Grateful for any help

[jrm72]

Hi Sharon,

So it has been found that -

There is no control of actions (palm flip)
There is no control of thoughts (list 10 words)
The words used are not the thing (apple)
There is no separate experiences from experience (the heard, hearing and hearer)
There's no separate body (butt/chair)

What are the consequences of these experiences?

❤️🖖

[SharMen]

Hi James,
I've been reading and re=reading what has been seen. I agree with everything on that list. Each of those was experienced.

What are the consequences of these experiences?

I do not know. I feel a block, like the answer is eluding me. The only thing that comes up is that everything is just happening in this everywhere space, not happening to or because of some entity called Sharon.
I'm gonna keep looking at it.

Thanks James 🙏

[jrm72]

Hi Sharon,

What's the difference between a delusion and an illusion?

❤️🖖

[SharMen]

What's the difference between a delusion and an illusion?

a delusion is false thinking and an illusion is false seeing?
Self is delusion because I think I am someone. Is self also an illusion? Thought arises "I'll think about this". But thinking is delusion. Looking is needed. I don't see a self but I think it's there. But it's not like the mirage in desert that I see. I don't claim to see a self. I just 'think' a self.

Now I'm gonna be late for work - gotta run.
Looking foward to hearing from you about how to proceed.

Sharon 😊

[jrm72]

Afternoon Sharon,

Looking foward to hearing from you about how to proceed.

This made me smile. I have no idea how you should proceed or what I'm going to say next. Typing happens this end. Hopefully my prodding helps.

a delusion is false thinking and an illusion is false seeing?

This may be a totally stupid question -
What's the difference between seeing and thinking?

thinking is delusion

Spoiler alert - minefield ahead

How does this statement about the statement "thinking is delusion" sit with you -
Yes and No

But it's not like the mirage in desert that I see. I don't claim to see a self. I just 'think' a self.

What mirage, what desert?
I didn't realise you actually went out and saw one.





❤️🖖

[SharMen]

What's the difference between seeing and thinking?

Seeing involves an actual object. There is thinking involved though because it is the mind that creates a sense of distance between a self and that object. I don’t have direct experience of this yet but I believe it to be true.

I have no idea how you should proceed or what I'm going to say next. Typing happens this end.

I have this sense on my end that I am thinking so hard about these questions. Lol what does that even mean? Thinking happens. How can an I be thinking so hard? I am looking to see what is true for me right now and it’s like…typing stops. Thought: Do I delete all this nonsense? Is it helpful to seeing? Or just mind running in circles, keeping me distracted?

How does this statement about the statement "thinking is delusion" sit with you -
Yes and No

Ok please explain.

What mirage, what desert?
I didn't realise you actually went out and saw one.

Lol = I did not see a mirage bc I did not go to the desert. But even someone who is in the desert and sees a mirage is not actually seeing it. They are thinking it and believing they are seeing.
Am I not actually seeing anything? Am I thinking everything? But this object is here. It is a color I label green. I can touch it. It is here no? I am seeing it.
Wait… there is not an” I” seeing anything. Seeing happens. Sensing happens, thinking happens. Anything said about the seen is a thought and not the actual seen.

Nothing else to say right now.

Hope you can make sense of any of this.
Thanks James
Sharon 🙏

[jrm72]

Afternoon Sharon,

Lots of good stuff in your last post to work with, but before we go there, see if this helps -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYp5XuGYqqY

❤️🖖

[SharMen]

Thank you for the video James. I want to watch it again, maybe a few times but now I understand why you asked What is the difference between seeing and thinking. Thinking and beliefs are shifting a little here.
Thanks for the minefield ahead warning lol.
🙏 Sharon

[jrm72]

Afternoon Sharon,

This is something that keeps me on track, let's see if it works for you -

Try this -

Watch experiencing during everyday activities. What is it that drives the car? What puts food in the mouth? What is it that reads these words, types replies? Is there a 'something' doing these...or do they simply happen, all on their own? Look deeply into this many times a day, without expectations....

Nothing at all to lose, except the false idea that you exist.


❤️🖖

[SharMen]

Hi James,
Why do things happen one way vs another? When I was at a red light today and thought appeared "go through this red light. No one is around." What determines that the car stays at the red light? Why are rules followed? Who/What is determining to follow rules? Why does this body/mind get up when the alarm goes off but the person in the room next to me keeps hitting their snooze alarm and then they are late for work? If no one is there to decide, why does it happen this way for me but different for them?
Why is there typing then deleting, then typing then deleting? There's a question I'm trying to get at but I can't seem to phrase it in a way that makes sense.
What I've noticed today is that things are happening. But what determines how things happen? Are there preferences, conditionings that encourage outcomes?
goodnight,
sharon

[jrm72]

Morning Sharon,

Why do things happen one way vs another?

