philipped this is your thread

[nonaparry]

Today was a difficult day; feeling achy, tired, confused and frustrated.

i totally relate to that; when i was in the gate it seemed 'my' entire life was conspiring against 'me'. i was pounding at 'myself' to GET it!!!
Then i remembered my guide saying LOOK. And i stopped Thinking and LOOKed. With the eyes in this head. i noticed that all of life is just happening; not good, not bad, just What-it-IS-ing. No me anywhere.

Check it dear. And be kind. It really is just a matter of SEEing that 'self' is an illusion with no basis in reality.

Is it true? Is it true that to be a 'good' person, to pass that judgment on the idea of Philippe, that there is an "I" that needs control??

No, it's not true. But somehow I fall for that belief from time to time, or is it most of the time?

Easy to fall for a belief when we are not vigilant. Every thought that arises can be questioned: is it true?

Anytime an uncomfortable thought arises, check it. The more practice you get seeing through your stories, the easier it will become. i promise.

Notice the equivocal language you use; you *know* there is no separate self in reality, so you have to come up with vague language to describe the feeling that an imaginary 'self' is present. LOOK!

I had to laugh when I read your comment. It's so true. I'll try to pay more attention to that.

GOOD!!! Notice your equivocal thinking, too!! Vague ideas are vague so you don't have to commit to a falsehood!

Now understand the Enormity of what you experienced.

That's exactly it. There is a part of me that simply cannot take in the enormity of the experience. Just plain denial.

Take it slowly then. Let yourself take it in little by little. Walk out in Nature; it's simpler to see/accept it somehow out of doors where all the senses are stimulated.

isn't it true-er that there is expansion?

Often times it seems that I don't allow the awareness to take in the fullness of the experience, or let it expand to it's full extend.

There is a saying that it's not death we are most afraid of, but life! Fully living an expansive life can be intimidating; it means taking FULL responsibility.

It's interesting to see how for the melon, it's easy to accept there was none. Just a mind creation. More difficult for the self. Habit, as you say.

The melon trick is such a good one. Please use it whenever you feel a self!

love
Nona

[philipped]

Hi Nona,

Thank you for your kind words and support.

Check it dear. And be kind. It really is just a matter of SEEing that 'self' is an illusion with no basis in reality.

Two things are happening now: I am more apt at seeing thoughts that I identified strongly with. Thoughts that direct me to look, that tell me not to get caught into thoughts (!), that point me to my experience, etc. When I can see these thoughts just as thoughts, my mind starts hunting (pretty much literally) to try to find something else to attach the label "self" to. I do my best to see that happen too.

The second is that feeling of low grade anxiety when the mind does not find anything else to attach to. When I become aware of that anxiety, my mind tends to distracts itself away from the anxiety and the "hunting."

There is a saying that it's not death we are most afraid of, but life! Fully living an expansive life can be intimidating; it means taking FULL responsibility.

I both like that and get scared. But it is a good compass. Where do I refuse to take responsibility?

Cheers,

Philippe

[nonaparry]

I am more apt at seeing thoughts that I identified strongly with.

Good!!! Keep noticing; keep asking "Is it true?"

my mind starts hunting (pretty much literally) to try to find something else to attach the label "self" to.

Habit again. You know there is no self in reality. Why continue playing that game?

that feeling of low grade anxiety when the mind does not find anything else to attach to. When I become aware of that anxiety, my mind tends to distracts itself away from the anxiety and the "hunting."

LOOK directly at the anxiety. Pinpoint its message. Is it "if there is no self, I will disappear"?? or "without a self I will cease to exist"? Sometimes it's "without a self, nothing will get done". Check and find out what the fear is. Then ask "Is it true?"

I both like that and get scared. But it is a good compass. Where do I refuse to take responsibility?

Yes; you got it in one!! The attempt to avoid responsibility is the foremost excuse for not living Fully!

You are in the gate; LOOK at what you know 'self' is: a thought that points to other thoughts of me. Nothing in reality. Nothing. There is no self; there is no you. Check it!!!

[philipped]

Hello Nona,

I feel a bit despondent today. I have a hard time mustering the will to simply look. I seemed to "wallow" in my thoughts today. There is some comfort in that, but at the same time, I know it's not what I want. So I also feel frustrated and confused on how to proceed. OK, not so confused on how to proceed, as I just need to keep looking :-) But I need to get it back together (or not?)

