The Gate

Hi Omar,

I don't know. The intention to move is definitely coming from somewhere. It's clearly not a thought, though. I can see how the intention to move and thought are different

If your ability to think was taken away, would you be able to ‘intend’ to do anything? Therefore isn’t intention just a labelled thought? What is it a label for?

Is the word ‘Self’ just a label?

There seems to be a "me-ness" there claiming ownership for the action. I mean, the body is clearly not just moving on its own... but then what could there "be" that's giving it instructions?

These ‘instructions’ would be thoughts right?

Do thoughts just come and go and come and go and come and go?

“There must be a controller”...isn’t this just a thought??

You are assuming that there is a controller. Look in DE and describe this controller for me please.

What do you THINK would like the idea of THINKING that it can control anything?

When you are walking is walking just happening?

When you are breathing is breathing just happening?

LOOK in DE and tell me: can you find something that is controlling these things?

Is it possible that thoughts about a self are only thoughts about a self? Can you find thoughts about a self in DE?

If thoughts come and go and there are sometimes gaps between thoughts does that mean that the ‘You’ ‘Me’ ‘I’ that you take yourself to be sometimes disappears?

What is ‘me-ness’ a label for? Look into DE for it and wait for an answer…NOT a labelled one….look for a KNOWING.

When you saw your hand moving where were the sensations of ‘hand’ happening? Were they happening in your hand or were they happening in awareness, e.g. sensations arising? Look at your hand in DE and start flipping it. Can you see a self in your Direct Experience controlling it?

Don't I have free will? (but then who is this "I" who would be the agent of the free will?)

What does the label ‘Free will’ point towards? Is agent just a label? When you look in DE can you find the thing that ‘agent’ is a label for?


Please take your time and answer ALL these questions. Always ask: is that true?

Hi Steve,

Just to let you know that today I will be traveling around and won’t be able to post a detailed reply. I’m still thinking about this/ doing the pointers. I have a deep sense of existential vertigo… I will write in more detail later.

Hi Omar, no problem at all. Remember ….when in doubt…just LOOK!

Yes, yes. Thank you!! I have realized how much in my life I have been relying on a story about how things “should” be (I.e., thinking) rather than LOOKING at how things are. Allowing myself to really look and question everything feels both exhilarating and slightly terrifying.

Hi Omar, how’s things?

Hello Steve,

I'm sorry I haven't been writing very regularly. I'm currently taking a trip so it's been hard to find the time. However, I have continued to examine and explore this question during my daily life. I was going to reply now but there was an error with the website and my answers got erased. I will reply tomorrow. I'm really sorry. Thank you for your patience.

If your ability to think was taken away, would you be able to ‘intend’ to do anything?

Yes, I think so. Thought and intention seem to be two separate processes. It's as if they were both somehow "arising" and being perceived in consciousness but it doesn't seem like one depends on the other.

Therefore isn’t intention just a labelled thought? What is it a label for?

It seems like "intention" is the mind attempting to explain how movement happens around the idea of an "I", like a story the mind creates as to how moving the body happens (it moved because "I" intended for it to happen). But when I look, there doesn't seem to be anything "intending" anything separate from the act itself. So it doesn't seem to be a labor for anything that exists in reality.

Is the word ‘Self’ just a label?

Yes, it's just a label that the mind attaches to a bunch of processes that are occurring.

These ‘instructions’ would be thoughts right?

Yeah, I guess. I was trying to point at the "thing" or the "process" that makes movement or "intending" possible. I.e., there's something that happens that then causes my hand to move. It doesn't just move on its own. Like an acting, or a mental "willing".

Do thoughts just come and go and come and go and come and go?

Yes...

“There must be a controller”...isn’t this just a thought??

Yes, definitely this is a thought and not based on DE.

You are assuming that there is a controller. Look in DE and describe this controller for me please.

No controller can be found. Just the very entrenched belief that there is a controller making everything happen. There's a kind of vertigo and a fear when confronting this fact.

What do you THINK would like the idea of THINKING that it can control anything?

I don't understand this question.

When you are walking is walking just happening?

