesn't have a form. There's no boundary between the body and chair. It is just a body. There is no inside or outside, everything is blended together. The label body seems to not be accurate. I can't refer to it. There doesn't seem to be an ACTUAL experience of the body.

All day I looked at the question, can the body do things. I noticed myself thinking I have controlled my body to do something and then in a split second the body is moving, doing something I did not consciously put my "mind" to do. I kept on trying to focus on controlling the body again but again it kept doing it's own thing. This made me see that the body is also in this sea and soup of things, it is just being. And now that I have answered the above questions about the body, I experience the boundaries of the body being very fuzzy and blended with all of the rest of everything. I am seeing the notion of "body" is a concept.

[poppyseed]

Hi Cat
Good looking!!

What I thought awareness looked like is a person picking and choosing what to focus on at any given moment. I thought it was a container for experiences, a lone wolf.

Let’s look at this a bit more until there is certainty what is real and what is not
In experience now, listen to sound; is there anything there besides what is heard?
Close your eyes.
With eyes closed, you will now experience 'blackness'. There may be other things you can find going on, sure. If you are looking at a bright light, there may be a red glow. There may be sparkly bits or cloudy flecks appearing and disappearing - It really doesn't matter about the specifics.
Just to make things simple, whatever you can see with eyes closed, I'm going to refer to it as 'black' or 'blackness' just for simplicity.
1) With eyes closed, can you confirm that what is experienced is 'blackness' as I mentioned?
2) Is there anything else in 'seeing' other than 'blackness'?
3) Can what is seeing/witnessing the blackness be found?
4) Can a pair of eyes, an 'I' / 'me'/ Cat, a person, anything be found that is witnessing the blackness? Or is there just 'blackness' to be found?
What do you find?
Can an INHERENT SEE-ER/experiencer/witness be found?
Would anything that is suggested as the see-er, be anything other than a concept/idea/thought?

I am seeing the notion of "body" is a concept.

YES! The actual experience of the body is thought. Thought points to sensations and labels them a ‘body’, but can a body be found as actual experience or only thoughts about a body?

It still feels a bit like a. My fingers feel cold because of touching cold. Perhaps I am still holding onto the idea of a body. With eyes closed, the cold appears floating in space.

What are “fingers” in DE? How are “fingers” experienced? Apply the “cup of coffee” example of DE. With eyes closed do they have a location?

Let’s investigate this a bit deeper…
Please follow each step, don't leave out any. Take your time. Don't move to the next step until the previous one is clearly seen. Repeat the exercise several times.

Stand in front of a bigger mirror.
1. First, close the eyes and feel the sensations labelled ‘body’.

2. Then open the eyes and look into the mirror while still paying attention to the sensations. Is there any connection between the felt sensations and the image in the mirror? Or just thoughts (and/or mental images) suggest that there is?

3. While still paying attention to the sensations move one hand and observe the movement from the mirror. Is there any connection between the felt sensations (labelled ‘hand’) and image of movement in the mirror?

4. Now do the same movement with the hand, but this time look at the hand directly, not from the mirror. Is there any connection between the felt sensations (labelled ‘hand’) and the image ‘of movement’? Or only thoughts suggest it?

5. Now, pay attention only to the image in the mirror. Does the image by itself suggest in any way that is ‘you’ or ‘your body’? Does the image itself suggest in any way that it is a ‘body’ at all? Or are there only colours and shapes?

6. Where the mirror ends, some parts of the body (probably legs) cannot be seen. Just by the image in the mirror, is there any ‘knowledge’ that there must be legs, or only thoughts and mental images suggest so?

7. Now turn away from the mirror and look forward (don’t look directly to any body parts). Is there a ‘body’ anywhere when all thoughts and images are ignored, or are there only sensations?

8. Start to walk slowly.
Is there a ‘body walking’, or are there only sensations?
Is there actual experience of ‘walking’ at all?
Or just THOUGHTS ABOUT ‘walking’?
Can such a thing as ‘body’ be found OR just THOUGHTS ABOUT a ‘body’?
Can such a thing as ‘walking’ be found?

9. Are the sensations localized in space, like ‘going through the room’; OR is there only an image that is labelled ‘room’ and appearing sensations without any location?

Love
Rali

[catwk]

Hi Rali,

Thank you very much!

I will reply to this later tonight.

DE from yesterday, below.