Habit again. You know there is no self in reality. Why continue playing that game?

If I only knew! I go back to your question of a few days ago about what was in it for the self to hold on like that. I guess it's the known, the false sense of safety, the fear of getting hurt, etc. On some level, I understand it's all stories, but on another, it's obvious I don't! It's so strange.

I went on a walk today. I was trying to really see through the self. In a way, I think I am trying too hard to see past the self. That seems to create even more thoughts around the whole topic and in some sense reinforce the self-view. That's another old habit of mine, putting more effort than needed in what I do. It's interesting that I use the word "do" in this case, as I just need to look. Not much doing in looking.

Cheers,

Philippe

[nonaparry]

I seemed to "wallow" in my thoughts today.

Wallow: to roll about or lie in water, snow, mud, dust, or the like, as for refreshment. As long as you're finding it Refreshing, no harm. Check it! Is it refreshing? or just reinforcing old stories?

not so confused on how to proceed, as I just need to keep looking

May i make a suggestion? Could you stop looking with your mind and instead LOOK with your eyes, your vision?
Usually getting stuck in the gate is a result of over-intellectualising in place of Directly Experiencing Life. Check if you can shut off the constant commentary of mind while you walk and experience the light, the air, what you see. LOOK with your eyes, and see whether there is a 'self' walking, sensing, seeing — at all! It's so simple, it's easy to overlook.

I go back to your question of a few days ago about what was in it for the self to hold on like that. I guess it's the known, the false sense of safety, the fear of getting hurt, etc. On some level, I understand it's all stories, but on another, it's obvious I don't!

Okay. And what are you doing with those stories? Are you seeing through them? or clinging to them?
Is there Really safety in stories?
Check it!
You have a story of "getting hurt" which has you watch out fearfully for opportunities for hurt to be gotten. Watch how you watch-out!
This watching out is a contraction: a contraction of breath, of the life energy, that naturally wants to express itself as expansion. So you interfere with the breath and the energy, which creates tension, and maybe even pain. You do it to Philippe, in the Name of Getting-Hurt. You hurt your own 'self' and make a story of how Life isn't safe.
Without the story of safety, is Life dangerous? Check it!

I was trying to really see through the self.

Yeah, i did that too. To no avail. Don't try. Just LOOK at Life with your eyes; there is no 'self' to see through. None at all. There is life. There is a body. There are eyes. They look. They see. They send data to the brain. There is no Look-er, no See-er, no message-sender. It all just happens. It's Life life-ing itself.

When this one was stuck in the gate, it suddenly remembered the words of its guide: LOOK. She never said "Think!" at all! She said LOOK. And i'd been thinking. So i decided to give Looking a go. i shifted into Direct Experience. i felt my body's feet strike the floor as walking to the kitchen happened. i felt the hot soapy water on my body's hands as washing dishes happened. No mental commentary; just sensation. And it suddenly SAW that life was simply happening!

I am trying too hard to see past the self.

Indeed! See above! You will never 'see past' what isn't there.

That's another old habit of mine, putting more effort than needed in what I do.

Good noticing!!
Sit very very still and close your eyes. Notice any sensation of the body. Notice any thought that arises. Notice any sound you hear. Isn't life going on without your active participation?? Life doesn't need your assistance; it is complete just as it is. And you can effort or relax and wallow, just as you like.

I just need to look. Not much doing in looking.

Truer words were seldom writ. So Open your eyes and allow vision to happen. Notice there is no 'you' doing it. Vision happens, walking happens, breathing happens. No 'you'. Don't THINK; just live. And notice there isn't a 'you' living.

love
Nona

[philipped]

Hello Nona,

As long as you're finding it Refreshing, no harm. Check it! Is it refreshing? or just reinforcing old stories?

I like the distinction. I think it's more the latter...

Could you stop looking with your mind and instead LOOK with your eyes, your vision?

Thanks for the suggestion. I need to hear that more! When I can sustain just looking without much thought, or at least without getting caught in my thoughts, that's when the anxiety comes up. It feels unfamiliar. I then try to stay with the anxiety, but my mind does not seem to like that so much as it slips back into familiar thinking patterns.

Usually getting stuck in the gate is a result of over-intellectualising in place of Directly Experiencing Life. Check if you can shut off the constant commentary of mind while you walk and experience the light, the air, what you see.