I don't know... I seem to be on the edge of an abyss when confronting this question. On the one hand, it is clear that I cannot find a "controller" or a "me" independent from the action itself that's arising. On the other hand... I'm terrified of what it would mean if actions are "just happening". Does that mean my organism is just blindly reacting on its own to life? Like a robot or an animal acting purely on instinct? —I realize that these are just thoughts. But there seems to be this voice in my head that starts protesting very loudly when I consider the possibility of action without a self. Where would freedom/ responsibility lie then? —again, just thoughts, thoughts... They pull me very strongly into the "necessity" of an I. When I go into that fear, there seems to be a fear that without a self to control movement and willing, as the center of freedom and responsibility, life wouldn't make sense —thoughts, thoughts, thoughts... I think the self is scared to die! It's scared of being seen as an illusion! And it's trying to protect itself by telling me all this. But... what if there's nothing that could even die in the first place? What if "intending" is just happening without the need of a self to be the "intender"? Ahhhh... so close to the abyss!

When you are breathing is breathing just happening?

It... is... just... happening...

LOOK in DE and tell me: can you find something that is controlling these things?

No...

Is it possible that thoughts about a self are only thoughts about a self?

Yes... this seems to be the case...

Can you find thoughts about a self in DE?

Yes I can see them.

If thoughts come and go and there are sometimes gaps between thoughts does that mean that the ‘You’ ‘Me’ ‘I’ that you take yourself to be sometimes disappears?

If the "self" is constructed by thinking... then what happens to it when there's no thinking? But life is still happening... So life is different from that "self". So life doesn't need a "sense of self" in order to happen, because it goes on even without thinking. Yes, it seems like I'm constantly adding an "extra layer" to life by having thoughts of a self. Ahh. I just want to see the truth! I feel so close, so close... but it cannot be like this... there's a lot of resistance arising. Is it really that simple? Is all so simple? It seems so absurdly simple... so utterly obvious... it cannot be. It cannot be. I feel like I am one step away from falling into the abyss. There's a lot of emotions arising. I don't know what's going on.

What is ‘me-ness’ a label for? Look into DE for it and wait for an answer…NOT a labelled one….look for a KNOWING.

The "me-ness" seems to be a thought that is just referencing more thinking. There isn't anything in DE that has that label. Sensations and thoughts and even actions don't have any "me-ness" in them. It's just life happening. Life doesn't need any "me-ness" for it to happen. The me-ness that is labeled seems like a vicious cycle. It creates more thoughts about "me" which in turn create more "me-thinking" which in turn seem to validate the former, etc., etc. It's like a house of cards. Like a huge building built on... nothing.

When you saw your hand moving where were the sensations of ‘hand’ happening? Were they happening in your hand or were they happening in awareness, e.g. sensations arising?

In awareness. There's only "hand" as sensations in awareness.

Look at your hand in DE and start flipping it. Can you see a self in your Direct Experience controlling it?

I cannot. Just the thoughts of a self.

What does the label ‘Free will’ point towards?

Towards a thought. It's a thought that "this is how things are/should be". Not a direct experience.

Is agent just a label? When you look in DE can you find the thing that ‘agent’ is a label for?

It's a label, yes. No, I cannot find an "agent" in DE. Only thoughts about an agent.


...I feel like I'm one step away from... truth. But it feels dizzying and terrifying to keep going. It feels like everything is open before me. Like truth is blatantly obvious and staring at me in the face, but I'm still hesitating to acknowledge it. Like there's still a thread of resistance, of attachment to the old worldview because I don't know what will happen if it collapses.

Help!

If your ability to think was taken away, would you be able to ‘intend’ to do anything?

Yes, I think so. Thought and intention seem to be two separate processes. It's as if they were both somehow "arising" and being perceived in consciousness but it doesn't seem like one depends on the other.

No. Look at the definition of the word (label) ‘Intention’ which is: to have a plan or aim.....this involves thinking (thought). They are definitely NOT two separate processes.

Therefore isn’t intention just a labelled thought? What is it a label for?