1, The very unsatisfying answer is because they do.
I assume you had no say in when you were born.
I assume you had no say in when you were fed as a baby.
I assume you didn't choose your first school.
etc
When was the first decision you actually made?

2, Why the right answer is probably wrong.
If I have to give a rational answer, I'd say the brain runs everything and reacts to circumstances. The brain has been responding to everything that happens, since before you were born. It does everything automatically and for some reason a layer of self was added automatically as well. The reason this is probably wrong is that all theories change and develop, so the biological, physiological, neurochemical, psychological basis for this argument will be different in the future.

3, Why the right answer is definitely wrong.
What we're doing here is trying to deal with things as they are, so the reasoning behind what's happening gets in the way.
For example, someone you know completely ignores you in the street, you saw them look at you and they walked on by without a word. Now you can make up a hundred stories as to why. Most of them probably negative, but you can never know for sure. You decide to ask them the next time you see them, and they say, oh my eyes were sore that morning so I didn't wear my contacts, so I didn't even see you. And even that's their story about what happened, which probably isn't totally correct either.
So whatever the right answer is as to why things happen doesn't help us here, because it's a story the I is telling itself to be feel right.
Things happen, we've seen the self doesn't control actions or thoughts among many other things, it just gets in the way. So the self wanting to know why is the problem.

4, If you're in a car accident and get injured. That's not perfect, it's not how things are meant to be, it isn't fate etc. It just is. If you're looking for reasons why, or telling yourself stories about how the other driver was terrible, or blaming yourself or whatever. Your not dealing with what is. Call an ambulance, stop the bleeding etc

5, We could now get into a discussion about determinism v free will (more stories).
But things happen, which includes any responses and being in the moment seems to be as near as we can get to whatever this is.

6, And the real kicker - There no choice in whether you keep searching for an answer, it'll happen the way it happens.


It's all unsatisfying until it isn't.


I'll say here feel free to smile or scream at this point. But 'I' didn't choose to type this line and 'you' won't choose your reaction. It all just happens.


❤️🖖

[jrm72]

Hi Sharon,

Rereading your last post, I didn't give any indication as to why responses are different for different people.

When we're saying there's no I, it's talking about a psychological construct, which gets seen through, in terms of it's not running the show. But there is a set of unique perspectives which are and have been different for whatever is underlying Sharon compared to what is underlying James. Therefore each perspective reacts differently.

Being a bit needy this is the story 'I' find most helpful -

The psychologist William James says all that exists is the model in your head. The past is memories in that model right now. The future is expectations in your head right now. The model respods and changes in the moment and each model for each, for want of a better description individual is different.

Now as I said that's my current favourite story. I also find the consciousness is primary over matter an interesting story.

All of these following stories I don't believe, and my belief is a story (It's stories all the way down, until there's no story) -

I'm not religious so that cuts out a whole load of stories for me.

We could be in a computer simulation.

Our brain could be a receiver and something else is send control signals.

I am an alien who came here on holiday and suffered from amnesia.


Make up any story you want, but until you get to no story, use the story that seems to work best in any situation, whilecalways rememberingbits a story.

❤️🖖

[SharMen]

Thank you so much James for writing all of that. It has been so helpful. Your post reminded me that thirty years ago I learned that my life was just a story that I kept telling myself. I had to tell my story to a partner over and over until the realization hit that it is all just a story. And I was telling a story about my life that left me feeling bad. We will never know the truth about other people and why they do things so why not tell a story that makes us feel better. Your example helped me remember this.
So my story is that we all have different perspectives (for whatever reason I know longer need to know). According to the Hoffman video, we are not seeing reality as it is but our perception/perspective of reality. It will be different for everyone.
I don't have any desire to know any more about this. Things just happen. This body/mind responds and reacts and does things all day long. Tomorrow I will notice when all these things are just happening without a me involved.
Nothing else to say right now.
Goodnight,
Sharon 😴

[jrm72]

Morning Sharon,

Hope you get a good night's sleep.

Do you feel you've seen through the illusion of self?

❤️🖖

[SharMen]

Do you feel you've seen through the illusion of self?

Hi James,
If you had asked me this question two days ago I would have said no, definitely not. But now I'm thinking yes. But why the change in answer? I don't know. It just feels like the right answer right now.
Before I requested a guide I read the Gatecrashers book and read some forum posts. I was always astounded that the "seeker" would be questioning and trying hard to get it then the next post they said something along the lines of "something has shifted!". I'd want to scream "how???" I am reading the same pointers as them and doing the same exercises. Why did they shift and not me??
Anyway, I think maybe that has happened to me. I don't know what is different. But something feels less than it was. I'll see how it is tmrw.
Goodnight
Sharon ❤️