I'll do my best to let go of the intellect. I am concerned trying to shut down the commentary, because that can give rise to another sense of self, the one that shuts down the commentary, that is in control. It seems easier for me to simply focus on the seeing, as you suggested above, and not pay much attention to the thoughts, whatever they might be.

Okay. And what are you doing with those stories? Are you seeing through them? or clinging to them?

It depends. Sometimes it's easy to see through them and just move on. Some, I get caught in them, see I am caught in them and don't know how to let go of them. And yet others, I just don't see them at all. I think you have helped me identified some of those.

You have a story of "getting hurt" which has you watch out fearfully for opportunities for hurt to be gotten. Watch how you watch-out!
This watching out is a contraction: a contraction of breath, of the life energy, that naturally wants to express itself as expansion.

Yes, that's very true. It seems that it is a long process to let go of that habit of contracting, of searching for safety.

When this one was stuck in the gate, it suddenly remembered the words of its guide: LOOK. She never said "Think!" at all! She said LOOK. And i'd been thinking. So i decided to give Looking a go. i shifted into Direct Experience. i felt my body's feet strike the floor as walking to the kitchen happened. i felt the hot soapy water on my body's hands as washing dishes happened. No mental commentary; just sensation. And it suddenly SAW that life was simply happening!

This comment and some of the others you make later in your response make complete sense to me. And at the same time it's where I get stuck. I definitely have times where my intellect is not very active and I am simply with whatever my experience is. Not much me involved, if any at all. What happens is that the next thought tends to be around that there must be something else to this. That it cannot be that simple. That I must be missing something. Then there is confusion about how much I see or understand. Confusion about that is supposed to happen or not happen.

In any case, I'll do my best to follow your advice to avoid thinking through my experience. I don't think I can control my thinking so much, but I can usually have some control over whether I pay attention to it or not.

Love,

Philippe

[nonaparry]

When I can sustain just looking without much thought, or at least without getting caught in my thoughts, that's when the anxiety comes up.

Yes; mind is protecting the 'self' it has nurtured for how many years??
Anxiety, fear, is a protective mechanism. It arises to distract you from keeping focused on the gate. i tell you there is no 'you' in reality, and anxiety calls "Squirrel!!!" and you're off and running instead of keeping focused.

Look directly at the fear. It arises to protect a 'self'. But there is no self. None. Nothing to protect. Your anxiety is useless.

I then try to stay with the anxiety, but my mind does not seem to like that so much as it slips back into familiar thinking patterns.

Useless. And self-indulgent. Stop indulging the non-existent self!

I'll do my best to let go of the intellect. I am concerned trying to shut down the commentary, because that can give rise to another sense of self, the one that shuts down the commentary, that is in control. It seems easier for me to simply focus on the seeing, as you suggested above, and not pay much attention to the thoughts, whatever they might be.

You probably can't shut down the commentary even if you try. But give it a go; it's useful to notice all the holes in the mind-chatter.
Don't "focus on the seeing"; Just Open Your Eyes And SEE! This is not a mental exercise! Get VISUAL.

And what are you doing with those stories? Are you seeing through them? or clinging to them?

Some, I get caught in them, see I am caught in them and don't know how to let go of them.

i can help with that. When you notice you are in a story that you can't see your way out of, ask "Is it true?" Then Check it! Is it? Is it True? Move to the next thought. Is it true? Is it? Check it.

It seems that it is a long process to let go of that habit of contracting, of searching for safety.

What is Safety going to give you but more pain? So far, it seems safety hasn't been very safe. i would look for Truth instead.

What happens is that the next thought tends to be around that there must be something else to this. That it cannot be that simple. That I must be missing something.

Good. Here is the sticking point. What more do you expect? How will you know it is enough? You already see there is no self in reality; what more is needed to satisfy your need?

Confusion about that is supposed to happen or not happen.

Please explain what is or is not supposed to happen; this is Life! Everything that does happen is supposed to happen!

In any case, I'll do my best to follow your advice to avoid thinking through my experience. I don't think I can control my thinking so much, but I can usually have some control over whether I pay attention to it or not.

i'm sure you cannot stop thinking, but do spend some time investigating your Direct Experiences. LOOK for a 'you' anywhere in your life.
Question: without a 'you' anywhere in life, isn't simply going along with what's happening easier?

love
Nona

[philipped]

Hello Nona,

Ok, I'll start with your last question, because it pointed something quite interesting out to me .

