passing through the gate

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Simon
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Re: passing through the gate

Postby Simon » Thu Feb 04, 2016 1:48 pm

Or is the label I an AE of thought and the image label I an AE of image/colours
The I is an illusion of thought, thought is the actual experience, and the image label I is an AE of image/colours.

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Simon
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Re: passing through the gate

Postby Simon » Fri Feb 05, 2016 1:42 am

]Did you do anything to make a particular thought or thoughts appear
No.
Could you have done anything to make a different thought appear at that exact moment instead ?
No.
Where are they coming from ?
I can't locate where thoughts arise.

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Simon
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Re: passing through the gate

Postby Simon » Fri Feb 05, 2016 2:02 am

where are they going?
I can't locate where they disappear they seem to just arise and dissappear.
Can you push away any thought?
if I don't attach my attention to thought it has no power and dissolves/ dissappears.
[Can you select from a range of thoughts to have only pleasant thoughts?
No its seems that they appear independently, However if the illusionary I recalls a pleasant event from memory then pleasant thoughts can apper.

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forgetmenot
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Re: passing through the gate

Postby forgetmenot » Fri Feb 05, 2016 2:07 am

Hi Simon,
Can thought be aware of anything or know anything?
No thought is an AE and experience can't be aware of its self only awareness.
"Awareness" is not a thing. It is a concept that describes the process of thoughts arising about the thoughts that arise.

What is awareness aware of?
How is it known there is awareness?
What does this awareness feel like, look like?
How big is it?
Where does it end?
Tell me as much as you can about it. Can you find it?

Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.

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Simon
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Re: passing through the gate

Postby Simon » Fri Feb 05, 2016 2:30 am

[Can anything choose not to have painful or negative thoughts?
In my experience No.
Can anything pick and choose any kind of thoughts
No.
Is it possible to control any thoughts?
There is no one to control anything.

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Simon
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Re: passing through the gate

Postby Simon » Fri Feb 05, 2016 2:40 am

It seems that thought has some logical ordered appearance, but look carefully and just notice if there is an organised sequence? Or is that just another thought that says ‘these thoughts are in sequence’ or “they take content from previous thought”, or that ‘one thought follows another thought’?
It seems that when sensations and perceptions are experienced thought attaches a label and the story begins.

kind regards
Simon

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Simon
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Re: passing through the gate

Postby Simon » Fri Feb 05, 2016 3:19 am

What is awareness aware of?
In my limited understanding of awareness it would appear to have many name's ie congesness, is ness, absolute.
Life is a manifestation and all that is happening is been experienced by this.
How is it known there is awareness?
Because it can be experienced from thought, senses and perception.
What does awareness feel like, look like ?
There is no apparent word to describe this, from my understanding it is limitless, boundless, infinite. It is everything and no thing.

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forgetmenot
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Re: passing through the gate

Postby forgetmenot » Fri Feb 05, 2016 8:27 am

Hi Simon,

I noticed with your responses that there is a reliance on an understanding from knowledge and it is this knowledge that is been used to answer questions.

The purpose of being guided is for guides to ask questions which are pointers which direct you to LOOK to find the answer and not rely on preconceived ideas, learnings, philosophies or thought…but to drop all of those and to just LOOK.

What LOOKING is:
‘Looking” is just plain looking to what is here right now. When you need your car keys and look everywhere for them – that is looking. It’s noticing sound, taste, smell, sensation and colours (images) to see what is readily available and has always been; as well as noticing thought/s - not thinking, but noticing or being ‘aware’ of thought/s.


So whenever I ask questions, I would like for you to LOOK and then tell me what you find.
Where are they coming from ?
I can't locate where thoughts arise.
Right.
where are they going?
I can't locate where they disappear they seem to just arise and dissappear.
Yep!
Can you push away any thought?
if I don't attach my attention to thought it has no power and dissolves/ dissappears.
Where can this ‘separate individual/person’ who can “attach attention to thought” be found? Please describe its location to me in minute detail.

Can you select from a range of thoughts to have only pleasant thoughts?
No its seems that they appear independently. However if the illusionary I recalls a pleasant event from memory then pleasant thoughts can apper.
Where is this “illusory I” located that can “recall pleasant event from memory”?
What is it exactly (entity/thing) that has a “memory” and where is it located?

Can anything choose not to have painful or negative thoughts?
In my experience No.
Where is this ‘separate individual’ that can experience anything?
Can anything pick and choose any kind of thoughts
No.
Great
Is it possible to control any thoughts?
There is no one to control anything.
Did you actually LOOK to see if there was anyone/thing controlling thoughts, or was your answer based from intellectual thoughts based on previous knowledge?

What is awareness aware of?
In my limited understanding of awareness it would appear to have many name's ie congesness, is ness, absolute.
This is an intellectual response and I am not wanting answers from your "limited understanding".
I want you to have a good LOOK everywhere and see if you can find anything that is called awareness/congesness/isness,absolute and if and when you do, to describe it to me please.
Life is a manifestation and all that is happening is been experienced by this.
How is it known that “life is a manifestation and all that is happening is been experienced by this?” Because thought said so?
Where exactly is this “this”?
How is it known there is awareness?
Because it can be experienced from thought, senses and perception.
Can you find anywhere anyone/thing that is experiencing from thought, senses and perception?
What does awareness feel like, look like?
There is no apparent word to describe this, from my understanding it is limitless, boundless, infinite. It is everything and no thing.
This exploration is not about what you understand based on intellectual knowledge. This is about LOOKING to find answers and it is only through LOOKING that the realisation arises that there is no illusory individual and never has been.

So please LOOK and answer the question.

What does awareness feel like, look like?

Please answer all questions in blue individually.

Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.

