Looking for real freedom

[jraybould]

Hi Steve,

Thanks very much for agreeing to the deep looking session.

Can we please do tomorrow night at 8.30?

Thanks

John

[blackh]

Hi John,

Sure. See you then.


Steve

[jraybould]

Thanks Steve!

[blackh]

Hi John,

That was a great Skype session. It sounds like everything is coming along nicely. Here are the final questions as discussed:

1. Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?
   Was there ever?
2. Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience.
   Describe it fully as you see it now.
3. How does it feel to see this?
   What is the difference from before you started this dialogue?
   Please report from the past few days.
4. What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?
   ­
   ­
5. Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control.
   What makes things happen?
   How does it work?
   What are you responsible for?
   Give examples from experience.
6. Anything to add?

Steve

[jraybould]

Hi Steve,

My apologies for the delay in responding. I wanted to give this a decent period of undivided time.

Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?
Was there ever?

There is no me. I look, and look, and look again and all i find is silence or emptyness. It certainly felt' as if there was a me in the past, and occasionally there are still thoughts/a story about a me. However my brain now quickly asks "where is the me that's doing all the housework" (or similar complaint) and again there's silence. There has been a lot of fear and a burning energy for as long as I can remember. And when this energy is burning intensely there is still resistance to old patterns. But again it's fear happening to no one, which although is still intense, is immeasurably more acceptable and less problematic than when there is the belief that there is someone in there, and that they are fighting this fear. Hallelujah!

As far as if there was never a me the answer is "no, not a not a real me". There was a highly problematic bunch of thought processes 'called John' which could never quite get there. Always tirelessly looking to find ways to persuade negative thoughts to go away, and resisting all of the pain and shameful parts of him. Just a big bundle of self serving thoughts and energy whizzing around an assumed character and feeding each other via resistance.

I had a wonderful deep looking session with the lady I have mentioned before in where it was realised in the total absence of me (and the visceral recognition that I was love) that I had always been this throughout my life including all of my toughest times. So during tough times in my teens when I was deeply lost in a very unhappy story/self full of self loathing I was deeply at peace inside (there was no me - only love). So deeply healing and made me feel more trusting of life

Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience.
Describe it fully as you see it now

I have looked very closely as this over the last year or so and the self for me is a contraction of sorts, an assumption, and a dialogue that wants to keep going. And upon very close/deep review it would say "what would happen to you if I'm not here", "look at all the trouble and pain you got into in your teens. If I'm not here you might get back into drugs etc". And I admire the ingenuity and good intentions of these thoughts/this pattern. However there was something else here that was so tired of living through a veil. And keeping me away from life and connection. And eventually the pain of that separation has thankfully kept me looking, enquiring until this pattern has collapsed in on itself.

How does it feel to see this?
What is the difference from before you started this dialogue?
Please report from the past few days.

It is immensely liberating to see this. And so good to be living the truth. The seeing of a lack of a real self is removing the root cause of 'problems'

This dialogue has helped me particularly in the direct looking part. Other non duality stuff I had been watching had led me to believe there is nothing that can be done as there's no you. Ok, there's no me but there's a brain, and if it creates a useful thought that says "look if there's a me" when I get lost in a story then this seems to help.

So this week has been somewhat up and down. Earlier in the week there was a calm like I've not had since childhood. A real deep trust in life and a feeling of openess and connection. However for the last 2 days there had been a lot of intense energy, shameful thoughts, fear. But when I look closely the 'bad stuff' is empty.
It's like there's a real paradox happening as painful thoughts are arising and there is some resistance and suffering. But at another level everything is deeply ok and peaceful because both the me and my fear is all empty.
Hopefully this will level off and there will be more ease and the body with be more relaxed.

What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

The question "can thought think?" helped to shake the foundations a lot. I've known that the self is just a bunch of thoughts/beliefs/assumptions for a while at an intellectual level. However it still felt like there was a real self. but when I truly enquired if thought could think there was no way it could, and there was an aha moment that this was all an illusion.

Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control

When I am driving a car there are decisions happening but no one is making them. One minute I'm going left, then right but no one is choosing. I am mindful now of how I used to believe the 'me' thoughts that would come in after. Like a sports commentary of sorts trying to take credit, or assign guilt etc. Pretty funny really!

What makes things happen?

I don't know what makes things happen. Maybe this will become clear as this seeing deepens. Or maybe it's beyond the human mind. What I do know is that when I look back to a time when I thought I could make my own destiny and make life bow to me it made me exhausted and suffer, suffer, suffer. Now I have learned to bow to life and things appear to flow really well and whatever I need seems to appear.

How does it work? What are you responsible for?
Give examples from experience

So I have 2 children sleeping in the room next to where I am typing and there was previously a lot of fear that if the me wasn't here then I may choose to abandon them. That I may not care. However after allowing that thought to come and go and the me to dissolve parenting seems to happen pretty well. There's no me but I appear in the morning to help them get to school etc And with no me I feel way more connection, no veil in the way.

Anything to add?

Although I know there's no me there's still a lot of old stuff coming up with a real intensity and there's some discomfort experienced. I understand that this is the norm and will hopefully lose it's charge. But would be great to get advice and support through this.

And thanks to you Steve and everyone at LU for this fine work in spreading the truth!!

Big love!

[blackh]

Hi John,

I was sick with the flu yesterday and couldn't do anything, but today I've asked the other guides to take a look. They may have further questions.


Steve

[jraybould]

Sorry to hear you're not well! Ok look forward to hearing back from you or the other guides.

Cheers

John

[blackh]

Hi John,

Getting better. :)

The other guides are happy now, so look for two private messages on the forum which will appear as a number next to the little envelope icon at the top right. One from me and one from an admin.

You're invited to join a Facebook group called LU Aftercare where you'll find others in the same situation. It's fairly quiet but it's a great resource when you have doubts or questions, or just want a bit of community, because, let's face it - you can't talk about this stuff to most people.

Here's one thing I like to emphasise at this point: You've been through a process in which you have found out who you are not. Please resist the temptation to replace that with some new idea of who you are. This is what the mind wants to do - to come up with a theory. In particular, "I am awareness" can be a trap, because it can construct a subtle "you" that is untouchable. If you dive right in to experience you will be closer to reality.

Have fun! And I'm always here if you want to talk to me.


Steve

[jraybould]

Hi Steve,

Thanks for your message. I've joined the facebook page which I'm enjoying. It's so cool to see Facebook used in this way - promoting what is real as oppose to what is fake.

I couldn't see a message from you. Should it be in the private messages.

Definitely not interested in any kind of construct of a me. To be honest there's lots of energy burning and looking into fear going on. Really just looking for there being some calm at the mo. However really good to be seeing through old outdated patterns from childhood etc. There's been the fear of fear going on for so long, it's so tiring. It's time to only be scared of real stuff, not illusion!

Cheers

John