Question: without a 'you' anywhere in life, isn't simply going along with what's happening easier?

My whole body reaction was to twist and then a big NO came. Then my mind said very politely Yes. There is tremendous fear that if I "simply go along with what's happening" (on my first read, the easier dropped away), something terrible will happen. I will become some listless person, selfish, inconsiderate, I won't contribute, etc... Lots of known beliefs got triggered by this simple question.

It reveals also that I need to pay more attention to my body when I answer your questions. My intellect has a lot of the right answers, but my body, my emotions, etc, might tell otherwise. I am sometimes not connected enough to my whole experience to see that happening. I struggle with that, as my mind says one thing, and my body/emotions something else. What do I report? Both I guess.

Your anxiety is useless.

That's an interesting way to look at it. And I am not trying to be a smart-ass. It never occurred to me it could be useless!

Don't "focus on the seeing"; Just Open Your Eyes And SEE! This is not a mental exercise! Get VISUAL.

Thanks for reminding me of that again and again. My mind just loves figuring things out and I know that's not going to work with Liberation. But my intellect does not seem to get it!

Good. Here is the sticking point. What more do you expect? How will you know it is enough? You already see there is no self in reality; what more is needed to satisfy your need?

When I read this, my mind goes blank. I don't know what more I expect! I feel tired and frustrated. Because you are right, everything in my experience points to no self in reality. Yet, somehow, I don't feel free of the self. I am holding on to something, but not sure what it is. I'll try to see what thoughts come up that might be tied to that.

Please explain what is or is not supposed to happen; this is Life! Everything that does happen is supposed to happen!

There are some believes that once I see through the self, I will perceive my experience differently. It will be more vivid. I will be more connected to it. I will not experience fear and anxiety anymore. I will have different kind of thoughts (less self-centered.) There is also the sense that I will finally start living my life (that's a nice one!)

Another belief I have is around an energetic knot (or whatever it is) I have in the middle of my spine. It showed up several months ago. Sometimes energy shots up from there to my head. It's somewhat unpleasant. At other times, that knot contracts and my body tends to twist. I make a link between getting rid of this energy knot and liberation. I could say it's just another story, but deep down I believe it. This knot has been even more in my awareness since we have started to work together. Several times a day, sometime for long period of times. It's definitely here now.

Thank you for all your support!

Philippe

[nonaparry]

Thank you!! We are almost home, dear! You've clarified your obstacles without maybe realising they were there.

if I "simply go along with what's happening" (on my first read, the easier dropped away), something terrible will happen. I will become some listless person, selfish, inconsiderate, I won't contribute, etc...

Oh really? And when you LOOK and notice there is actually no 'self' in reality that 'contributes', do you see through this lie? When you notice that with or without a 'self' there is energy and listlessness, selfishness and altruism, consideration and inconsideration...it's all present and accounted for in Life! All these are characteristics of Life life-ing; only your judgmentalism attaches a label of good, bad, proper, unacceptable.

Your anxiety is useless.

That's an interesting way to look at it. And I am not trying to be a smart-ass. It never occurred to me it could be useless!

That's because you accept it unquestioningly. Do you believe everything you think?

everything in my experience points to no self in reality. Yet, somehow, I don't feel free of the self.

Okay. So you thought Liberation would have you feel 'free of the self'. Why? i don't know how old you are, but for this one nearly 60 years of habitual thinking and social conditioning colour experience even After the gate. i just notice it's not Personal!

believes that once I see through the self, I will perceive my experience differently. It will be more vivid. I will be more connected to it. I will not experience fear and anxiety anymore. I will have different kind of thoughts (less self-centered.) There is also the sense that I will finally start living my life (that's a nice one!)

Hahahahahaha!!! Good noticing!! These expectations are blocking you from enjoying what you have SEEN with your eyes: there is no self in reality.
Tell me: is there no difference at all in how you perceive experience post-gate? You still see everything just the same as last week??
What obscures the vividness of Life for you?
Fear and anxiety are habitual; they will continue to arise—do they stick around as hard or as long as previously?
The 'kind' of thoughts you have is also habitual; you can't control which ones arise—you can only choose to focus on them or not. What on earth would have you become suddenly altruistic?? Gate is not a personality-shift; it's a perception shift.
You will only finally start living your life when you notice that you DO; you have been all along. It just wasn't the life you 'applied for', so you pretended it wasn't yours.

