Liberation Unleashed Forum The Gate
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#1more freedom maybe more intense somehow
#2 if no self then maybe more connected,less worrying ,more peaceful
#3. Reaction to fear reaction to feelings and pain
#4 joyfulness,gratitude
#5 patience with the pointing and guidence after seeing,also any insight with a spouse who is concerned and nervous
does the personality still operate the same after seeing??
thnx again Kay I will watch the utube video tomorrow as it is getting close to bedtime here,Allen:)
. How will you changemore freedom more intence some how
3. What will be differentif no self maybe more connected less worrying,more peaceful
reaction to fear reaction to feelings and pain
kay i'm apparently still not very skilled at this i'm working on it. I'm on an i pad so lil different and it let me do these three only will go to apple store monday a figure out what im doing wrong Thnx again allen:)
More freedom from what exactly?more freedom maybe more intense somehow1. How will life change?
This might not be what you want to hear, however, there has never been a separate individual/person called Allen. There isn’t one now that is reading this, and there won’t be one there later on either! So life may or may not change, but that is not the purpose of seeing through the illusory self. The purpose of this exploration is to see that there is no one/no thing that is actually identifying as a person, and that what is actually appearing is actual experience (AE) which has always been and never has not been…it’s just been obscured by thoughts.if no self then maybe more connected,less worrying ,more peaceful2. How will you change?
Again, reactions may or may not change, but what is seen is that there is no ‘person/entity’ of any description that is reacting to anything. Cause and effect are concepts, as is time, the body and object/subject split. We will be looking at these as we move along this exploration.Reaction to fear reaction to feelings and pain3. What will be different
Joyfulness and gratitude are concepts, as is fear, anger, hope, sadness, depression, bliss and so on. There seems to be preferences to what one would like to think, feel, say, do and and so on, but there is actually no one/no thing that is/can choose anything. These seeming emotions appear and it will be seen that these emotions are not happening to anyone/anything. Emotions are actually label + sensation + thoughts ABOUT emotions, but emotions in and of themselves are just thought stories.joyfulness,gratitude4. What is missing?
I am patient; however it is up to you to LOOK. If you don’t LOOK then this exploration goes nowhere. I have been known to bring out the zen stick when answers are coming from intellectual concepts, theories, philosophies and spiritual rhetoric, instead of from LOOKING with actual experience (AE). I have explained what LOOKING is in my previous post, but I will post it again, just as a reminder.patience with the pointing and guidence after seeing, also any insight with a spouse who is concerned and nervous5. What would you like to achieve or obtain by this conversation?
Thought streams ARE stories. There are no thoughts that are more real than other thoughts and there are no thoughts that are good or bad! Thoughts are actual experience (AE) and they can point to actual experience ie colour/image, sound, taste, smell and sensation, or point to thought stories, but thoughts are just thoughts and do not contain any experience. If thoughts contained experience, the word ‘sweet’ would taste sweet and the word ‘hot’ would burn!the affects of attatching to thought streams and storiesMore freedom from what exactly?
not as strong a sense of me doing the actual experience although a constant thought stream throughout.when tasting with eyes closed seemed to happen in nothing with eyes open seemed to happen in the head.hearing with eyes closed seemed to arise out of nowhere and disappear into nothing with eyes open i would locate sound with eyes and thought or name what caused it. Lot of sight with labling objects. What small amount of not labeling happened then less a thought of me doing it.bright vibrant colors grabbed more focus as did pain and loud noises.out of twelve hours maybe spent two hours of AE that was intentional. AE very difficult to do with tv or mutiple people ineracting in room.still have four more hours left of eveningJust break down all experiences into these categories (which are all actual experience) and report back how you go..
not as strong a sense of me doing the actual experience although a constant thought stream throughout.Just break down all experiences into these categories (which are all actual experience) and report back how you go..
when tasting with eyes closed seemed to happen in nothing with eyes open seemed to happen in the head.
hearing with eyes closed seemed to arise out of nowhere and disappear into nothing with eyes open i would locate sound with eyes and thought or name what caused it.
Lot of sight with labling objects. What small amount of not labeling happened then less a thought of me doing it.
bright vibrant colors grabbed more focus as did pain and loud noises.
out of twelve hours maybe spent two hours of AE that was intentional. AE very difficult to do with tv or mutiple people ineracting in room. still have four more hours left of evening
the mind was very active layering on meaning the first couple of hours then reread text a few more times and was able to follow instuctions better.after a while hearing and sound one thing.same with smelling and smell tasting and taste and sensing sensations.much more difficult with seeing and color wanted to put shape and distance as AE then saw it as part of content of thinking finally.thoughts much harder still as memory being content and also pointing to something happening as a sense of self and some kind of meaning.so im afraid the mind is "trying to work it out". I' ll try to go back to AE Excersize. Let me know how you go :)
hi kay. Now seeing and color are same thing and happening with other AE adding compexity to experience.not quite sure yet on thinking and thoughtLet me know how you go :).
Terrific LOOKING! And really great that you saw that shape and distance are content of thought and not AE! We will be taking a LOOK at thoughts next, Allen, which will help to distinguish between the AE of thought and the content of thought.hi kay. Now seeing and color are same thing and happening with other AE adding compexity to experience.not quite sure yet on thinking and thoughtthe mind was very active layering on meaning the first couple of hours then reread text a few more times and was able to follow instuctions better.after a while hearing and sound one thing.same with smelling and smell tasting and taste and sensing sensations.much more difficult with seeing and color wanted to put shape and distance as AE then saw it as part of content of thinking finally.thoughts much harder still as memory being content and also pointing to something happening as a sense of self and some kind of meaning.so im afraid the mind is "trying to work it out". I' ll try to go back to AE ExcersizeLet me know how you go :)
the first two were easy.then u added er on the end took more looking and no deviding line actually at all. Crazy its still no line when two AE operating at same time. So, just to be clear, can a border or dividing line be found between seeing/image-colour, hearing/sound, taster/taste, feeler/sensation, smeller/smell, thinker/thought?
In other words is there a place, for example, where sound stops and the ‘knowing’ of it starts? Is there a border or dividing line between the ‘knowing’ of the sound and the sound itself (the ‘known’) or are they one and the same ‘knowingknown (‘hearersound’)?
I don't quite get what you mean when you say "two AE operating at same time", can you explain that to me please.the first two were easy.then u added er on the end took more looking and no deviding line actually at all. Crazy its still no line when two AE operating at same timeSo, just to be clear, can a border or dividing line be found between seeing/image-colour, hearing/sound, taster/taste, feeler/sensation, smeller/smell, thinker/thought?
In other words is there a place, for example, where sound stops and the ‘knowing’ of it starts? Is there a border or dividing line between the ‘knowing’ of the sound and the sound itself (the ‘known’) or are they one and the same ‘knowingknown (‘hearersound’)?