Knowingness
-
otterrivers
- Posts: 511
- Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 10:48 pm
Re: Knowingness
Hi. I have read your responses a few times and thought about it for a couple of days. I'm not sure what we have left to talk about. So I will ask you. Is there anything we should talk about that we have not discussed yet? Maybe there are aome things we need to talk about that you don't realize yet and I will question you a bit later about some things. But first I would like to know your opinion. Is there something you feel is incomplete?
Re: Knowingness
Hi, Dear Friend
I was very busy recently today I find sometimes to respond you thanks your patient
Any question did not arise to ask ( I am not trying to say I know everything about) its been long time almost all seeking slowly droped away.
Your question was, there is something I feel incomplete
I don't have feeling something is incomplete nowhere to go, if I say "everything is well" is going to be repeat teachers words may be, but it is coming out this way, kind of feeling light and humble
If you have something to say warmly welcome
Thanks again and again🙏
I was very busy recently today I find sometimes to respond you thanks your patient
Any question did not arise to ask ( I am not trying to say I know everything about) its been long time almost all seeking slowly droped away.
Your question was, there is something I feel incomplete
I don't have feeling something is incomplete nowhere to go, if I say "everything is well" is going to be repeat teachers words may be, but it is coming out this way, kind of feeling light and humble
If you have something to say warmly welcome
Thanks again and again🙏
Re: Knowingness
Hello there!
Unfortunately your former guide is unable to participate in this for the time being.
Let us continue and finish this conversation, insofar it is needed and wished for!
Has something significantly come up in the meantime?
Is there any unclarity left concerning the existence of a separate self?
With kindest regards
Matthew
Unfortunately your former guide is unable to participate in this for the time being.
Let us continue and finish this conversation, insofar it is needed and wished for!
That sounds pretty good.I don't have feeling something is incomplete nowhere to go
Has something significantly come up in the meantime?
Is there any unclarity left concerning the existence of a separate self?
With kindest regards
Matthew
First there is a mountain,
Then there is no mountain,
Then there is.
Then there is no mountain,
Then there is.
Re: Knowingness
Hi, Matthew
Thank you
I don't want take your time long, shortly I will answer your question
Last few weeks I did many contemplation all this about that to respond being here. In these contemplations I put question that
"Can I turn back all the way life before "my understanding" was not there"
"Can I see the world before I was seeing"
It was not posibble that, this person was not there as an entity no way. There were innocent thoughts about person and its stories and world, floating in the loving and hugging quality of Wast. There was forgiveness all over around all wrongs and rights.
Most amazing, "my understanding" lost its importance
Freedom.
Thanks all you doing this great job here🙏
Thank you
I don't want take your time long, shortly I will answer your question
Last few weeks I did many contemplation all this about that to respond being here. In these contemplations I put question that
"Can I turn back all the way life before "my understanding" was not there"
"Can I see the world before I was seeing"
It was not posibble that, this person was not there as an entity no way. There were innocent thoughts about person and its stories and world, floating in the loving and hugging quality of Wast. There was forgiveness all over around all wrongs and rights.
Most amazing, "my understanding" lost its importance
Freedom.
Thanks all you doing this great job here🙏
Re: Knowingness
Sounds amazing :)
I'd love to finish this conversation by posing the final questions.
1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?
2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.
3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.
4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?
5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work? What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.
6) Anything to add?
Answer them at your convenience!
I'd love to finish this conversation by posing the final questions.
1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?
2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.
3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.
4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?
5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work? What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.
6) Anything to add?
Answer them at your convenience!
First there is a mountain,
Then there is no mountain,
Then there is.
Then there is no mountain,
Then there is.