Another belief I have is around an energetic knot (or whatever it is) I have in the middle of my spine.

i have no experience with this kind of thing, but it sounds like it might be kundalini energy. This has been addressed in our Aftercare group, Unleashed. Are you on Facebook? Friend me there: Nona Parry, and i will add you to Unleashed group once we are complete here.

This knot has been even more in my awareness since we have started to work together. Several times a day, sometime for long period of times.

Another possible explanation for knot is fear. Self is loathe to relinquish its Central place in your universe; sometimes fear, a protective mechanism, rises to distract the seeker from following through. What is amusing here, is there is no self to protect.

One thing for sure, you are not going to hear angels singing or a great explosion: boom. It’s just like seeing and recognizing that there is no Santa, no Batman, no imaginary cup. Just a dropping of belief.

It's time. Answer this from your direct experience, fully and in detail: Is there a 'me', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

love
Nona

[philipped]

Hello Nona,

We are almost home, dear!

When I read this, fear arises. It's as if a part of me does not want to believe it. It is as if, reading the rest of your email, I had to give up all my hopes for a better future (for both myself, others and the world -- I know, big agenda) On one side, there is the fear that does not want to give up, who wants to keep searching how to "fix" me and everything else and on the other, "me", who reports on not seeing a self, who can see, I believe, genuinely that all experience just arises and passes away with no need for a self whatsoever. That the self is purely constructed out of my thoughts.

I don't know how to reconcile this fear and that knowing. Most likely there is nothing to reconcile. May be it just is like this for now. But that leaves me with the question: how much do I really know? How much do I embody that knowing?

And when you LOOK and notice there is actually no 'self' in reality that 'contributes', do you see through this lie?

If I remember it's a lie, I see through it. But the identification is so habitual, I often don't see it.

Do you believe everything you think?

No, but I definitely do sometimes, maybe often! Questioning with "Is it true?" is helpful, but I need to develop that as a habit as that does not come to me naturally.

Okay. So you thought Liberation would have you feel 'free of the self'. Why? i don't know how old you are, but for this one nearly 60 years of habitual thinking and social conditioning colour experience even After the gate. i just notice it's not Personal!

Why? Good question! Another belief. I am 42. While I recognize that my conditioning will not disappear, there is also the belief that if I really understood that there is no self, then if somebody yells at me, or blames me, etc, I would feel nothing but compassion for that person, as I would see completely that it's not personal. I am not there! I feel guilt, may be shame, or anger, which to me indicates I take it personally, that I am defending some kind of self entity.

These expectations are blocking you from enjoying what you have SEEN with your eyes

That's really true.

Tell me: is there no difference at all in how you perceive experience post-gate? You still see everything just the same as last week??
What obscures the vividness of Life for you?

I cannot say I perceive my experience any differently now than before. Some beliefs popped, that's for sure. I have been on retreats where I would fall in love with whatever my awareness came into contact with. That's definitely not my experience now, and I don't say it should be like that. Conditions are different. But there is no drastic shift to how I relate to my experience.

But at the same time your response shook something in me, in terms of having to let go of some deeply held believes of what liberation would bring. Something is cooking. Don't know if it's going to boil over soon or simply simmer for a while!

Fear and anxiety are habitual; they will continue to arise—do they stick around as hard or as long as previously?

Both are extremely habitual for me. I think fear has been extremely present lately. Today it was very strong and led to a lot of confusion about where I was really at. I don't see that as a bad think. Questioning beliefs is sure to bring that up. Other fears about more mundane things are seen more easily as not personal and come and go pretty easily.

Gate is not a personality-shift; it's a perception shift.

I was told that more than once! But here is the belief: this perception shift should lead to a more compassionate, altruistic way of being.

You will only finally start living your life when you notice that you DO; you have been all along. It just wasn't the life you 'applied for', so you pretended it wasn't yours.

I really like this way of looking at how I go about life. I'll try to remember it when I get lost.

Is there a 'me', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

When I read this, fear arises. It comes up as a contraction in my throat, my jaw, my belly. I feel the shifting sensations. I open my eyes to see what I am writing. I can feel the sensations of the fingers touching the keyboard. I can hear the humming of the fan. In all this, there is just feeling, hearing, sensations, some thoughts. I cannot find a "me" anywhere. I don't know if there was one ever. But right now, in this moment, there is none. And everytime I check, there is none. The only "me", "I" I can find are arising in my thoughts, or sometimes it feels like it's arising with my thoughts.

