Looking and seeing

[Lucia73]

Dear Cheryl,

Here are my answers, using a real apple.

Code: Select all

What about the content of thoughts, what do they describe?

Thoughts describe the apple idea, they put sensations in words, they say “it’s a red apple, it seems juicy, maybe it’s not ok to eat apples after dinner “ and the story goes on. They’re like a chat in my head.

Is there really an ‘apple’ here, or only color and a thought ABOUT ‘apple’?
Can ‘apple’ be found in actual experience

?

There is a real apple: there is its smell, color, form, the sensation of the peel sometimes smooth sometimes rough. Apple (this apple) can be found in actual experience.

However, is an apple actually known?

Yes, this apple is known, it’s real in front of my eyes, instead “an apple” is an idea, a thought.

❤️
Lucia

[CherylVT]

Dear Lucia,

there is its smell, color, form, the sensation of the peel sometimes smooth sometimes rough. Apple (this apple) can be found in actual experience.

In Direct Experience, there is
smell of the apple
color(s) of the apple
form or shape of the apple
sensation of the peel

and, i would add, thought or concept of an apple.

But is there an apple?
Is 'an apple' actually known? (Or is it just a label?)
Is there really an ‘apple’ here, or only color and a thought ABOUT ‘apple’?
Can ‘apple’ be found in actual/direct experience?


If I ask you what color socks you are wearing right now you have two ways to answer:

1. You can think about it, trying to remember, or guessing what color they are.

2. You can have a look at your socks and see what color they ACTUALLY are!

You will agree that only by looking you could be 100% certain, right?

For the purpose of this inquiry, it is crucial that you are clear about this difference in the two ways of answering and stick only to the second way. We are only interested in looking at and seeing what is actually going on. We are only interested in Direct (Actual) Experience (DE/AE)- the experience right now and right here.

Direct or Actual Experience is:

Seeing
Hearing
Sensing (not emotion - emotion is sensation plus thoughts/labels)
Tasting
Smelling
Thoughts Arising (but not their content, what the thought is ABOUT)

Please let me know if you are clear about this or if you would like any further clarification.

Love
Cheryl

[Lucia73]

Dear Cheryl,

But is there an apple?
Is 'an apple' actually known? (Or is it just a label?)
Is there really an ‘apple’ here, or only color and a thought ABOUT ‘apple’?
Can ‘apple’ be found in actual/direct experience?

I got it, it’s just a label. There is something here with a form labeled “apple”, a smell labeled “apple”, a taste labeled “apple” and so on.
“What’s in a name? That which we call a rose,by any other name would smell as sweet”
Shakespeare came in my mind to clarify 😊
Names are just labels, not the real thing and when you ask “can ‘apple’ be found in actual experience the answer is no. I can see colors, forms, sense the smell and taste, and find a thought about the concept of ‘apple’.

Thank you for the clarification
❤️
Lucia

[CherylVT]

Dear Lucia,

Congratulations!

Just to ensure that you are crystal clear about DE and labels related to it...here's an exercise that you can try as many times throughout the day as you can. Label daily activities, objects and emotions simply as colour/image, sound, smell, taste, sensation, thought as per the apple example.
For example, when having coffee in the morning, become aware of:
Seeing a cup, simply= image/color
Smelling coffee, simply = smell
Feeling the warmth of the coffee cup, simply = sensation
Tasting the coffee, simply = taste
Hearing the spoon stirring the coffee, simply = sound
Thought about drinking the coffee, simply = thought

Break down daily activities into these categories (which are all Actual/Direct Experience) and report back with lists EXACTLY like the one above. Please write a few examples from your daily life.

Love
Cheryl

[Lucia73]

Hi Cheryl,

Break down daily activities into these categories (which are all Actual/Direct Experience) and report back with lists EXACTLY like the one above. Please write a few examples from your daily life.

I took as example typing at the keyboard.
I see it as color. I realized that what I see is all colour, I see the various objects, people, animals etc as colours. The funny thing is that I like to draw and paint, so it should have already been a clear concept to me...but the mind so far is stronger than the evidence. First thing is the tought “this is my keyboard” and then the following “no wait, I have to look at the DE”.