Re: Knowingness
Hi, Matthew
Here is respond your question
1: Shortly there is no existence at all anywhere anyway never was even to say like a dream too much because dream has shape and story etc. in it. There is just knowingness moment to moment all together every moment a New knowingness. If thislike fluid diamond light dance in the wast, loving, solitude darkness like home sources of light it self
2: it's illumination reveals it self to itself that moment love arises to join to the dance with hugging quality, wants pouring out (solitude and vastness veil with that) at that moment this fluid diamond light shows the world like two dimensional. Everything starts moving functioning colors etc. Love push desire to be, that involvement happens Nur is there to be part of dance ( this is my description of becoming person) when Nur join to dance turns 3 dimensional
These are my last 6 months experiences it started about 2 years ago gradually became here. With Adyashanti's teaching " Who is looking behind of your eyes"
3: To be free from carrying the understanding produced fluidity kind of melt in the understanding disrepair, what ever it takes no more carrying, forgetting remembering that was great relive it was contentment of absence I did not watch it any more it never leaves
These are my last one week experience caused by your dialogue
4: I think realty it self When I surrendered unknown about 3 years ago little miracles started to happen whenever there was question answers was coming on my way with in order. My new born grandson touched me how to see as an innocent I could see the world with his looking it was unbelievable he is two years old now it must be were different seeing at this days
I was cooking ghee ( clarified butter) finished cooking I looked at its clear yellow texture suddenly I saw all earth people and their story all life flowing cows calfs kids playing grasses insects in it birds sun moon etc. all opened up all in it like essence to all this before experience already every think done in it. Like our inside unknown dark radiate out it self as a life empty but full already complete invisible turn visible with imagination
I thought that sun is not the sun we know it was our inner light opened itself as everything
Here is respond your question
1: Shortly there is no existence at all anywhere anyway never was even to say like a dream too much because dream has shape and story etc. in it. There is just knowingness moment to moment all together every moment a New knowingness. If thislike fluid diamond light dance in the wast, loving, solitude darkness like home sources of light it self
2: it's illumination reveals it self to itself that moment love arises to join to the dance with hugging quality, wants pouring out (solitude and vastness veil with that) at that moment this fluid diamond light shows the world like two dimensional. Everything starts moving functioning colors etc. Love push desire to be, that involvement happens Nur is there to be part of dance ( this is my description of becoming person) when Nur join to dance turns 3 dimensional
These are my last 6 months experiences it started about 2 years ago gradually became here. With Adyashanti's teaching " Who is looking behind of your eyes"
3: To be free from carrying the understanding produced fluidity kind of melt in the understanding disrepair, what ever it takes no more carrying, forgetting remembering that was great relive it was contentment of absence I did not watch it any more it never leaves
These are my last one week experience caused by your dialogue
4: I think realty it self When I surrendered unknown about 3 years ago little miracles started to happen whenever there was question answers was coming on my way with in order. My new born grandson touched me how to see as an innocent I could see the world with his looking it was unbelievable he is two years old now it must be were different seeing at this days
I was cooking ghee ( clarified butter) finished cooking I looked at its clear yellow texture suddenly I saw all earth people and their story all life flowing cows calfs kids playing grasses insects in it birds sun moon etc. all opened up all in it like essence to all this before experience already every think done in it. Like our inside unknown dark radiate out it self as a life empty but full already complete invisible turn visible with imagination
I thought that sun is not the sun we know it was our inner light opened itself as everything
Re: Knowingness
5: I don't responsible anything these words could have meaning for me until few years before but here and now no meaning we don't do anything we are not exist life live life whatever this survival needs mostly words words need human being to help them to do their job in the manifestation especially these words veil the silence keep us far away our nature they create ego and pretending persons
We all possibility of another beings wherever our attentions goes we become it wherever we look we see our possibility to be that thing. We all already Buda no one and no thing left out we don't feel it because these words drive us
We experience things after finish how decisions works, experience arises from ground of being open up as a life already complete finish how could be control. We can just pretending with all these words grasp their meaning we create ego, ego needs body as a home to feel exist and in charge
Instead of enjoy to be this beautiful manifestation of divine, being loving home make all quest comfortable and content
(Here I mostly use"We" because when I wrote it with "I" sound like ego talking sorry about that these are my experience)
6: I thanks all teachers all life everything in it good and bad that was the great teacher 60 years train me thanks for online technology
Of course you, pulling out last roots of WHAT😳
That was wonderful to being here with you. You made me dig my grave check it out last time I fell free 🙏so it was fun
Thanks all help
We all possibility of another beings wherever our attentions goes we become it wherever we look we see our possibility to be that thing. We all already Buda no one and no thing left out we don't feel it because these words drive us
We experience things after finish how decisions works, experience arises from ground of being open up as a life already complete finish how could be control. We can just pretending with all these words grasp their meaning we create ego, ego needs body as a home to feel exist and in charge
Instead of enjoy to be this beautiful manifestation of divine, being loving home make all quest comfortable and content
(Here I mostly use"We" because when I wrote it with "I" sound like ego talking sorry about that these are my experience)
6: I thanks all teachers all life everything in it good and bad that was the great teacher 60 years train me thanks for online technology
Of course you, pulling out last roots of WHAT😳
That was wonderful to being here with you. You made me dig my grave check it out last time I fell free 🙏so it was fun
Thanks all help
Re: Knowingness
Thank you for these beautiful answers!
There shall be no conversation ended here, when there is a risk of lingering unclarities remaining.
For that matter, please let us clarify some terms, so that we understand eachother correctly!
As answer to question three you wrote:
Or answer the question anew? You can also just report from daily life a bit.
