The Gate

Hey MN,

Tell me ONE noise that you heard when doing this?

The rustle of the bedding

Great! Now can you repeat the exercise and tell me:-

- How is it known there is bedding?
- What is it that says there is bedding?
- What is the actual experience of ‘hearing rustle of bedding’.

Try to do the exercise by looking at actual experience, rather than give an intellectual answer [where actual experience = what is actually happening ie sound, thought, smell, taste, sensation, colour) as opposed to thoughts about it]

Love, Kay

Hi kay
Sorry for sliw response.
Only back from a wee trip to north of scotland - phoneless.
Will be back conversing tomorrow, if that is ok?
Best
MN

Hi kay
Sorry for sliw response.
Only back from a wee trip to north of scotland - phoneless.
Will be back conversing tomorrow, if that is ok?
Best
MN
Oh yes how do i support this site- are donnations poss

Hi MN...no problem, thanks for letting me know.

Yes, donations are possible. Just go to the following page. Many thanks for your thoughtfulness.

https://www.liberationunleashed.com/about/donate/

Love, Kay

How is it known there is bedding?
- What is it that says there is bedding?
- What is the actual experience of ‘hearing rustle of bedding’.

How is it known there is bedding?

It is known there is bedding because I knew I was in bed and the sensation of the pressure and warmth of the bedding on my skin was labelled ‘bedding’. This coincided with the sound of the bedding move as I moved.
This exercise is hard because I am recalling an event – at the moment I sit in my study. Looking at computer, thinking remembering supposing and typing.

- What is it that says there is bedding?

A thought said there is bedding, it was recognized from the sensory input and I recognised it was bedding automatically.
But also the memories, thoughts and images that “popped up” into mind. When I ‘discussed’ inside or thought about the experience in order to communicate with you retrospectively the word bedding was used.

- What is the actual experience of ‘hearing rustle of bedding’.

I cannot answer this directly – other than describing the memory of a set of thoughts, sensations and recognition.
Perhaps I should go back to bed…
I am defeated by this; can AE be recalled? I actually experience the cognitive dissonance and straining to know how to answer. Furthermore, I experience the thinking about what I just typed and the attempt to refine wat I typed. Then ‘I’ no longer actually experiences the dissonance, it becomes a like an object. The knower/thinker cant be known?
Rabbit hole??
How do you look and communcate at the same time?

How is it known there is bedding?

It is known there is bedding because I knew I was in bed and the sensation of the pressure and warmth of the bedding on my skin was labelled ‘bedding’.

That is all thought content and thought is the AE of thought and not the AE of bedding! Thought either points to AE or to further thoughts, which is pure story.

What is the AE of the label “pressure”? Is it sound, colour, sensation, smell or sound?

What is the AE of the “warmth”? Is it sound, colour, sensation, smell or sound?

What is the AE of “it is known there is bedding because I knew I was in bed” Is it AE of sound, colour, thought, sensation, smell or sound?

There is no “I” that knows anything! “I” is just another label that points to thoughts about and “I”. Where exactly is this “I”?

This coincided with the sound of the bedding move as I moved.

What is the AE of sound labelled “bedding move”? Is it colour, thought, sound, sensation, taste or smell?

What is the AE of “this coincided with the sound of the bedding move”? Is it colour, thought, sound, sensation, taste or smell?

This exercise is hard because I am recalling an event – at the moment I sit in my study. Looking at computer, thinking remembering supposing and typing.

It is very simple. You are simply putting ALL THOUGHTS aside, and looking at what is actually happening/appearing. Just like a toddler. A toddler knows nothing about anything, but is aware of colour, sound, smell, taste and sensation. They have no thoughts that are telling them stories about those things.

- What is it that says there is bedding?

A thought said there is bedding, it was recognized from the sensory input and I recognised it was bedding automatically.

Yes, exactly, it is a thought that says “there is bedding”? However what is the AE of bedding?

However, what is the AE of " it was recognized from the sensory input and I recognised it was bedding automatically"? Does that thought point to sound, colour, smell, taste, sensation or thought?

The label ‘bedding’ is AE of thought and not the AE of bedding
The sound labelled as ‘bedding’ is the AE of sound and not the AE of bedding
The image/colour labelled as ‘bedding’ is the AE of colour and not the AE of bedding.
The thoughts about bedding and what it is and what it is for etc are AE of thought and not the AE of bedding.
Can you see this?

So what is actually appearing is label + sound + image + thought about bedding But does bedding in AE actually exist?


But also the memories, thoughts and images that “popped up” into mind. When I ‘discussed’ inside or thought about the experience in order to communicate with you retrospectively the word bedding was used.

There is no such thing as memories. Just because we are becoming aware of AE doesn’t mean thought is going to stop automatically labelling objects or saying stuff about AE. You just put them aside and look at what actually is. And yes, we need to communicate, but we are communicating about AE and not stories such as " it was recognized from the sensory input and I recognised it was bedding automatically". That has nothing to do with AE other than the AE of thought!

- What is the actual experience of ‘hearing rustle of bedding’.

I cannot answer this directly – other than describing the memory of a set of thoughts, sensations and recognition.

