The Gate

Sorry, I did not express myself correctly here.

How thoughts calculate "this or that" medication?

I wanted say, thoughts with the content "This or that medication is better"

Of course, thoughts are not independent beings that calculate something ;)
Or what you say?

When we're at it.

Is the "I" more than a thought?

Hi Tracy, Yes it does seem that when there is some technical act required there is SOMEONE DOING it.
On observing driving I realise that the acts performed are thoughts based on previous learning
Similarly in my role as a DOCTOR i realize that my decision to give medication is based on a my memory of learning . This memory is in the form of a series of thoughts. So actually it is my learning and experience translated into thoughts which make me perform
To answer ur query whether I is more than A THOUGHT it seems to be a series of thoughts when broken down. However maybe due to conditioning it still feels as if it is more than thought
Thanx Saroj

Let's take a look at the so-called memory
1. "What does the memory consist of?
2. When does the memory appear?
3. What is the difference between a "general" thought and a "memory thought" exactly?
4. What exactly does it say that a "memory thought" refers to something that has happened?
Look at a thought about the future.
5. What does the future-thought consist of?
6. When does the future-thought appear?
7. What exactly is the difference between a "general thought" and a "future thought"?
9. From what is it clear that the "future-thought" refers to something that will happen?
Now let's compare a thought of the past with a thought of the future.
10. What exactly is the difference between the thoughts about the past and the future? If there is a difference, how is this difference recognized?

~*~

To answer ur query whether I is more than A THOUGHT it seems to be a series of thoughts when broken down.

Unfortunately, I do not understand this sentence. Can you please explain what you mean by that?

To answer ur query whether I is more than A THOUGHT it seems to be a series of thoughts when broken down.


What I mean by " broken down" is that when closely seen and analysed . When closely seen and analysed I appears to be a series of thoughts one after the other

thanx

Thanks for the explanation.

If you answer the other questions today, unfortunately I will not be able to answer you until tomorrow.

Have pleasure answering the questions.

Until then :)

Hi Tracy , sorry for the delay as I was a bit busy for last 2 days. I have thought a lot about the questions on “memory”


Let's take a look at the so-called memory
1. "What does the memory consist of?
2. When does the memory appear?
3. What is the difference between a "general" thought and a "memory thought" exactly?
4. What exactly does it say that a "memory thought" refers to something that has happened?
Look at a thought about the future.
5. What does the future-thought consist of?
6. When does the future-thought appear?
7. What exactly is the difference between a "general thought" and a "future thought"?
9. From what is it clear that the "future-thought" refers to something that will happen?
Now let's compare a thought of the past with a thought of the future.
10. What exactly is the difference between the thoughts about the past and the future? If there is a difference, how is this difference recognized?



1) Memory consists of a thought or a series of thoughts about a given situation

2) The memory thought appears as a response to a thought about a given situation past or present
3) General thought appears to arise spontaneously or randomly while a memory thought seems to arise as a response to a thought about a situation. But effectively they both seem to be made of the same substance
4)MEMORY thought seems to refer to some situation that has happened in the past
5) Future thought consists of a thought in response to some other thought about something that is going to happen
6) future thought appears when there is a thought in reference to some thought or situation about the future
7) ) General thought appears to arise spontaneously or randomly while a future thought seems to arise as a response to a thought about a future situation or something which may happen in the future. But other than that they seem to be the same thought
9) Future thought appears to be a thought in response to some situation that may take place in the future
10) Only difference seems to be that thoughts about past arise in response to a situation that has taken place in past and future thoughts arise in response to a situation in the future. However they seem to be made of same substance of thought
Hope you can make sense of these answers which I have tried to answer as best as I can
Thanx and regards Saroj

Can you please do a favor and use the quote function. That makes it easier and clearer.

https://www.liberationunleashed.com/nat ... ?f=4&t=660


Yes, all thoughts are made of the same substance and tell you stories about everything.

But do you know if it is true what they are telling?
Can you now testify 100% there was "SOMEONE" who experienced a past? Look from your direct experience, what do you perceive with your senses now?
Is your past NOW more than a story of a "SOMEONE", which is told by thoughts?

And when do thoughts about the past and the future appear?
But always in the NOW, right?

Hi Tracy sorry for the delay. To reply to ur question

Can you now testify 100% there was "SOMEONE" who experienced a past? Look from your direct experience, what do you perceive with your senses now?
Is your past NOW more than a story of a "SOMEONE", which is told by thoughts?

And when do thoughts about the past and the future appear?
But always in the NOW, right?