Having said all that, I simply don't understand why I feel so torn about my present experience. I think that's one central question for me. Why do I feel so ambivalent about the whole thing when I seem to see pretty clearly? I can also see that all these questions are impersonal. They arise as thoughts and disappear. They create some distress, some "torness", because I believe them for a while, but then they go. Is it all an intellectual exercise for me or is it true seeing? As long as I feel torn like this, it seems to me that I have not really SEEN directly what I need to see.

Thanks for your patience with this, Nona!

Love,

Philippe

[nonaparry]

Let's take a good look at this fear that appears to hold you captive. You mention it each time, and i have pretty much ignored it as a mere parasite along for the ride. i genuinely thought it would go away, but here it is, in living colour, Fearfully fearing and stopping you from having the ride of your life!!

i apologise for that; this one had no fear at the gate and didn't realise how deadening it could be.

So let us figure out what is being feared?
Some fears at the gate include fear of loss of control, fear of no one left to take care of the mundane issues of life, fear of loss of identity, fear of loss of connection, fear of loss of love. Do any of these resonate? Does it help to know that Philippe's existence does not disappear; only the illusion that there is a separate self that controls a separate special slice of Life is seen through? Does it help to notice that all the mundane chores get done simply as part of Life life-ing, without the need for a 'self' to DO them? Does it help to see that you cannot lose an identity you never had? That the story of Philippe has been a fiction for 42 years, not just for this past week, and yet Philippe has survived? Does it help to realise that seeing through the illusion of a separate 'self' means also seeing through the illusion of separate 'others'—you cannot be disconnected? Does it help that as an experience of the Whole of Life life-ing, that Philippe is enveloped in One Love?

If it's none of these, see if you can follow the line of fear back, back to where it comes from. What is the thing that is so fearsome you are willing to forgo awakening in order to avoid it? Is there fear that if you've 'seen it' and there was no Big Bang that you will never be 'fixed'? Fear of loss of the Search?

We have an aftercare group on Facebook called Unleashed. When we are complete here, i will invite you to it; it's a community of those who have seen through the illusion of self helping each other to cope with what arises.

there is also the belief that if I really understood that there is no self, then if somebody yells at me, or blames me, etc, I would feel nothing but compassion for that person

You really understand that there is no self. And people continue to yell, and we continue to tell a story of how they shouldn't do that. Conditioning.
You know how when you switch off a fan, the blades still go 'round and 'round? Until they don't. Same here. The conditioned responses continue...until they don't. And when the conditioned response shows up, now you think "where did that come from? There is no 'me' to be offended" or whatever.

there is no drastic shift to how I relate to my experience.

Does a shift have to be drastic to be different? Any small difference in perception—such as "where is the "I" who is angry?"—can be the catalyst for major life changes.

Something is cooking. Don't know if it's going to boil over soon or simply simmer for a while!

Good! i'll just keep stirring, then!

I think fear has been extremely present lately.

Is it one fear, the same fear? or a multiplicity of different fears? Does a fear stick around as tenaciously as previously? or does it die out from no "I" to stick to?

But here is the belief: this perception shift should lead to a more compassionate, altruistic way of being.

Says who??
If you want to be more compassionate, altruistic, then BE it. How would that show up in your life? What would you do differently? Check it; then DO it!

Seeing through a belief in a false self is not going to change your life; changing your life is going to change your life. Life is not a spectator sport!! It's a full contact sport and the coach has put you in!! So go play as if your life depended on it; it does!

I cannot find a "me" anywhere. I don't know if there was one ever. But right now, in this moment, there is none. And everytime I check, there is none.

Yes. Very beautifully expressed!

As long as I feel torn like this, it seems to me that I have not really SEEN directly what I need to see.

That's another Expectation; they keep popping up, don't they? And except for your unfulfilled expectations, do you honestly believe you have not seen through the illusion of self? Where in your experience is a self still lurking? We'll rout it out; no worries!

So moving right along...explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works.

[philipped]

Hey Nona,

Thanks for your detailed response. I think that your previous post and this post have clarified a lot of things for me. It's pretty late here and I just came back home. As I want to reply thoroughly to your post, I'll do it tomorrow morning. I hope that's ok with you.