Of course you can. The AE of “hearing rustle of bedding” is the AE of sound!

Perhaps I should go back to bed…

Yes, you were supposed to repeat the exercise so you could answer these questions. And not try recall the experience and answer from there. That is NOT becoming aware of AE. So yes, you were supposed to go back to bed and repeat the exercise. So please repeat the exercise and then answer the questions again.

I am defeated by this; can AE be recalled? I actually experience the cognitive dissonance and straining to know how to answer

AE does not need to be recalled. Are you not aware of colour, when is there never any colour? Are you not aware of sound when it appears? Are you not aware of sensation when it appears in the ‘body’? Are you not aware of smell and taste when they appear? Are you not aware of thoughts as they appear?


You are trying to think the answers and you will never get to see by thinking. Thinking is not the tool for this inquiry. LOOKING at AE is.

Love, Kay

What is the AE of the label “pressure”? Is it sound, colour, sensation, smell or sound?

sensation

What is the AE of the “warmth”? Is it sound, colour, sensation, smell or sound?

sensation

What is the AE of “it is known there is bedding because I knew I was in bed” Is it AE of sound, colour, thought, sensation, smell or sound?

though

There is no “I” that knows anything! “I” is just another label that points to thoughts about and “I”. Where exactly is this “I”?

Cant answer this - how does a thought have a place
Plese remind me what you mean by "label"

What is the AE of sound labelled “bedding move”? Is it colour, thought, sound, sensation, taste or smell?

sound

Can we look at somthing else this bedding malarky is only a menory?
I think you missed my previous response.
Pleses describe; how AE can be described after the event
Hope you well

Hell MN,

I want you to go back and reread and redo the exercises on your thread. Becoming aware of actual experience is not difficult. I don't know how much looking you are doing inbetween posts, but if you are not looking on a daily basis to become familiar with AE, then we are going to get nowhere fast.

You don't need me to redo the sound exercise with you. You can do it on your own. You have the exercise outline, so you choose something and do the exercise, and you don't have to wait a day inbetween to do part 2 of the sound exercise. You need to help yourself with this.

Love, Kay

Hi kay
Thanks for this.

I don't know how much looking you are doing inbetween posts, but if you are not looking on a daily basis to become familiar with AE, then we are going to get nowhere fast

.

I think i mentioned that a message did no appear to get through to you.
Time as been an issue - brief trip up north, full on weekend at buddhist centre and admission to hopital for surgery.
My mind is now clear of opiates and i will defo redo the sound wxercise.
Best
Mn

Ok great. Look forward to it. This exploration is best done by you responding on a daily basis. Momentum is a good thing.

Love, Kay

Hi Kay
The lenght of this reapose in not in proportion to the time I sent listening.

Tell me ONE noise that you heard when doing this?

The sound of a seagull crying.

- How is it known there is a seagull crying ?

The sound of the seagull crying

- What is it that says there is seagull crying?

A thought says there is a “seagull crying”
- What is the actual experience of ‘seagull crying”?
Listening to the sound

Now I spent some time looking at a strawberry

Is there really an ‘strwberry’ here, or only colour and a thought ABOUT ‘strawberry?

The colour/shape /form labeled “strawberry” is known

Can ‘apple’ be found in actual experience?

No only the experience of colour/shape/ form labeled “strawberry” is known
+
Smell labelled “strawberry” is known

However, is an apple actually known?

No only the colour, smell labeled strawberry are known.

But does the strawberry in AE actually exist?

No? actual experience is is image/colour/form, smell, sensation, taste and the simple knowing of thought label strawberry
Not at all convinced that the strawberry exist in in AE – it requires looking at and smelling of and labeling of ..
Would you try to explain what is meant by the term “label”
Thanks MN

Hello MN,

A label is just a thought. A label is a word/name used to identify and describe something ie objects. For example ‘apple’ is a label which points to an object that is described as a round sweet edible fruit of a tree, which has thin green or reddish skin and crisp flesh. When someone says they are going to eat an ‘apple’, you know what they are talking about don’t you? You don’t need them to tell you what it is, because the label ‘apple’ tells you exactly what it is. Just like when someone says they are going to walk their dog, you don’t need them to explain to you that a dog is classified as an animate object under the genus ‘animal’ and that it has 4 legs, fur, a tail and barks.

Tell me ONE noise that you heard when doing this?

The sound of a seagull crying.

- How is it known there is a seagull crying ?

The sound of the seagull crying

This question is asking you what is it that is saying it is a “seagull crying”? It is a thought that says the sound is that of a “seagull”. Without thought, how would that be known?

- What is it that says there is seagull crying?

A thought says there is a “seagull crying”

Yes, exactly. So thought is labelling the sound as a “seagull”.

- What is the actual experience of ‘seagull crying”?

Listening to the sound

It is simply the AE of sound. Thought then labels the sound as a "seagull" .


So you are clear about AE, let’s have a look at the apple again. If you have an ‘apple’ or any other piece of fruit or even a piece of cheese or chocolate will do….go get it and then place it in front of you on the table.

Now LOOK carefully.