Seeing the keyboard= simply colors
Touching the keys= simply sensation
Hearing the sound of the keys = simply sound
Thoughts arising.

Another example is sitting at my desk.
Seeing it = colors
Touching it = sensation
Lots of thoughts arising

Watering my plants:
Seeing them: seeing colors
Touching them: sensation
Dropping water: sound
Thoughts arising

It's clear that the DE is made of sensations, sounds, colors, smells and toughts arising. The problem so far is that the thoughts and the labels are very strong and come first. Only if I put attention I stop and look at the sensations, not at the labeling.


Love,
Lucia

[CherylVT]

Dear Lucia,

Here is an exercise which examines the way in which the mind labels experience - it takes about 20 minutes and you will need a pen a paper. This exercise is broken into 10-minute lots.
For each 10 minute period pay attention to any bodily sensation i.e. is there any tightening, or any relaxing?

For the first ten minutes write down what you are experiencing right now using the word “I”.
For example: I am sitting on a chair, I am hearing a clock ticking, I am looking at a computer screen, I am feeling hungry.
Get right to the point, no past or future fantasy, just a plain description of your experience right here and now.

Then for the next ten minutes continue writing down what you are experiencing but this time without using the word “I”. Just describe the experience as it is happening using verbs.
For example: Sitting on a chair, typing, breathing, blinking, hearing the clock.
(Again, watch what is happening in the body.)

At the end of the twenty minutes compare the two ways in which the experience was labelled and answer the following four questions:
1. Is one truer than the other, and If so, which one?
2. What is here without labels?
3. Do labels affect the experience or just describe it?
4. Did you notice any differences in the body?


Love,
Cheryl

[Lucia73]

Ciao Cheryl,

Here are my experiences:

I am sitting in the sofa. I am looking at my iPad. I am typing on it. I’m thinking about what to do now. I feel the warmth of the fireplace. I decide to do some knitting. I feel the whole under my fingers, I see its colors, I hear the sound of the fire.

Looking at my dogs, petting them, playing with them. Time to feed them: going in the kitchen and taking their food, feeling the cold bowls, hearing the sound the dogs kibble as it falls into the bowls, smelling their smell, looking and hearing they eating.
Preparing the water to cook pasta, turning on the induction plate, taking the pasta from the shelf, taking a pan, taking the olive oil and the tomato……..

At the end of the twenty minutes compare the two ways in which the experience was labelled and answer the following four questions:
Is one truer than the other, and If so, which one?

Somehow the second one seems to me truer…as if the “I” in the first one distracted attention from the action. The focus must be the action/experience. Maybe it’s an effect of the language, in Italian you do not have to always put the subject, you simply say verb+ complement because the verb carries the subject in it, depending on how is declined.
For example in English you say “I eat an apple” in Italian just “eat an apple” (mangio una mela).


2

. 2. What is here without labels?

There is my presence let me say, and the experience comes first.

3. Do labels affect the experience or just describe it?

They just describe the experience, right after the happening of the experience. I mean, first there is the experience and then the mind describe it.

4. Did you notice any differences in the body?

There is a feeling of relaxation when not using the “I” everywhere.


Thank you
❤️
Lucia

[CherylVT]

Dear Lucia,

Maybe the "I" doesn't adhere as tightly in Italian as it does in English???

Seeing = color and only color.
Shapes are concepts.

Here's a blog post from Goran Backlund, which describes seeing = color.

http://www.uncoveringlife.com/shift-enl ... /#more-879

Looking at this so-called lemon slice, what is really seen?

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/b2/59/1f ... a14c1.jpg

Love,
Cheryl

[Lucia73]

Thank you Cheryl for the link to the blog post of Goran Backlund, really interesting especially this part :

In other words, looking at a coffee cup, one is mostly focused on its coffee cup-ness (and thus its objectness), rather than the actual colors (which, again, are nothing but seeing) that make up one’s experience of it. Awakening happens when this veil of conceptuality is pierced. That’s when the shift occurs

I have to exercise a lot on this!