What changes, what stays the same.
How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.
In answer number five you wrote:
Has an "ego" ever existed? Was it ever created?
There shall be no conversation ended here, when there is a risk of lingering unclarities remaining.
For that matter, please let us clarify some terms, so that we understand eachother correctly!
As answer to question three you wrote:
Could you rephrase that?To be free from carrying the understanding produced fluidity kind of melt in the understanding disrepair, what ever it takes no more carrying, forgetting remembering that was great relive it was contentment of absence I did not watch it any more it never leaves.
Or answer the question anew? You can also just report from daily life a bit.
What changes, what stays the same.
How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.
In answer number five you wrote:
Is there an actual entity "we", that creates an ego?We can just pretending with all these words grasp their meaning we create ego
Has an "ego" ever existed? Was it ever created?
First there is a mountain,
Then there is no mountain,
Then there is.
Then there is no mountain,
Then there is.
Re: Knowingness
I Hi, Matthew
Here is respond to your last post I wish works this time
3) How does it feel to see this?
What is the difference from before you started this dialogue?
Please report from the past few days.
Gap between this stages disrepair forever. To see that did not do any astonishment
Before conversation
looking (seeing) was from inside of the illusion (with knowing I am not that)
There was no believing Nur entity after this point
Shift happen
Looking (seeing) was from outside of the illusion (with knowing I am that)
There was no believing existence world or universes after that point
Just there was knowingness
After conversation
Shift happen
Which is now
Burned out shift switch (stillness and silence does not break up with events)
looking from no where and everywhere (with knowing I am nothing and everything and beyond) (knowingness knows it self as it self without pause)
Another words to say: There was no gap ever There was no division ever All there is this is no where to go
Like vast dark Groundless theater, move plays without screen, actors and audiences. No border no limits, unfolds in this intelligence, full nonexistent potential empty eternity perceive and knows it self as it self. Even to say "I am That" too much because already is.
Last words to say in my experience This is it
Recent experience of life
There is feeling loneliness it is not new but more strong
Love blows, tears come for no reason
Afternoon naps body sleep “I” don’t
There is no desire to talk and listen (I do it anyway if necessary)
Before There was grace feeling all this, Now natural
Stillness and silent does not break up with events
Little memory loss
Experiencing things is different
Contentment humility forgiveness in the breathing air
There is deep relaxing like after well done job
5. Question
Is there an actual entity "we", that creates an ego?
Has an "ego" ever existed? Was it ever created?
Of course not but there was believing they were exist and there was effort to get rid of them to reach the truth. (Until few years before)
If there is responsibly must be entity for it, all other words needs entity too
Life it self does not need to act with this words meaning
Like it is hot sunny days walking on the street takes place shady side automatically, chosen. Life it self does it because it arises from ground of being whole thing already done All of them same way. this is the feeling
It does not mean I am aloof what ever things show up respond comes with it mostly time much more softer and lovingly done with heart
Thanks your patience Matthew🙏
Here is respond to your last post I wish works this time
3) How does it feel to see this?
What is the difference from before you started this dialogue?
Please report from the past few days.
Gap between this stages disrepair forever. To see that did not do any astonishment
Before conversation
looking (seeing) was from inside of the illusion (with knowing I am not that)
There was no believing Nur entity after this point
Shift happen
Looking (seeing) was from outside of the illusion (with knowing I am that)
There was no believing existence world or universes after that point
Just there was knowingness
After conversation
Shift happen
Which is now
Burned out shift switch (stillness and silence does not break up with events)
looking from no where and everywhere (with knowing I am nothing and everything and beyond) (knowingness knows it self as it self without pause)
Another words to say: There was no gap ever There was no division ever All there is this is no where to go
Like vast dark Groundless theater, move plays without screen, actors and audiences. No border no limits, unfolds in this intelligence, full nonexistent potential empty eternity perceive and knows it self as it self. Even to say "I am That" too much because already is.
Last words to say in my experience This is it
Recent experience of life
There is feeling loneliness it is not new but more strong
Love blows, tears come for no reason
Afternoon naps body sleep “I” don’t
There is no desire to talk and listen (I do it anyway if necessary)
Before There was grace feeling all this, Now natural
Stillness and silent does not break up with events
Little memory loss
Experiencing things is different
Contentment humility forgiveness in the breathing air
There is deep relaxing like after well done job
5. Question
Is there an actual entity "we", that creates an ego?
Has an "ego" ever existed? Was it ever created?