It is difficult to believe that there is a SOMEONE who experienced a past. The past is a thought and so is the future. It looks as if SOMEONE is experiencing the past and future but on closer inspection it is clear that there is NO someone but just the appearance of thoughts. Or else it seems as if the brain is thinking these thoughts but when we try to find out WHO’s brain there is NO person to be responsible.
And yes all thoughts past or future appear NOW. Though it appears that some person is thinking about the past , no one is to be found

regards Saroj

Yes, very nice seen !

I would like to come back to your physical sensations, to what you have told about your job.
And this one.

Yes, for feelings to arise there must be a SOMEONE. And here I am facing the problem. On looking I am not finding a person but still when these feelings come they cause a lot of disturbance . So the I feeling is still very strong. Just looking doesn’t dissolve that Me feeling. I know they are sensations but sensations is coming to something called ME

.

I would like to do a little exercise with you.

Find a quiet place and a quiet time.
Lie down and relax.

Can you look at physical sensations in isolation?
Can you fade out the thoughts for the moment that tell about everything possible provide and also sensation with "meaning" labeling?

Thoughts may say:
"I am lying here"
or
"My body is here"
or
"A body lies here" ..

But could this be known of pure sensation?


Thoughts may say that there is a gentle pressure against the back.
But could pure sensation know something about "pressure" or "back"?



arrived there, please have a look of the following questions:

Can you know how big the body is?
Does the body have a specific shape?

Is there a separation between the body and the clothes?
Is there a separation between the body and the ground?

How many toes do you have?


When thought is not given attention and awareness rests only on sensation ..
Is there any clothes?
Is there any background at all?
Is there a body at all?

Look very carefully. Take your time, don’t rush. You can look several times during the day while doing other things (like showering, having a short break from work, walking, etc) before replying.

Hi tracy, the experiments were quite useful and I tried it out for few days. When lying down initially it felt like a body was lying on the mattress. Then after some time it felt like there was only the experience of sensations, no separate body or clothes. The mind was telling me that this is the sensation of hand or back, but in reality it was only sensations. The body which we know as divided into various parts was only sensations all over. Still the mind could demarcate that this is the body and this is the mattress. But after some time the sensation of the body and bed merged into one seamless sensation

But when I left the mattress and went back to work and my patients it felt like everything was the same as before. That feeling of oneness experienced earlier was gone
I would like to know your comments on this
Warm regards Saroj

Yes, very nice :)

You have seen, if you look, that there is NO ONE.
You've had the experience of how experiencing feels like, without titeling thoughts about it.

When you're at work, you can try out what you did in the exercise.
An experience emerges, which thoughts with "envy" or "jealousy" title.
Look at these sensations and try to leave the titling thoughts aside.

Yes, for feelings to arise there must be a SOMEONE...................... I know they are sensations but sensations is coming to something called ME.

Is it still an "I" to which these sensations come?
Or is it just thoughts about an "I" to whom these sensations come?

Look closely.

Hi Tracy, I tried looking at work as well for last few days. It was a little more difficult but the results were the same . The feeling came “ I am jealous” or I am angry and there was a reaction . But then I asked “ To whom are these feelings coming? . There was no one to be found . The ‘ i AM ANGRY” was found to be a thought and so was the “i am jealous’ found to be a thought. There did not seem to be any I on closer evaluation
Still I have a doubt. As a doctor I have done lot of studies and then got degrees. Who is this one who has studied and passed the exam? There must have been SOMEONE who decided to study hard to be a doctor and passed exams. Who is the one who studied for the exams and qualified to be a doctor?

Warm regards Saroj

It was a little more difficult but the results were the same . The feeling came “ I am jealous” or I am angry and there was a reaction . But then I asked “ To whom are these feelings coming? . There was no one to be found . The ‘ i AM ANGRY” was found to be a thought and so was the “i am jealous’ found to be a thought. There did not seem to be any I on closer evaluation

You say yourself that you have NO ONE found and that "I AM ANGRY" and "i am jealous" have been found as an thought.

Still I have a doubt.

Is this doubt more than a belief pattern?

There must have been SOMEONE who decided to study hard to be a doctor and passed exams.

Why does there have to be SOMEONE who has decided to study?
Why can not study just happen?

Why does there have to be SOMEONE who has decided to study?
Why can not study just happen?

Hi Tracy, Till now it appeared that there is a someone who is studying hard and passing the exams. There was never any doubt about it. But on close observation now after the exercises one can see that the urge to study appears as a thought. The thought may arise from hearing someone else or following some other student who did well or because there was pressure from the family. The thought appeared to study hard and study happened. Action took place on its own after the thought came.

But again a doubt that why do some people study harder than the rest and score better marks or degrees . Again maybe it is all just happening on its own


Warm regards Saroj