I like to draw and paint, and color is absolutely what define the subjects. In particular I draw flowers, so it’s very important to use the right shades of colors to obtain a realistic paint, as it popped out of the sheet. And recently I have learnt that when I am painting I do not have to think about the flower concept but just to the colors. No concepts = better drawings, more realistic. I have to apply this technique to the everyday life.

In the picture of the “lemon” there is just color: the white of the “space” and the shades of yellow of the “lemon”.

Thank you so much for your guidance ❤️
Lucia

[CherylVT]

Dear Lucia,

You can only be 100% certain by looking.

One of the things that veils DE is the phenomena of labeling.

Here is something Ilona wrote about labeling
https://markedeternal.blogspot.com/search?q=labels

Let’s use DE with seeing and hearing for a start

As you are sitting responding to this post describe……
What are you are seeing? (without labels.)

What are you are hearing? (without labels.)


Love,
Cheryl

[Lucia73]

Hello Cheryl,

Today

As you are sitting responding to this post describe……
What are you are seeing? (without labels.)

I see colors but there is a thought arising that gives a name to what I am seeing. Then another thought reminds me that names are just words, there is no substance in them. At this stage It makes perfectly sense to me that the act of seeing is perception of color. I understand that I cannot see an orange t-shirt because “t-shirt” is an empty label. But still I see an orange something.
Using the example of yesterday’s lemon, it was something different from a “real” lemon. In both cases I see let’s say the same colors, but I am seeing two completely different objects. I see colors but there is a knowing that there is no real lemon.
And also colors..aren’t they labels for a perception of light? I call orange a sensation in the brain, blue another and so on. Language is labels.
What I am trying to explain not very well is that I am conscious that I am seeing things around by perceiving their colors but in me there is a big sensation of “things”.

What are you are hearing? (without labels.)
Hearing it’s easier…I hear sounds and noises, and in the moment I pay attention to them my mind sticks a label: a car passing, the tv, my dogs barking etc. But at first impression they’re just sounds.

Send you love,
Lucia

[CherylVT]

Dear Lucia,

I am seeing things around by perceiving their colors but in me there is a big sensation of “things”.

"Thing-ness" doesn't drop away until much later in the process, way past the gate where LU is headed. So, for now, that belief in things is a habit from when you were very, very young, and your parents conceptualized the world for you. Ball. Cat. Mommy. Daddy. You have a head start by recognizing that color is color and may well be just light.

When I say, “Get in touch with the real,” I mean that which is actually here, that which does not disappear if you stop believing in it.

Imagine that you are holding a spoon. Imagine form, size, weight, temperature, keep it there, close your eyes, and feel the imaginary spoon.
Open your eyes; is there a spoon here, in real life?
So how did you see that there is no spoon?
What happened to the spoon?
Did it disappear or did it never exist?

Notice, that there was no boom and no bright light flashes in the eyes when the imaginary spoon was no longer imagined.
Remember this: a shift is not going to be more than this, it’s just a drop of belief- the glue that holds the illusion together.

Look around the room notice what is real. What is here now? Notice things, notice looking around the room. If you think that this world is not real, check it against an imaginary picture.

Love,
Cheryl

[Lucia73]

Hi Cheryl!

Imagine that you are holding a spoon. Imagine form, size, weight, temperature, keep it there, close your eyes, and feel the imaginary spoon.
Open your eyes; is there a spoon here, in real life?

No there isn’t any spoon.

So how did you see that there is no spoon?

When I open my eyes I do not see any spoon.

What happened to the spoon?

It was just a thought, nothing concrete.

Did it disappear or did it never exist?

It never exist.

Notice, that there was no boom and no bright light flashes in the eyes when the imaginary spoon was no longer imagined.
Remember this: a shift is not going to be more than this, it’s just a drop of belief- the glue that holds the illusion together.

Ok, no fireworks.

Look around the room notice what is real. What is here now? Notice things, notice looking around the room. If you think that this world is not real, check it against an imaginary picture.