1. The image of the ‘apple’ is the actual experience of colour and NOT the AE of an apple. The shape/form referred to as ‘apple’ is just different shades and patterns of colour. Ignore ALL thoughts and ‘mental’ images that appear of and about the ‘apple’ and just focus on the colour.

Does the colour itself suggest in any way that it knows anything about an ‘apple’? Or is it just simply AE of colour?
Without thought, without any preconceived ideas, how is it known that the colour appearing is that of an ‘apple’?

2. Now, pick up the ‘apple’ and close the eyes. Ignore ALL thoughts and ‘mental’ images that appear of and about the ‘apple’ and of ‘hands’ and just focus on the sensation.

Does the sensation itself suggest in any way that it is an apple, and that it knows anything about an ‘apple’? Or is it just simply AE of sensation?
Without thought, without any preconceived ideas, how is it known that it is the sensation has anything to do with an ‘apple’?

3. Now, take a bite of the ‘apple’. Ignore ALL thoughts and ‘mental’ images that appear of and about the ‘apple’ and just focus on the taste.

Does taste itself suggest in any way that it knows anything about an apple? Or is there just simply AE of taste?
Without thought, without any preconceived ideas, how is it known that it is the taste of an ‘apple’?

4. Now, have a smell of the ‘apple’. Ignore ALL thoughts and ‘mental’ images that appear of and about the ‘apple’ and just focus on the smell.

Does smell itself suggest in any way that it knows anything about an apple? Or is there just simple AE of smell?
Without thought, without any preconceived ideas, how is it known that it is the smell of an ‘apple’?

5. Now, listen to the sound of the ‘crunch of an apple’. Ignore ALL thoughts and ‘mental’ images that appear of and about the ‘apple’ and just focus on the sound.

Does the sound itself suggest in any way that it knows anything about an apple? Or is there just simple AE of sound?
Without thought, without any preconceived ideas, how is it known that it is the sound is that of an ‘apple’?

6. So now look at the label ‘apple and the thought “I am looking at, and eating an apple”.

Does the label itself or the thought itself know anything about an ‘apple’? Or are they just simply AE of label/thought?

The label ‘apple’ is the AE of thought and not the AE of an apple
The image labelled ‘apple’ is AE of colour and not the AE of an apple
The smell labelled ‘apple’ is AE of smell and not the AE of an apple
The taste labelled ‘apple’ is AE of taste and not the AE of an apple
The sound labelled ‘crunchy apple’ is AE of sound and not the AE of an apple
The sensation labelled as ‘hard, round apple’ is the AE of sensation and not the AE of an apple

Thought overlays actual experience with concepts. An example being the AE of colour is being labelled as an 'apple'.

So is there really actual experience of an ‘apple’, or what is actually appearing, what the actual experience is, is colour, sensation, taste, smell, sound, which thought then labels and describes as an 'apple'?
In other words, is an apple actually known or only thoughts about an apple are known?

Love, Kay

Hi Kay

Does the colour itself suggest in any way that it knows anything about an ‘apple’? Or is it just simply AE of colour?

YES

Without thought, without any preconceived ideas, how is it known that the colour appearing is that of an ‘apple’?

It is not known as ‘apple’

Does the sensation itself suggest in any way that it is an apple, and that it knows anything about an ‘apple’? Or is it just simply AE of sensation?

YES

Without thought, without any preconceived ideas, how is it known that it is the sensation has anything to do with an ‘apple’?

It is not known as ‘apple’ without thought or without any preconceived ideas

Does taste itself suggest in any way that it knows anything about an apple? Or is there just simply AE of taste?

There just simply AE of taste.

Without thought, without any preconceived ideas, how is it known that it is the taste of an ‘apple’?

It is not known as ‘apple’

Does smell itself suggest in any way that it knows anything about an apple? Or is there just simple AE of smell?

YES

Without thought, without any preconceived ideas, how is it known that it is the smell of an ‘apple’?

It is not known as the smell of ‘apple’ without thought or without any preconceived ideas

Does the sound itself suggest in any way that it knows anything about an apple? Or is there just simple AE of sound?

YES

Without thought, without any preconceived ideas, how is it known that it is the sound is that of an ‘apple’?

It cannot be known that the sound is that of an ‘apple’ without thought or without any preconceived ideas

Does the label itself or the thought itself know anything about an ‘apple’? Or are they just simply AE of label/thought?

The label itself knows nothing about an ‘apple’
The thought “I am looking at, and eating an apple” knpes nothing about an apple’
They are AE of label and thought

So is there really actual experience of an ‘apple’, or what is actually appearing, what the actual experience is, is colour, sensation, taste, smell, sound, which thought then labels and describes as an 'apple'?

NO

In other words, is an apple actually known or only thoughts about an apple are known?

YES

Be well
MN

Hello MN,

You answered 'YES' to a few questions, which didn't really tell me if you were answering yes to the first question or to the second questions. You may think I am being pedantic about this, however, if you aren't clear about AE, it will make the rest of the exploration very difficult.

In other words, is an apple actually known or only thoughts about an apple are known?

YES

What is the YES referring to here? That an apple is actually known or that only thoughts about an apple are known?

Love, Kay