The Gate

Hi Bill, thanks for your help. Right now i am aware of the fact that there is no i..but, i still feel there is an i when interacting with others. When i sit and observe them with no interaction, i can see life unfolding with no i's anywhere. But programming, habits, whatever keep me from seeing it otherwise.

to the point Nils made about centering self as awareness, yes i see that was exactly what i was doing. i was expanding myself outward as awareness, and thinking there was no i, so i was only awareness. woa....ego is a tricky thing. i will keep looking for the i, and looking for the truth, no matter what the cost.
thank you, lonil

Hi Lonil,

Liberation is not a thought, a feeling or a state.
Its really so ordinary that we have almost totally missed it.
But it has been here constantly.
What we're looking at here is just everyday reality.
Not some special 'state' or feeling.
Just ordinary reality... what has been in front of us our whole life.
We LOOK.
We SEE that 'I' is just a thought.
just like chair is a thought; I is a thought.
It is through direct experience that this is seen.
Its like we want you to look with fresh eyes at the truth of common everyday experience.
Its not hidden. Its just a shift in perspective.
Do not expect fireworks. they may not happen. Each person is different.
All of the emotions we have had in the past are still here.. it just seems there is much less stickiness to them.
Remember that we see through the illusion of the self, but its not destroyed.
Your conditioning is going to continue. It'll be your 'work' probably for the rest of your life.

About the awareness thing... no big deal.
There is awareness.
The 'I' is not it....
but this Awareness contains all is all
Awareness might also be known as many different names.... Life, Absolute, Clarity, God, Open Intelligence....
We don't like to get hung up on this though... no one knows for sure...

I see that you have seen that thoughts come and go.
What about 'your' things?
How do we possess something?
If I asked you about your house or where you live, would you say it's your house? or just a house?
How does something get to be 'yours'?

Lets look at the body and see if there is an owner or entity controlling it.
Lift one of your hands. either one.
Move it to the right. Now move it left. Look with your eyes what is happening. Did a self move the hand?
Or did the hand just move?
Direct observation. Move it again. Check it.
Which is more true, the hand moved, or a self moved the hand?

another exercise on this:
Look with your direct experience here.
Is there an entity in control?
LOOK with all your senses and see if you can find one.
Stop thinking, and use all your 5 senses to look for it.
Try it a few times...
Can you find anything?

Report back what you find.

Bill

Good Morning Bill,
to answer your question about "things", house, clothes, car, etc., etc., are all just things. They only become "my" things when i label them as such...but if there is no "I", me, self, how can i possess them?

There is no entity controlling the body. It just automatically happens.

There is no entity in control here with this experience. Once thinking stops, and just observing i see there is none.
Wow! everything is the same but different some how. my mind tells me i am just repeating what i have read from other posts, but there is something different. i can't put it into words.

oh, BTW...we are neighbors, i am MST :D

Good Morning Bill,
to answer your question about "things", house, clothes, car, etc., etc., are all just things. They only become "my" things when i label them as such...but if there is no "I", me, self, how can i possess them?

There is no entity controlling the body. It just automatically happens.

There is no entity in control here with this experience. Once thinking stops, and just observing i see there is none.
Wow! everything is the same but different some how. my mind tells me i am just repeating what i have read from other posts, but there is something different. i can't put it into words.

oh, BTW...we are neighbors, i am MST :D

Lonil - from what you're telling me... you are thru the gate.
The feeling that things are the same yet somehow different is a telltale sign.

Let me go ahead and ask you our final questions.
Other guides will look at this also.
Please elaborate and give me everything you've got on all of them
We'll be able to see if there's anything missing...
Good for you!!

Bill

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Answer these when you are ready, fully, and from your own looking.

1) Is there a 'me', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works.

3) How does it feel to see this?

4) How would you describe it to somebody who has never heard about this illusion but is curious about it.

5) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

To answer your questions:
1. No- there is no "me" anywhere, way, shape or form- there never was.
2.The illusion of a seperate self began with "I", "MY",this is my toy, my shoes, etc. It begins early in childhood, probably around age two when a child begins to recognize "I", or mine, my mommy, my daddy, my whatever, and the labeling continues. Each time there is a label of I, me , mine, it is reinforced and becomes stronger until we feel we are a separate self.
3.It is liberating--i have been observing interacting with others today, and seeing there is no "I", it was more pleasurable. When a thought arises that once would have gripped my whole being, with no "I" in it, it doesn't much matter. Same with thoughts of the past-no "I", it's just a story, nothing personal.
4.How do you describe something to someone when you can't describe it to yourself? LOL But if they were curious, i would do what is done on this forum, tell them to look for the "I", behind every thought, action, and spoken word. Where is the "I"?
5.The last bit that really took me further was taking the "I" out of everything..."my" possessions, "my" story. when the "I" is out of it it is just what it is. i'm sure "I" will get back into the game again and again, but now i know to look behind the "I", find the illusion of the "I" that never was there to begin with. For that, I thank you Bill, and all those who point the way. Blessings, and great gratitude!

Lonil - great work!
Our guides liked all your answers.
If you feel like you need more inquiry, or if there's anything lingering, we can deal with it here.
Just respond back.. I won't close this thread yet.
Thanks for your willingness to take a deep look.

So now you will notice you are blue in color.
There are a few extra places on the website that are opened up to you.
There are a few other groups too, once you get there I'd be happy to point
them out. I will invite you to join our Facebook aftercare group, Unleashed.
I will send you an email with instructions on how to enter it.
And if you are interested in guiding at some point in the future, just let
us know.
Very nice to work with you, even for a short time, and I'm very happy for you.

Namaste
Bill

I'm blue already? Wow! i'm sure there is more , but right now i can't think of anything. i just ask where is the "I" constantly, and as i do life is just better...so hard to explain. I always thought once I was liberated I would be this great GURU full of knowledge,love, all seeing, all knowing...LOL that's so funny now! That somehow a miracle would occur...well it has...and it really is a very big one...just a subtle one, with no bells and whistles, just a huge truth. Having lived my entire life based on a lie, and now i can see that, is a miracle!

Thanks Bill, for your concern and willingness to be here.