The last step...

[RonWhitaker]

There is a very strong sense of being. Over the years of therapy and meditation it has got stronger and stronger. What disappeared was the concerns, worries and attention to thoughts. Thoughts drift in, quickly evaluated and dropped or used. When I say evaluated I don't mean much in the line of thinking but in instinct. I can use the mind as a tool when required but on the whole much ignore it content. I come from a past of much depression and the work done has left me light and peaceful in so much contradiction than before.

It's not so much a Ron but a peaceful beingness, a strong Iness with nothing but just open sense of hereness or presence. It is a feeling of I without qualities of this or that. The thing is, it so very strong, not heavy put contains much power or strength I never had in my youth. An exceptionally strong I AM.

In my meditations I have come in touch with the space spoken in the teaching of Emptiness. This too is present not as separate but somehow contained or within this I AM or presence or space. In reading of the Liberation Unleashed quotes today I find this term used in the same context.

With the 40+ years of meditation and the readings and teaching there is the teachings of "Oneness" of I disappearing. Of course I have been waiting in expectation of transformation. This is what brings me to LiberationUnleashed.

In summary the strength, power, and presents of simple beingness presents as "I".

[codyjdennis]

Thank your for your honesty Ron. I think I'm getting a gist of where your coming from now.

With the 40+ years of meditation and the readings and teaching there is the teachings of "Oneness" of I disappearing. Of course I have been waiting in expectation of transformation. This is what brings me to LiberationUnleashed.

Pay close attention to what I put in bold.

I have a few comments/questions for you.

1. If you look in experience and do not find an I, what exactly would disappear? How could something that is not here in the first place disappear?

2. Notice the contradiction here. "there is the teachings of "oneness" of I disappearing." And then you say "I" have been waiting in expectation of transformation.

There is no "I". Look for yourself. If you want we could say it has already disappeared. It's disappearance IS how it is right now.

It could be more accurate to say that the self I, me, mine, myself is literally being created each moment. Like the big bang. It literally does not exist.

[RonWhitaker]

If you want we could say it has already disappeared. It's disappearance IS how it is right now.
[/quote]


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[RonWhitaker]

Cody

Ignore above reply.

1. I had a conversation today with a close spiritual friend. At one point she said something that set be back on my heals. Of course bringing it to the light of awareness it quickly dissolved. She brought to light some conditioning. Yes we can see conditioning and conditioning can be removed or dissolved. But looking at experience no "I".

2. Is Oneness/Separation anything other than thought - thinking. As you say transformation of what.

I feel the biggest difficulty is in the looking for something not there, as you pointed out -

If you want we could say it has already disappeared. It's disappearance IS how it is right now.

Ron

[codyjdennis]

But looking at experience no "I".

YES :)

I feel the biggest difficulty is in the looking for something not there, as you pointed out -

It can be quite strange/difficult. In general though we are not looking for something that isn't there. Most of everyone who comes to LU (probably including you) is under the assumption that there is a self (I, me, mine, myself). Constantly people stay "I want to see" while believing the I who see's is based in something real.

So the looking at LU is more of a process of looking for the self that is assumed to be real, but in our experience. What people find is that there is "no self" in our experience. It simply isn't true/real. So that's the direction we're always headed.

Coming into the dialogue the guide see's in live experience right now just like you that there is not actually a self & my sole objective is to guide you, so you can see that as well. However it is up to your honesty and desire to look for yourself in your experience to find that out. I can only point/nudge.

2. Is Oneness/Separation anything other than thought - thinking. As you say transformation of what.

Can you find either of those in experience? Not in thinking, in experience.

[RonWhitaker]

Can you find either of those in experience? Not in thinking, in experience.

No!

There is only seeing, hearing, smelling, feeling,....

I think what is happening (words purposely chosen) is the experience is so clear and strong it's getting labeled as me, mine, I. In fact it is only just simple raw experience, uncluttered.

[codyjdennis]

No!

There is only seeing, hearing, smelling, feeling,....

I think what is happening (words purposely chosen) is the experience is so clear and strong it's getting labeled as me, mine, I. In fact it is only just simple raw experience, uncluttered.

Beautiful :)


Would you be ready for our final questions? Let me know if you have anything to add/ask. If not I kind send you them asap.

[RonWhitaker]

Ready


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[codyjdennis]

Here are the final questions.

Here they are:

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work? What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.

6) Anything to add?

Best,
Cody

[RonWhitaker]

This mornings meditation was a test. One of those meditations you don't want to leave, just simply quiet.

I had such a good meditation! snicker tee hee

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

No

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

This mornings meditation displays the illusion clearly for me. That strong presence brings forth the experience and so quickly "I" is attached, "my" experience, "my" good feelings. It's totally effortless. The mind is swift. But when sitting in meditation and mind temporarily stops there is only experience no "I". But swift and quick mind comes back and claims victory.

As I see it now - It's like being poked with a stick. I pick up the "I" and something pokes me with a stick.

3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

No biggy. I have done much therapy to overcome depression. Along the path there was many aha's, realizations. Each one has it's release or quickening. Each on brings a new freedom from the burden lifted. I think a shift occured a few days ago and for me it takes time to settle before I realized a lightness of experience.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

Not sure - nothing comes.

5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work? What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.

I am responsible for keeping an eye on "I". Nothing more.

I have a friend going through some very hard times. She called last night to report some more difficulties and her fight to overcome. She said during doing the dishes she decided to just take care and do what she can. She reported her stress level dropped.

I reflected on the meaning for me - resistance is futile. Over the past few years it seems I am choosing what happens, it's more fun that way.

The meaning of life I cannot get into:
- who makes decisions - no me
- who makes intensions - not "I"
- who has free will - not mine.


What makes things happen? How does it work? Completely beyond my comprehension. I just here for the ride. (Pardon the use of the "I").

6) Anything to add?

Life goes on. Nothing is permanent except change.

[codyjdennis]

I am responsible for keeping an eye on "I". Nothing more.

What is the "I" that is responsible to keep and eye on "I"? Can it be found in experience?

I pick up the "I" and something pokes me with a stick.

What picks up the "I"?

[RonWhitaker]

Yesterday after writing the answers and all the time since then I have been uncomfortable with my responses. I am wondering if it's all intellectual with me.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[codyjdennis]

I am wondering if it's all intellectual with me.

Where is the me? Where is Ron?

Look in your experience. It's a yes or no question.

[RonWhitaker]

When I sit in meditation which is just experience there is the quiet stillness of pure being, simple awareness - pure I, me.

[codyjdennis]

pure being, simple awareness - pure I, me.

That's not what I asked you.

And find an exact entity called "awareness" in experience.