Walking through the city:
Seeing people, buildings, sky, lights simply = colour (seeing)
Feeling feet on pavement = sensation (feeling)
Hearing people talking, simply = sound (hearing)
Thought about walking in the city, simply = thought (thinking)

In the above daily activity, I forgot about the sense of smell.

When there is no food involved, should I still add the tasting part?

Thank you again.

Love

Cat

[poppyseed]

Hi Cat

In the above daily activity, I forgot about the sense of smell.

When there is no food involved, should I still add the tasting part?

You just describe someting as it happens. If there is no smelling there is no smelling. Even though you can argue that even no smell is a smell and if you observe carefully you will see that there is a faint smell, but that is besides the point. Don't overcomplicate things, just describe what is really experienced.

Looking forward to your full answer

Love
Rali

[catwk]

Hi Rali,

Thank you for clarifying my questions.

That is clear now. I won't over complicate things!

is there anything there besides what is heard?

There is nothing there besides what is heard. I get this when I close my eyes. Then I wonder is this just a trick of perception. I start to think, there is a car in the distance that is making that sound. That car is there. But when I close my eyes, sound is just happening. So I keep going from experiencing no self to wondering if I am just tricking myself. Nevertheless, I feel very expansive and very boundary-less at the moment.

1) With eyes closed, can you confirm that what is experienced is 'blackness' as I mentioned?
2) Is there anything else in 'seeing' other than 'blackness'?
3) Can what is seeing/witnessing the blackness be found?
4) Can a pair of eyes, an 'I' / 'me'/ Cat, a person, anything be found that is witnessing the blackness? Or is there just 'blackness' to be found?
What do you find?
Can an INHERENT SEE-ER/experiencer/witness be found?
Would anything that is suggested as the see-er, be anything other than a concept/idea/thought?

1) Yes I confirm
2) No, it's all blackness
3) No, I cannot find the seer/witnesses
4) No, a pair of eyes cannot be found witnessing the blackness. Just blackness can be found.

Right, I get it, so anything that is suggested as the seer is just a concept/idea/thought. Just like the car in the distance that I think is making sound.



I am currently doing a course over the weekend.

I should have known that I would be quite tired afterward and unable to fully respond and complete the full exercise.

This enquiry is really important to me. Would I please be able to complete rest of this on Monday?

My DE of a daily activitiy:

Talking in a course:
Seeing computer screen and people's faces on zoom, simply = colour (seeing)
Smelling air, simply = smell (smelling)
Feeling back on couch and bum on floor = sensation (feeling)
Tasting mouth, simply = taste (tasting)
Hearing voices and my voice, simply = sound (hearing)
Thought about speaking, simply = thought (thinking)

I will respond with the rest on Monday.

Thank you!

Love,

Cat

[poppyseed]

Hey Cat

I am currently doing a course over the weekend.

I should have known that I would be quite tired afterward and unable to fully respond and complete the full exercise.

This enquiry is really important to me. Would I please be able to complete rest of this on Monday?

No worries! Life happens :) Thank you for letting me know!

I will reply to all when you finish so we don't go backwards and forwards.

Enjoy!
Love
Rali

[catwk]

Dear Rali,

Thank you for your patience.

I will answer the second part of your email here.

but can a body be found as actual experience or only thoughts about a body?

Right, when I bring my attention to trying to experience the body, I cannot find it as an actual experience.

What are “fingers” in DE? How are “fingers” experienced? Apply the “cup of coffee” example of DE. With eyes closed do they have a location?

Fingers:
Seeing fingers, simply = colour (seeing)
Fingers moving = sensation (feeling)
Thought about fingers, simply = thought (thinking)

No they do not have a location.

Is there any connection between the felt sensations and the image in the mirror? Or just thoughts (and/or mental images) suggest that there is?

Only thoughts that suggest there is a connection between sensation and image in mirror.

Is there any connection between the felt sensations (labelled ‘hand’) and image of movement in the mirror?

- no there is no connection.

Is there any connection between the felt sensations (labelled ‘hand’) and the image ‘of movement’? Or only thoughts suggest it?

- only thoughts that suggest it

Does the image by itself suggest in any way that is ‘you’ or ‘your body’? Does the image itself suggest in any way that it is a ‘body’ at all? Or are there only colours and shapes?

- the image doesn't suggest it is my body. The image doesn't suggest that it is a body at all. They are just colours and shapes.