Of course not but there was believing they were exist and there was effort to get rid of them to reach the truth. (Until few years before)
If there is responsibly must be entity for it, all other words needs entity too
Life it self does not need to act with this words meaning
Like it is hot sunny days walking on the street takes place shady side automatically, chosen. Life it self does it because it arises from ground of being whole thing already done All of them same way. this is the feeling
It does not mean I am aloof what ever things show up respond comes with it mostly time much more softer and lovingly done with heart
Thanks your patience Matthew🙏
Re: Knowingness
No patience needed. It is a joy!
Thanks for the further elaboration and clarification.
I'll be in touch.
Thanks for the further elaboration and clarification.
I'll be in touch.
First there is a mountain,
Then there is no mountain,
Then there is.
Then there is no mountain,
Then there is.
Re: Knowingness
Hello again!
One guide asks:
Could you describe what "I" or "self" is from today's perspective?
How is it experienced?
Does it exist? Or is it just an ongoing fantasy?
Which is basically referring to question number two
Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.
You already answered this question. But if you, again, could find a different wording, that would be great!
A wording, that can be understood better here.
Looking forward to your reply!
One guide asks:
Could you describe what "I" or "self" is from today's perspective?
How is it experienced?
Does it exist? Or is it just an ongoing fantasy?
Which is basically referring to question number two
Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.
You already answered this question. But if you, again, could find a different wording, that would be great!
A wording, that can be understood better here.
Looking forward to your reply!
First there is a mountain,
Then there is no mountain,
Then there is.
Then there is no mountain,
Then there is.
Re: Knowingness
Hi, Friends,
I am late to respond but very busy week birthdays, visitors, grandchildren, work, etc. I just find quite time.
I wish answers ok this time. If I write fully it can make small book
Bold part of the text is until last several years was my experience. I wrote just which are came out right now.
There was always some kind of longing all my life I did not know what is all about
Second part of text is my experience recently
Thanks your time and patient 🙏
Separate self is when "I" identify it self with experience's contents and believing that experiencing is coming from out side of body and mind.
This believe starts the separate self
Believing that, I am doing, sensing, feeling, etc.
Believing that me and world is separate, Made with different substance and exist
Believing that I am human being as a person having life I was born and will die
Goes on and on
I or Self never existed as an entity like everything else but useful for communication
I live my given moments as a life.
Fells like big colorful sphere made with divine light empty to existing but full displays of its modulation
Nur and others move feel, senses, etc as a whole one experience.
even illusions being "I" or "Self" during the events part of this experience is experiencing
There are no believing this or that, kind a no attention about particular object and subject
There is no yearning left
My absence rest in the divine ground it's light shine "I" know. No distance no separation everything everything just one
Where I started I finished there like unborn walking on the earth
I am late to respond but very busy week birthdays, visitors, grandchildren, work, etc. I just find quite time.
I wish answers ok this time. If I write fully it can make small book
Bold part of the text is until last several years was my experience. I wrote just which are came out right now.
There was always some kind of longing all my life I did not know what is all about
Second part of text is my experience recently
Thanks your time and patient 🙏
Separate self is when "I" identify it self with experience's contents and believing that experiencing is coming from out side of body and mind.
This believe starts the separate self
Believing that, I am doing, sensing, feeling, etc.
Believing that me and world is separate, Made with different substance and exist
Believing that I am human being as a person having life I was born and will die
Goes on and on
I or Self never existed as an entity like everything else but useful for communication
I live my given moments as a life.
Fells like big colorful sphere made with divine light empty to existing but full displays of its modulation
Nur and others move feel, senses, etc as a whole one experience.
even illusions being "I" or "Self" during the events part of this experience is experiencing
There are no believing this or that, kind a no attention about particular object and subject
There is no yearning left
My absence rest in the divine ground it's light shine "I" know. No distance no separation everything everything just one
Where I started I finished there like unborn walking on the earth
Re: Knowingness
What beautiful answers!
There is no patience needed at all. It is a joy! And very interesting to hear, how exactly this happened and unfolded at your location.
And of course it is most important for us to make perfectly sure, that there are no unclarities left.
One guide asks:
Could you please summarise in one sentence:
What is "I"?
Can the "I" identify with something, or believe in something?
There is no patience needed at all. It is a joy! And very interesting to hear, how exactly this happened and unfolded at your location.
And of course it is most important for us to make perfectly sure, that there are no unclarities left.
One guide asks:
Could you please summarise in one sentence:
What is "I"?
Can the "I" identify with something, or believe in something?
First there is a mountain,
Then there is no mountain,
Then there is.
Then there is no mountain,
Then there is.
Re: Knowingness
Hi, Friends
"I" is the focused awareness to thoughts.
Can not be identify with something or believing in something
🙏
"I" is the focused awareness to thoughts.
Can not be identify with something or believing in something
🙏
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