It seems like "intention" is the mind attempting to explain how movement happens around the idea of an "I", like a story the mind creates as to how moving the body happens (it moved because "I" intended for it to happen). But when I look, there doesn't seem to be anything "intending" anything separate from the act itself. So it doesn't seem to be a labor for anything that exists in reality.

The mind uses thought to try to explain everything....that’s the problem!

Is the word ‘Self’ just a label?

Yes, it's just a label that the mind attaches to a bunch of processes that are occurring.
These ‘instructions’ would be thoughts right?
Yeah, I guess. I was trying to point at the "thing" or the "process" that makes movement or "intending" possible. I.e., there's something that happens that then causes my hand to move. It doesn't just move on its own. Like an acting, or a mental "willing".

Yes, there is a process that makes the hand move but IT IS NOT A SELF. If you looked inside your brain at the neurons and synapses that were involved in this process would you find a doer or a self?

Do thoughts just come and go and come and go and come and go?

Yes...
“There must be a controller”...isn’t this just a thought??
Yes, definitely this is a thought and not based on DE.
You are assuming that there is a controller. Look in DE and describe this controller for me please.
No controller can be found. Just the very entrenched belief that there is a controller making everything happen. There's a kind of vertigo and a fear when confronting this fact.

it is only a recurring thought. We all tend to take our thinking far too seriously.

What do you THINK would like the idea of THINKING that it can control anything?

I don't understand this question.

The idea of control is a story we tell ourselves. We cannot really control our thoughts in any meaningful way. If we can’t really control our thoughts, what can we control? The answer is NOTHING because a self that does not exist and therefore has no control.

When you are walking is walking just happening?

I don't know... I seem to be on the edge of an abyss when confronting this question. On the one hand, it is clear that I cannot find a "controller" or a "me" independent from the action itself that's arising. On the other hand... I'm terrified of what it would mean if actions are "just happening". Does that mean my organism is just blindly reacting on its own to life? Like a robot or an animal acting purely on instinct? —I realize that these are just thoughts. But there seems to be this voice in my head that starts protesting very loudly when I consider the possibility of action without a self. Where would freedom/ responsibility lie then? —again, just thoughts, thoughts... They pull me very strongly into the "necessity" of an I. When I go into that fear, there seems to be a fear that without a self to control movement and willing, as the center of freedom and responsibility, life wouldn't make sense —thoughts, thoughts, thoughts... I think the self is scared to die! It's scared of being seen as an illusion! And it's trying to protect itself by telling me all this. But... what if there's nothing that could even die in the first place? What if "intending" is just happening without the need of a self to be the "intender"? Ahhhh... so close to the abyss!

You already said it: you cannot kill something that does not exist. Here is an example: I know that the word ‘self’ is just a label for something that does not exist. I love sailing. I’m studying for my Yacht Skipper’s theory exams just now and I am away for a full week of days and nights soon around the islands of the Inner Hebrides of Scotland to be fully assessed for competency in sailing a large boat from A to B with other peoples lives in my care. I know that I don’t have a self that is in control of any of that but I know that passing my theory will happen, I know that passing my competency will happen and if they throw my ass off the boat and call me a bum that could happen too. There isn’t a self studying the materials everyday and there won’t be a self at the helm steering just like there isn’t a self at the helm of your boat steering the way. There is no self anywhere to be hurt or harmed by any of it. When you realise that there is no self you will probably just breathe a sigh of relief and life will go on. Your abilities and talents and your love of life will remain but you will know longer suffer via thoughts that will lie to you and tell you that you are afraid. When you really stare your demons down they start to evaporate right in front of you....they never were real.

Can you find thoughts about a self in DE?

Yes I can see them.

When you are looking in DE sometimes thoughts will pop into your head and that’s ok, they will come and go and when they go what is left over is the true essence of you, peaceful and timeless and amazing. It is not the fact of a thought popping into your head it is whether you have a thought about that thought....therefore it’s not our thinking that is bothering us...thinking will just happen...let it. It is our thinking about our thinking that creates things like a ‘self’. Have more full stops in your thinking and less commas!