Just by the image in the mirror, is there any ‘knowledge’ that there must be legs, or only thoughts and mental images suggest so?

I had a full length mirorr. But when I stuck part of my body out of view of the mirror, I did create a mental image that a hand was there but I just couldn't see it in the reflection. So it is just a thought or mental image that suggest so that a hand is there.

Is there a ‘body’ anywhere when all thoughts and images are ignored, or are there only sensations?

Only sensations.

Is there a ‘body walking’, or are there only sensations?
Is there actual experience of ‘walking’ at all?
Or just THOUGHTS ABOUT ‘walking’?
Can such a thing as ‘body’ be found OR just THOUGHTS ABOUT a ‘body’?
Can such a thing as ‘walking’ be found?

There are only sensations. There are only thoughts about walking. Only thoughts about body can be found. Body cannot be found. Just thoughts about it. Walking cannot be found.

Are the sensations localized in space, like ‘going through the room’; OR is there only an image that is labelled ‘room’ and appearing sensations without any location?

This one was cool. I am still getting used to this and practising this. There is only image that is labelled room and appearing sensations without any location.

I will take more time to do this exercise again.

Thank you so much for this.

Love

Cat

[poppyseed]

Hi Cat

I hope your course was fun! :)

Right, I get it, so anything that is suggested as the seer is just a concept/idea/thought. Just like the car in the distance that I think is making sound.

You get it? Is this “getting” conceptual or experiential? Or both? How does that make you feel? Any doubts about there not being a seer involved in seeing?

There is nothing there besides what is heard. I get this when I close my eyes. Then I wonder is this just a trick of perception. I start to think, there is a car in the distance that is making that sound. That car is there. But when I close my eyes, sound is just happening.

Awesome looking! Does the sound itself suggest in any way that it is 'car'? Is there anything “car-like” in the sound? Does it have that shape? What besides thought suggest that the sound is made by a car? Without thought, how is it known that the sound heard is “car”?
With "eyes open" there is seeing labelled "car"? Can the "car" be isolated from the background without the labels? Are there seeing and seen with clearly defined borders? Can seeing do things - like make a noise?
Look

So I keep going from experiencing no self to wondering if I am just tricking myself.

LOOK! What is tricking itself into experiencing stuff? Is there an experiencer? What experiences “no-self” or “self”? What is outside of the “experience” and experiences it? Is there an experience of seeing, hearing,... or just seeing, hearing...? Is there an experience at all?
If you apply the cup of coffee example, when you look at the 'I/me' , is it actually known?
Yes, sensation labelled as “I” is known, as are the thoughts ABOUT an “I”, but an “I” isn’t actually known. It is a concept…and concepts aren’t an issue, unless they are believed.

Does the label "I" contain an actual I...does it contain an actual person?
Does the label "I" itself, suggest in any way that it is an I?
Does the label "I" know anything about an I?
What does the label "I" point to? In other words, what does the word/label "I" actually refer to?
Can a label/thought (i.e. “I”) experience – think, see, hear, smell…? Or just IS?

This one was cool. I am still getting used to this and practising this. There is only image that is labelled room and appearing sensations without any location.

Is DE an alternative mode of experiencing reality? Or is it where we see what is actually true and what is not? Has anything in the sensation (e.g. “moving”) changed besides perception/thought description?

Please stay with these questions and don't rush to just answer. You can always say that you need more time if you want to play a bit longer. The momentum is important, but as long as you do something related to the inquiry it does not matter if you report it immediately or not. This inquiry is for "you" :)
Love
Rali

[catwk]

Hi Rali,

Thank you for your message.

I did in fact rush through answering the mirror exercise, in order to respond in a timely manner. I get that this guidance is for me. I really appreciate you pointing that out. I completed the mirror exercise again.

Ok I will recalibrate, stay with the questions and take my time with responding to your latest questions.

I will be doing the inquiry all through the day.

Thank you!

Love
Cat

[catwk]

Hi Rali,

I have been trying to get back into a certain clear feeling before replying to you but it isn't happening. Over the last month I have been enquiring a lot into the nature of things with liberation unleashed and a few other things. I had been feeling an out of body experience for a whole month. But I started worrying about finances a few days ago and now that feeling seems to have disappeared. I am going to continue my enquiry with you though. As I see that the "out of body" experience is still more of the "self" and that experience isn't sustainable. Getting DE is simply about getting DE. It's not the profound, amazing, super aware feeling that I have been trying to hold on to.