I wish you a good day,

Philippe

[nonaparry]

Thank you for letting me know; i look forward to your reply!

love
Nona

[philipped]

Hello Nona,

I appreciate your curiosity about the fear I experience. I think it is a very old fear that is the result of the environment I grew up in. Basically, there is a part of me that is really concerned that I might be a bad person. It keeps me in a state close to hyper-vigilance and doubt about my actions. If I don't pay close attention to my thoughts and my emotions, this part tends to rule my life as I habitually believe/identify with them.

I think that I have looked at awakening/liberation as a way to get rid of that hyper-vigilance, that doubt and the fear that accompany it. So the fear that arises and that holds me captive, which is different from the fear that I might be bad, is the fear that actually it does not look like my core beliefs, doubts, the hyper-vigilance are going to leave anytime soon. That fear won't let me say that I see through the self, because that would mean that I won't get rid (at least for now) of these unpleasant states once I awaken to the truth of no-self. Do I explain this clearly?

The process that has been taking place these past few days thanks to your direction has been to come to terms with reality: these believes are here, I tend to have hyper-vigilance and doubt. And they have nothing to do whether there is a self or not. I have had to let go of the cherished idea that somehow my conditioning would change if I really saw through the self.

I can see clearly now that this fear is also impersonal, as long as I don't identify with it and the accompanying stories.

Is there fear that if you've 'seen it' and there was no Big Bang that you will never be 'fixed'? Fear of loss of the Search?

That's exactly it.

We have an aftercare group on Facebook called Unleashed. When we are complete here, i will invite you to it

I don't have an account with Facebook as I don't really like their privacy policies. But liberation is worth getting over that dislike! I'll sign-up.

You know how when you switch off a fan, the blades still go 'round and 'round? Until they don't. Same here.

I like that analogy. It's helpful.

And when the conditioned response shows up, now you think "where did that come from? There is no 'me' to be offended" or whatever.

Most of the time, my initial reaction is to get offended, or scared, etc. There is a process of having to consciously dis-identify from my reaction. Kind of reminding myself there is no self that need to take this personally.

Does a shift have to be drastic to be different? Any small difference in perception—such as "where is the "I" who is angry?"—can be the catalyst for major life changes.

I agree with you. I need to adjust my expectations!

Is it one fear, the same fear? or a multiplicity of different fears? Does a fear stick around as tenaciously as previously? or does it die out from no "I" to stick to?

The main fear that's directly related to liberation, is, ironically, the one about not getting liberated. One version of the fear is tied to the belief:"May be I'll make a mistake, believe I have seen through the self" and then there is no hope that all my other fears will get fixed! Just writing this I can feel my chest contract, my breath getting short, getting anxious. Another thought arises: "And what if what I just wrote was true?" It's a belief that's very alive!

When I stay with that fear/anxiety, I can simply stay with it in my body. It takes some time for it to pass away. It's during times like this that I have a sense that I am observing the fear. Honestly, I think I am quite identified with that fear.

If you want to be more compassionate, altruistic, then BE it. How would that show up in your life? What would you do differently? Check it; then DO it!

I appreciate that. There is a lot of wishful thinking! Mainly so that I don't have to face my fears!

And except for your unfulfilled expectations, do you honestly believe you have not seen through the illusion of self? Where in your experience is a self still lurking? We'll rout it out; no worries!

A self is still lurking in my present experience. Reading your quote, I feel terrified. My chest collapses, my arms become numb, I have difficulty breathing. Years of meditation practice allow me to report on that experience somewhat objectively, but there is no doubt that I identify with that fear. It is mine, I experience it.

So moving right along...explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works.

I try to get my thoughts together to answer that question, but the leftover panic from the question above is still with me and I have a hard time to be coherent. Lot's of energy is coming up my spine, to my head and the only thing I can do is stay with it. I experience a knot in my chest. I'll take a break and come back to your question.

Feeling better. I start thinking about your question and this whole energy thing starts again. It's not a pleasant experience. I try not to contract around it. I feel tired after that experience.

It has now happened 3 times in a row, over a period of 5 hours. I think I'll stop now, with the intention to answer your question either later tonight, or maybe tomorrow.