If thoughts come and go and there are sometimes gaps between thoughts does that mean that the ‘You’ ‘Me’ ‘I’ that you take yourself to be sometimes disappears? If the "self" is constructed by thinking... then what happens to it when there's no thinking? But life is still happening... So life is different from that "self". So life doesn't need a "sense of self" in order to happen, because it goes on even without thinking.

Yes, it seems like I'm constantly adding an "extra layer" to life by having thoughts of a self. Ahh. I just want to see the truth! I feel so close, so close... but it cannot be like this... there's a lot of resistance arising. Is it really that simple? Is all so simple? It seems so absurdly simple... so utterly obvious... it cannot be. It cannot be. I feel like I am one step away from falling into the abyss. There's a lot of emotions arising. I don't know what's going on.

Yes, it is that simple. It is only thoughts of a fictitious ‘Me’ that complicate it. You see what I mean....this is thinking about thinking. This is why looking in DE is so helpful, when we are really in DE we are present, we are really aware, perhaps deep down we know we don’t need all that extra thinking for us to feel really alive....in fact it just gets in the way.

What is ‘me-ness’ a label for? Look into DE for it and wait for an answer…NOT a labelled one….look for a KNOWING.
The "me-ness" seems to be a thought that is just referencing more thinking.

There isn't anything in DE that has that label. Sensations and thoughts and even actions don't have any "me-ness" in them. It's just life happening. Life doesn't need any "me-ness" for it to happen. The me-ness that is labeled seems like a vicious cycle. It creates more thoughts about "me" which in turn create more "me-thinking" which in turn seem to validate the former, etc., etc. It's like a house of cards. Like a huge building built on... nothing.

Yes absolutely, you are beginning to see how thinking about thinking is stopping you from real seeing. Seeing is letting go.

When you saw your hand moving where were the sensations of ‘hand’ happening? Were they happening in your hand or were they happening in awareness, e.g. sensations arising?
In awareness. There's only "hand" as sensations in awareness.
Look at your hand in DE and start flipping it. Can you see a self in your Direct Experience controlling it?

I cannot. Just the thoughts of a self.
What does the label ‘Free will’ point towards?
Towards a thought. It's a thought that "this is how things are/should be". Not a direct experience.
Is agent just a label? When you look in DE can you find the thing that ‘agent’ is a label for?
It's a label, yes. No, I cannot find an "agent" in DE. Only thoughts about an agent.

Try and put your thinking into perspective. Thinking was only ever mean to serve us as a tool and that’s it. It’s as if I would pull a screwdriver out my toolbox every day but do it so often that I didn’t know where the screwdriver started and I finished. We are supposed to use the tool of thought but know when to just let it go and drop back into the tool box.

...I feel like I'm one step away from... truth. But it feels dizzying and terrifying to keep going. It feels like everything is open before me. Like truth is blatantly obvious and staring at me in the face, but I'm still hesitating to acknowledge it. Like there's still a thread of resistance, of attachment to the old worldview because I don't know what will happen if it collapses.

Omar, take a look at the answers and questions above then let them settle for a couple of days and post on Monday. If you want to post in the mean time please do so. Relax and see what comes up in the gaps between thinking about this.

Help!

Hello Steve.

I have continued to explore this process and the idea of non-self during the last few days, and I notice I have a strange experience. I feel like I get an "understanding" of non-self, or like I get very, very close to "seeing it", and then there's a moment (this is hard to describe but I don't know how else to explain it) where all my thinking becomes concentrated into a single point, which is a kind of narrative about non-self... but this very narrative somehow has a self in it. As if the self had become cornered and it identifies with the idea of non-self as its last resource.

I notice many things in my life have changed, like I don't take things personally anymore and I'm much more able to watch my emotions without identifying with them, so there's definitely been a shift in perspective, but I also feel like I haven't fully seen non-self yet... like it hasn't fully clicked. It's as if I kept walking very close to an abyss but then retreat before jumping.

I hope this makes sense.

I'm very excited to keep going in this process.

Thank you.

Hi Omar,

but this very narrative somehow has a self in it. As if the self had become cornered and it identifies with the idea of non-self as its last resource.