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Simon
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Re: passing through the gate

Postby Simon » Sat Feb 06, 2016 12:47 am

Where is this separate individual/person who can attach it's self to thought be found?
There is no separate individual/person to be found. LOOKING at thoughts, sensations and perception this is all happening to no one.
Where is the illusory I that can recall pleasant events from memory ?
There is no illusory I that can recall pleasant events from memory.
what is it exactly that has a memory and where can it be located?/quote]
There is no thing that has a memory and therefore cannot be located, it's all thought and part of the me story.

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Simon
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Re: passing through the gate

Postby Simon » Sat Feb 06, 2016 1:30 am

Where is the separate individual that can experance Anything ?
There is no separate individual who can experience anything.
Did you actually look and see if anyone/thing was controlling thoughts. ? Or are your answers based on intellectual thoughts based on previous knowledge
Yes l looked and what was found was for example when seeing a image shortly afterwards a thought arises and labels the image for example my car which in turn personalised the experience of seeing.
I want you to LOOK everywhere and see if you can find anything that is called awareness, congessness/isness, absolute and if and when you do to describe it in detail to me please?
There is nothing to be found awareness is a concept of thought.

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Simon
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Re: passing through the gate

Postby Simon » Sat Feb 06, 2016 1:56 am

What exactly is "This"
There is no this, my reply to the question was based on intellectual knowledge and not actual experience of looking there is no evidence when I look.
Can you find anywhere anyone/thing that is experiencing from thoughts, sensations and perception
No experiencing is just happening to no one/thing.
What does awareness feel /look like?
Awareness is a concept so impossible to feel or see !

Regards
Simon

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forgetmenot
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Re: passing through the gate

Postby forgetmenot » Sat Feb 06, 2016 5:38 am

Hey Simon,
Where is this separate individual/person who can attach it's self to thought be found?
There is no separate individual/person to be found. LOOKING at thoughts, sensations and perception this is all happening to no one.
Nice LOOKING! :)
Where is the illusory I that can recall pleasant events from memory ?
There is no illusory I that can recall pleasant events from memory.
“Memory” is the assumption of time, and time does not exist.
What is the AE of ‘memory’?

what is it exactly that has a memory and where can it be located?
There is no thing that has a memory and therefore cannot be located, it's all thought and part of the me story.
Yes…the “me story” is just all thoughts. Thoughts about thoughts, and what thoughts are about are pure fiction.
Yes l looked and what was found was for example when seeing a image shortly afterwards a thought arises and labels the image for example my car which in turn personalised the experience of seeing.
Yes, a thoughts appears saying “my car”, however there is no cause and effect. Cause and effect is another concept based on the assumption of time.

Have a close look….is it only a thought that says an image of a ‘car’ appeared and a thought the appeared and owned the image as “my car”?

What/who made that thought appear that said that is “my car”?

Is an image aware of a thought? Do images know anything about thoughts?
Is a thought aware of an image? Do thoughts know anything about images?

I want you to LOOK everywhere and see if you can find anything that is called awareness, congessness/isness, absolute and if and when you do to describe it in detail to me please?
There is nothing to be found awareness is a concept of thought.
The label “awareness” points to something being aware of something else. (Subject/object split). But if you LOOK can you see a border between “awareness” and what is being “awared”?
Another way of putting it is…can you find a border…..a dividing line between an ‘experience-er’ and what is being ‘experienced’?

Kay
xxoo
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.

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Simon
Posts: 82
Joined: Mon Feb 01, 2016 6:22 am

Re: passing through the gate

Postby Simon » Sun Feb 07, 2016 12:47 am

Hi Kay, Thank you for the boot in the ass I needed it :)
What is the AE of memory?
The label of memory is the AE of thought.
Have a close look..is it only a thought that says an image of a car appeared and then a thought appeared and owned the image my car ?
Thoughts, sensations, and perceptions seem to have a knowing when the initial experience arises then there seems to be a small gap and thought arises to amplifie the experience ie my car and the story continues.

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Simon
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Re: passing through the gate

Postby Simon » Sun Feb 07, 2016 1:32 am

what/who made the thought appear and say this is my car?
The experience of seeing an object ie car seems to trigger more thought which labels and claims ownership to personalise the story. There is no who just what is Happening.
Is an image aware of a thought?
The label image is a AE of thought, the perception of image is the AE of perception.
Do images know anything about thought ?
No it is all Thought

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forgetmenot
Posts: 6059
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Location: Australia

Re: passing through the gate

Postby forgetmenot » Sun Feb 07, 2016 1:55 am

Hey Simon,

Before I respond to you responses...I would like for you to do an exercise for me please on LOOKING at thoughts.

Here is a step-by-step description of how to look at thoughts:

(1) Notice the current thought that is present.
Like when you sit observing the body, a thought might arise “this is my feet” or “here is a pain” or “my breathing is too quick” or “I am bored with this exercise” or “I have better things to do” or any sorts of thoughts.

(2) This thought will pass and another thought will come. So just observe this thought passing.

(3) Then wait for the next thought to come.

(4) When the next thought is present, just notice it, and see how it passes.

(5) Then wait for the next thought to come.

(6) Repeat #4 and #5 many-many times.

Between the 2 thoughts there is a gap. It can be very short or subtle, just a second or a few seconds before the next thought come in.

This is how to look at thoughts.
Looking how they come and go.
And observing the short gap between them.
Noticing how the current thought is passing.
And waiting for the next thought to come.

Please do the following exercise:
Throughout your waking day, try to observe the gap between thoughts as often as possible. It can be done by noticing that ‘thinking’ is happening right now, then stop and just simply wait for the next thought to come. In the ‘waiting’ there is a gap between two thoughts.

Let me know how you go.

Kay
xxoo
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.


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