Love,

Philippe

[nonaparry]

Thank you so much for your wonderful, meaty, reply!!

there is a part of me that is really concerned that I might be a bad person ... I think that I have looked at awakening/liberation as a way to get rid of that hyper-vigilance, that doubt and the fear that accompany it. ... That fear won't let me say that I see through the self, because that would mean that I won't get rid (at least for now) of these unpleasant states once I awaken to the truth of no-self. Do I explain this clearly?

Very clearly.
So for Philippe, liberation = no unpleasant states [especially those resulting from innate 'badness'].

they have nothing to do whether there is a self or not. I have had to let go of the cherished idea that somehow my conditioning would change if I really saw through the self.

So let's look at this. 42 years of conditioning have set up habitual responses to experience, yet the idea that all this conditioning just drops away in an instant remains. i remind you again of the fan; when the power is switched off, the blades continue to turn, but ever more slowly until they stop. The difference here is the fan is powered by electricity; experience by focus. Whatever you focus on, you experience.
Do this:
Walk across the room, looking in the direction you are moving in. Now look down at your feet. Where were your feet before you looked at them? Still attached to your legs, but not "in focus". Once focused on, feet appear! To change your experience, change your focus.

Now sit quietly with your eyes closed. Notice that breathing is happening. Explore the body from the inside. Check if you can know how tall you are from direct experience, how many toes you have, what colour your hair and skin are. Now check where 'bad' is. In your Direct Experience, is there 'bad' any more than there is a 'self' to be bad?? Check it!!!

Is there fear that if you've 'seen it' and there was no Big Bang that you will never be 'fixed'? Fear of loss of the Search?

That's exactly it.

Sweetheart, what exactly is broken? Please check. From here, Philippe is a fragment of the perfection of Life life-ing. Perfect. Not broken.

I don't have an account with Facebook as I don't really like their privacy policies. But liberation is worth getting over that dislike! I'll sign-up.

Hahaha! You can have liberation without Facebook; and sometimes its helpful to connect with others who have shared the experience of seeing through the illusion.

Most of the time, my initial reaction is to get offended, or scared, etc. There is a process of having to consciously dis-identify from my reaction. Kind of reminding myself there is no self that need to take this personally.

SEE how the fan is slowing down...

The main fear that's directly related to liberation, is, ironically, the one about not getting liberated.

Funny; i can lead you to SEE, but only you can choose to be liberated.

One version of the fear is tied to the belief:"May be I'll make a mistake, believe I have seen through the self"

If it's any assurance, it is clear to this one that you have seen through the 'self', and when we are complete, other guides will look at our conversation and confirm that you have seen, or ask questions, or ask me to ask questions. We don't leave it to chance!

and then there is no hope that all my other fears will get fixed!

Nothing needs to be 'fixed'. Fear is just a sensation among other sensations; we attach a thought to it and scare ourselves silly. There isn't even 'us' to be afraid!!
Look at how this friendly universe supports you. If you are sitting, notice how the chair supports you. And the floor supports the chair. And the foundations support the floor. And the earth supports the foundations. So much support!! This is life; air to breathe, food to eat, places to sit, stand or lie down. Fantastic!!!

When I stay with that fear/anxiety, I can simply stay with it in my body. It takes some time for it to pass away.

Do stay with it; the more intensely you are able to experience the sensations, the more rapidly (in this one's experience) the sensations dissipate. Without mind attaching an "I" to it, sensation is free to arise and pass on.

It's during times like this that I have a sense that I am observing the fear. Honestly, I think I am quite identified with that fear.

You identify with the fear? Really? Is the fear really 'you'? We've discovered that 'self' is just a thought; what exactly is fear?

A self is still lurking in my present experience.

A thought is still lurking in your present experience? No way! Direct experience is without thought; it's the experience of sensations before thought!

Reading your quote, I feel terrified.

There is no one to feel terrified. This is just a story, dear. There is a feeling; you label it terror; you frighten yourself with it; then you tell the story of how terrified you are.
What is there in reality?? In reality there is a body; it has sensations. That is all. One sensation among others, until mind pops a label on it. Check this!!!

Lot's of energy is coming up my spine, to my head and the only thing I can do is stay with it. I experience a knot in my chest.

As i mentioned previously, i am not familiar with this kind of energy, but have read about it in other liberateds. i am eager to get you into Unleashed where you can learn more and compare notes.

I'll take a break and come back to your question.

Take your time. You are doing so very well and have come so very far. i am filled with appreciation for your openness and willingness!

love
Nona