The shift in perception can be quite subtle. Don’t look for absolutes….there are none. Thoughts that are looking for a definite yes or no to a self being there are just more thoughts referring back to thoughts about wanting to know and so the cycle goes on. Stop thinking so much and JUST LOOK!

Over the next couple of days if any thoughts of ‘self’ come up look for a simple ‘knowing’ within you that those thoughts are just ‘selfing’ thoughts that you just allow to come and go and do nothing about.


Even after awakening thought with content can still happen, old residual patters can reappear and doesn’t need to be a problem as long as you see it for what it is…just thinking (why do so many people take their own thinking so seriously?). As soon as we learned language, language (label) based thought started to appear in our heads. The problem isn’t our thinking (if we see it for what it is) the problem is our thinking about our thinking. If you just had a thought with a full stop at the end of it and it just passed in and out of consciousness that would be ok but many keep thinking about their thinking. In other words instead of a full stop they just add a comma and turn a single carriage thought into an entire train.

Take your time over the next questions and even look at your own answers to the following questions and ask, ‘is that true?.’

There is no self, no doer, no controller and there never has been.

Is this true?

Is it clear?

If anything is not clear, what is not clear?

There is no self, no doer, no controller and there never has been.

Is this true?

Okay... I'm looking in DE. I can see there is just the "flow of life" happening, and I can see how this doesn't need a controller. Everything is happening without the need of anybody "doing it". Then I notice the question arising "but how can I know I have really 'seen no-self'? What if there's something I'm still missing?" I notice this is a thought. It's still the thought that I need to "find something" instead of just seeing what is.

So somehow this: "There is no self, no doer, no controller and there never has been" feels true, but I don't know how I could reach a definite conclusion.

Is it clear?

It still doesn't feel like a definite knowing. Perhaps because it's harder to know something in the negative? i.e., I know there are visual impressions arising in consciousness, I know there are thoughts arising in consciousness. But if I ask myself "is there a self"... then I don't know what I'm looking for. How can I "directly" see this?

If anything is not clear, what is not clear?

I guess... I don't know what I'm looking for. I know I'm "supposed" to see that there's no self, and know it clearly and beyond doubt, in the same way that I see other things in DE. But I'm not entirely sure whether I'm really seeing non-self, or just thinking about non-self.

Don’t look for absolutes….there are none. Thoughts that are looking for a definite yes or no to a self being there are just more thoughts referring back to thoughts about wanting to know and so the cycle goes on.

Yes, I can see this. Even thoughts about non-self, or about wanting to find non-self are just thoughts and not SEEING. I will never find truth in thoughts, just... more thoughts. Truth is always present here and now, fully revealed. (Otherwise it wouldn't be Truth).

In experience... there's just experience.

Thoughts about non-self make as little sense as thoughts about a self. They are both referring to something that doesn't exist.

Is seeing non-self simply... seeing life as it is?

Life is just happening. This is clear.

It is completely irrelevant to life whether the "self" thinks it's controlling it or not. This is also clear.

Have I crossed the gate?... I don't know. There doesn't seem to be any gate anyway. There doesn't seem to be anything to realize... To realize the absence of something that never was to begin with seems... so strange.

I don't know, Steve. I'm sorry. I don't know whether I have crossed the gate or not. Is it possible to be stuck with one foot inside the gate and the other outside?

I keep going back and forth as if there was "something" to see or to realize... and yet there isn't anything! This is the only truth, that there isn't anything, and everything is already as it is... Why do I want to find "something"? What could there possibly be to find? And yet I wish I had some certainty. I wish some master would come and tell me: "yes, you have realized non-self" or "not yet".

I’m travelling today Omar. I’ll post tomorrow. Thank you.

Hi Omar, I hope you are well.

Okay... I'm looking in DE. I can see there is just the "flow of life" happening, and I can see how this doesn't need a controller. Everything is happening without the need of anybody "doing it". Then I notice the question arising "but how can I know I have really 'seen no-self'? What if there's something I'm still missing?" I notice this is a thought. It's still the thought that I need to "find something" instead of just seeing what is.