You get it? Is this “getting” conceptual or experiential? Or both? How does that make you feel? Any doubts about there not being a seer involved in seeing?

When I sit and really see that there is no seer, I "get" it as an experience. Then after that moment, I start having thoughts about it and that's when it starts becoming a concept. So it's both conceptual and experiential for me. This makes me feel like I haven't gotten this perfectly or crystal clear yet. However, I don't have any doubts about there not being a seer involved in seeing. When I sit, see and look for the seer, it's actually quite clear that there is no seer.

Does the sound itself suggest in any way that it is 'car'? Is there anything “car-like” in the sound? Does it have that shape? What besides thought suggest that the sound is made by a car? Without thought, how is it known that the sound heard is “car”?
With "eyes open" there is seeing labelled "car"? Can the "car" be isolated from the background without the labels? Are there seeing and seen with clearly defined borders? Can seeing do things - like make a noise?

No, the sound itself doesn't suggest in any way that it is 'car'. There is nothing "car-like" in the sound. The sound doesn't have shape. Only thought suggests the sound is made by a car. It can't be known that the sounds heard is "car". I had a discussion about this with my partner. I learnt about sound frequencies in high school physics. I thought to myself that this enquiry really goes against what I learnt in physics. Objects definitely cause certain sounds. I started doubting this enquiry and calling it silly. However, physics is also just a label and thought. If I stick with DE, the sound that I believe is "car" is simply sound and that's all.

True, if there was a car in front of me, I would label it "car". It can't be isolated from the background without that "car" label. There is not seeing and seen with clearly defined borders. Seeing can not do anything. Except see.

What is tricking itself into experiencing stuff? Is there an experiencer? What experiences “no-self” or “self”? What is outside of the “experience” and experiences it? Is there an experience of seeing, hearing,... or just seeing, hearing...? Is there an experience at all?

Nothing is tricking itself into experiencing stuff. There is not an experiencer. Nothing is experiencing "no self" or "self". Experiencing or this soup is just happening. Nothing is outside of the "experience" and experiences it. There is just seeing, hearing. There is no experience at all. Just all a process happening.

If you apply the cup of coffee example, when you look at the 'I/me' , is it actually known?

"I":
Seeing "I", simply = colour (seeing)
Smelling "I", simply = smell (smelling)
Feeling "I" = sensation (feeling)
Tasting "I", simply = taste (tasting)
Hearing "I", simply = sound (hearing)
Thought about "I", simply = thought (thinking)

According to the above, "I" is not actually known.

Does the label "I" contain an actual I...does it contain an actual person?
Does the label "I" itself, suggest in any way that it is an I?
Does the label "I" know anything about an I?
What does the label "I" point to? In other words, what does the word/label "I" actually refer to?
Can a label/thought (i.e. “I”) experience – think, see, hear, smell…? Or just IS?

No, it doesn't contain an actual person. It doesn't suggest in any way that there is an "I". The label "I" doesn't know anything about an "I". Everything is just happening. The label "I" just refers to shapes, colours, sound, thoughts. A label cannot experience. Everything just IS.

Is DE an alternative mode of experiencing reality? Or is it where we see what is actually true and what is not? Has anything in the sensation (e.g. “moving”) changed besides perception/thought description?

No, it's not an alternative mode of experiencing reality. It is where we see what is actually true and what is not. I know that it takes time for me to do DE. Which, makes me feel like I am transporting myself to an alternate reality. But, that is just me taking my time to do DE. When I answer your questions, I sometimes answer from remembering the moments when I am taking the time to do DE. I then mistakenly have a thought in my head that I was in an alternative mode when I was doing DE and I am no longer in that mode. I see that perhaps, I can start to do DE more often as an approach all through the day rather than a momentary thing just to answer these questions. This really helps with what I was talking about in my first paragraph of this message.

The sensation hasn't changed. There is just sensation. With new colours, shapes, sounds and thought.

Thank you Rali!

Love

Cat

[poppyseed]

Hi Cat

I have been trying to get back into a certain clear feeling before replying to you but it isn't happening. Over the last month I have been enquiring a lot into the nature of things with liberation unleashed and a few other things. I had been feeling an out of body experience for a whole month. But I started worrying about finances a few days ago and now that feeling seems to have disappeared. I am going to continue my enquiry with you though. As I see that the "out of body" experience is still more of the "self" and that experience isn't sustainable. Getting DE is simply about getting DE. It's not the profound, amazing, super aware feeling that I have been trying to hold on to.