First thing I see are my eye health capsules …ahahah!
Ok, I got it… I was feeling anxious about that, now I am fine.
thank you Cheryl :-D

Love and gratitude, Lucia

[CherylVT]

Dear Lucia,

Here is another exercise:

Close your eyes and imagine you are in the kitchen. Just visualize and look around, notice where things are put. Notice the space, the feel of it.
This is an image, it can trigger feelings and contractions - expansions, thought stories and feelings attached to them.

Open your eyes and see how an image can be created and explored in the mind.

Go to the kitchen and look at the same things that you saw in the image.
How does imagining and experiencing the same things differ?
Is the image of the kitchen and experience of the kitchen the same?

If I were to tell you that Santa is real, would you see Santa in the room right now?
Can you see the difference between real and imagined?

Self is imagined. You can look for the real self, but can it be found?
Look in each sense: Can you find the self?
(Is there a self in touch, smelling, tasting, seeing and hearing?) Test with each sense.

Focus on the image of “me,” the separate individual entity.
Is it an image or an actual entity?

Is the controller/manager in a head?
If so, how does a self give commands to the body?
Do you make things happen?

Love,
Cheryl

[Lucia73]

Hello dear Cheryl,

Go to the kitchen and look at the same things that you saw in the image.
How does imagining and experiencing the same things differ?
Is the image of the kitchen and experience of the kitchen the same?

When I imagine things I am not able to involve all the senses, I can create an image not very persistent in the mind and that’s all. No smelling, no hearing, and absolutely not tactile sensations. Also the image I create is a small part of the kitchen, not the whole room I can see with my eyes: I focus on the table image and there isn’t anything else, then on the part where there is the oven and the image of the table vanishes, and so on.
The experience of the kitchen involves all the senses, because I see in a very vivid manner, I hear sounds, I fell the smells and I touch the things. When I look at the table, I can see all the room.

If I were to tell you that Santa is real, would you see Santa in the room right now?
Can you see the difference between real and imagined?

Unfortunately no, I wouldn’t see Santa in the room :-) he doesn’t exists.

Self is imagined. You can look for the real self, but can it be found?
Look in each sense: Can you find the self?
(Is there a self in touch, smelling, tasting, seeing and hearing?) Test with each sense.

I can find it anywhere, certainly not using the eyes, the ears or the other senses. It’s not something concrete, it’s a feeling.

Focus on the image of “me,” the separate individual entity.
Is it an image or an actual entity?

No, not an image nor a separate entity, just a feeling of “me”. I mean, if I stop and think about it, I see that it isn’t something real: it isn’t my body, but it seems to be something in my head, as it was the owner of body and thoughts. They’re mine and not yours….this is the feeling.

Is the controller/manager in a head?
If so, how does a self give commands to the body?
Do you make things happen?

Yes, it seems to be in my head. Sometimes it seems to give commands to the body when I force myself to do something I do not want to do, for instance go out of bed when the alarm rings, or going to the gym, etc. Otherwise I notice that my body goes on automatic. I am typing and my body knows how to do, there isn’t any command. The same as driving the car, walking, eating, it’s all automatic, thanks to the brain trained in all these actions.
The commands are given by a thought, kinda “ ok let’s do it” and I go out of the bed. It’s a decision thought, followed by an action. In this sense I can say I make things happen: I decide to cook dinner and tonight we can eat something. If I decided to walk the dogs, there wouldn’t be dinner ready for my family tonight. The most strong thought wins the battle and the consequence is dinner or no dinner.
It seems to me that I can perform actions deliberately: to submit this text now it’s a deliberate action that I call “my decision”, and it is followed (or not if I decide to not send it) by an action made by this body, not another body. It’s something created in this brain, not coming from anywhere else. Ok we are not free and all the things we make depend from our past, our actual circumstances, culture, education, environment and so on, but ultimately the decision of clicking on “submit” seems to be mine.

I do not know...the more I look and the more complicated mechanics I see in the occurrence of my actions. I think that in the end everything is the result of the factors I mentioned above, but it’s not very encouraging. It’s as if we have no freedom at all….

Love ❤️
Lucia