When I was a kid I was told that Santa Claus brought presents and left them at the bottom of the Christmas tree. I really believed that Santa existed and it thrilled me that this fat old guy would give us stuff for nothing….give me a break I was 5 years old. As I grew older I realised that Santa didn’t exist and my parents had made him up just to make Christmas more interesting for me. When I found out that he didn’t really exist I didn’t sit and ruminate about whether he existed or not. I didn’t get lots of thoughts about the reality of Santa….I just knew. But how can I know that I have really ‘seen no-Santa? That’s the question that you have just asked. Can you see the senselessness in trying to see that you cant see??????? There is nothing there to see….accept it and move on. Let it go and smile you’ve arrived.

You seem to be allowing your own thoughts to disturb you. You will never really be able to control your thoughts so why not just accept that they will come and go and come and go and come and go and come and go and come and go….you get the idea. There is no watcher of thoughts…there is just awareness. You seem to think that Direct Experience is a tool….have you ever considered that Direct Experience might just be what you are? …and the existence of a self is just a lie that you and someone else told you?

Truth Lie Pointer

Here is how to distinguish truth from lies.

We often lie every day & don't realize it.

For example, the grocery clerk asks, "How are you?" You reply, "I'm fine." While, yes. there is a sense in which we are always fine, even in the middle of suffering, at that moment, you were grieving the death of your dog, you had a slight sore throat & you had a headache, but you didn't feel like sharing all of that with the grocery clerk, so you lied, "I'm fine."

Also, it matters none at all how "distant" the remembered lie is. Besides the fact that time itself is fictional, a kind if lie, as we recall the lie it becomes present in this moment, as if it were happening now. This brings the body Sensation that accompanies lying.

Lies can be intentional or unintentional, conscious or unconscious, even so automatic that we ourselves are fooled.

The story of a separate "self" is a lie.

This is the lie you came here to see through. Therefore, it is helpful to notice the body Sensation of lying as one of the tools for finding the truth of no self.

You want to be in touch with body Sensations & able to clearly express them in words. This will help.

Lies are usually felt in the heart or solar plexus as a contraction that we may label as tight, heavy or tense.

In contrast, truth is usually expansive. We may call it loose, light or relaxed.

First, can you remember a time when you lied to someone you loved?

Here we count anything, lies we think of as "big" or "small" that "matter" or don't "matter."

How are you? I'm fine. No, your knee hurts, but you don't feel like discussing it with the grocery clerk.

It's a lie. A seemingly "bigger" one will work better for this exercise.

Find the lie. I don't need the whole story, just a few key words to refer to it.

Then scan your body for any Sensation (DE or Direct Experience), particularly in the gut or maybe the heart. Check very closely.

What is found?

If you think the memory you used wasn't clear enough, find another one or lie to yourself right now, make something up.

1 + 1 = 14 is a lie.

I love eating worms is (probably) a lie.

Or call up a video of a lying politician & notice what Sensations arise as you listen.

I will give you a clue: it is not that peaceful Sensation you felt before when you omitted "I." (refers to an exercise I gave before this one)

Please report back with what body Sensations (not interpretations) you feel. Bodies can feel hot or cold, heavy or light, contraction or expansion, etc.

"Peaceful" or “anxious” is an interpretation of a body Sensation, not the Sensation itself, for example.

Do you see that?

What is found?

Yes, there is a contraction in the chest as I think of the lie.

"Peaceful" or “anxious” is an interpretation of a body Sensation, not the Sensation itself, for example.

Do you see that?

Yes. This is clear.

I just knew. But how can I know that I have really ‘seen no-Santa? That’s the question that you have just asked. Can you see the senselessness in trying to see that you cant see?

Yes, but in the case of the self it's a conscious belief but it's also related to a bunch of unconscious processes. For example, I notice that I still have desire, or I still dread pain. But isn't desire assuming there's an "I" that can "get" something? And doesn't dreading pain assume that there's an "I" who is "owning" the pain? If I really knew I had no self at all then shouldn't I have no more desires? And be indifferent to pain? It's as if I had seen through the most obvious layer of self, but am I not at a subtler level still "owning" parts of my experience?