How is it possible to "maintain/get back into" something when you are present? Present moment (DE) is just one present moment, and has anything to do with a duration of a certain state. This is not about special states, this is about plain everyday ordinary stuff.

It’s not like the “body” or the “self” inherently existed yesterday and today it doesn’t because of various events and factors. Or it will be back tomorrow because of “stress”. It just never did exist and it never will. “Body” is just a perception, a description for sensations. Is there such a thing as out of “body” OR that is just another sensation? You can also say “expansiveness”/”void” but these will still be labels, describing sensations (feeling), won’t they? And this is how the story telling goes…LOOK!
Also...
So, emotion = thought + sensation

Was there a worried "I" or just thoughts about financial security? Where exactly was the sensation "worry" experienced (inside or outside the body)? Who owns that sensation, to whom does it belong? Where is the ‘me’ that is worried? Really look.

No, the sound itself doesn't suggest in any way that it is 'car'. There is nothing "car-like" in the sound. The sound doesn't have shape. Only thought suggests the sound is made by a car. It can't be known that the sounds heard is "car". I had a discussion about this with my partner. I learnt about sound frequencies in high school physics. I thought to myself that this enquiry really goes against what I learnt in physics. Objects definitely cause certain sounds. I started doubting this enquiry and calling it silly. However, physics is also just a label and thought. If I stick with DE, the sound that I believe is "car" is simply sound and that's all.

Believe me, I enjoy science a lot, my son is currently doing a PhD in Physics, so yes I know how it sounds. BUT tell me can you see what is outside of your seeing if seeing is all you’ve got? Can it be known if there is outside of seeing or that will be an assumption? “Logic” tells is that the car is outside of us (body). Where exactly is “outside” in DE?
Look at your screen right now. Notice the different colors and shapes. Explore the screen as if you see it for the first time. Disregard the thoughts about what is seen, pay attention only to what is experienced Do you see a border where the seeing stops and the screen begins? Or the screen is part of (included in) that seeing? Where is the border where the image crosses over from being outside to being inside of you? What does the border consist of? Is there a border in seeing where the screen is and where the background is? It’s just colour (patterns of colour making a shape).
Does the screen have a fixed location? Where is "here?" Where is "there?" Where is the reference point?
Could you tell me from where you are looking at it, and what is there? Is there a "you" in that direction? Is there a screen in the other direction? Does seeing have a direction? Look carefully. What do you see?

When I sit and really see that there is no seer, I "get" it as an experience. Then after that moment, I start having thoughts about it and that's when it starts becoming a concept. So it's both conceptual and experiential for me. This makes me feel like I haven't gotten this perfectly or crystal clear yet. However, I don't have any doubts about there not being a seer involved in seeing. When I sit, see and look for the seer, it's actually quite clear that there is no seer.

Thank you for your honesty! And yes, this is how it happens. The experience is there and the explanation/description flows with it. It’s part of the experience. However, the description is not the experience. Otherwise, you would get wet just by talking about a waterfall :). And this is the distinction (the map vs the territory) that I’m trying to show you.
Here is an exercise to inquire a bit further
I hope you like chocolate…
For the first couple of minutes imagine you are eating a piece chocolate…feel the sensations of it melting into your mouth, the taste, the texture, the aroma. Really enjoy the imaginary piece of chocolate as much as you can.

Then for the next couple of minutes actually have a piece of chocolate and see the difference.
Experience the chocolate with curiosity and observe the sensations. Really enjoy it.

Then for another minute or so describe the experience in as much detail as possible.
Write the description here. What was the experience like?

After you have done this, tell me what you noticed when you compared these three experiences:

1. Imaginary piece of chocolate

2. Real piece of chocolate

3. Description of eating the real piece of chocolate

I see that perhaps, I can start to do DE more often as an approach all through the day rather than a momentary thing just to answer these questions. This really helps with what I was talking about in my first paragraph of this message.

Well, that is what I mean by "momentum" - being aware of what else is there in everyday life rather than the description. Sometimes it is not even a related description but a random pattern of descriptions that has nothing to do with what is happening (e.g. financial security). And this is why I encourage you to do the break downs - notice what is actually here right now. The more focus goes on DE, the more these thought patterns will self correct. As you said already that there is no thinker deciding what to think about right now...
Love
Rali