Guide for a Buddhist requested.

[smudge]

You are doing great...keep going...

So you look for YOU and imagine yourself in the mirror and you correctly note this is memory, so that not you, Correct, its memory. Then looking again you note body sensations and sounds. Again correct there are body sensations and sound. Still no I is found, this is because there is no I to be found! Never was, never will be!

Why is this step much more difficult?

It is much more difficult because it is challenging a lifelong assumption that there is an I doing all this feeling, hearing, remembering.

Do this: Write for me what you are experiencing right now using the words I and me. Get right to the point, no past or future fantasy, just plain description of here now. Like this: I am lying in bed. I am hearing rain. I am typing these words. Do this for 10 minutes. Watch the body; what physical sensations are happening? Then for the next 10 minutes write what you are experiencing without the words I and me. Just describe the experience as it is happening in the moment, using verbs: Waiting for next thought, typing, breathing, blinking, hearing rain. Again watch what is happening in the body. Now compare these two ways to label experience. What do you notice?

x

[phoenix]

Thank-you in advance for this Smudge. I have a feeling this will be a long post full of stuff that is boring and irrelevant for you to read. Here goes:
I am typing. The computer screen hurts my eyes. I am having tired hands. I am sitting. I am hearing this loud machine. I am tired of hearing that machine. I am wondering how long I have to type before my timer goes off. I am breathing. I can feel my body on the back of this chair. I am breathing again. I am thinking that my eyes are hurting. I am wondering how to do this exercise without using I and me. I am already tired of listing my current experiences. My thoughts seem to be slowing down. My elbows are a bit sore. This is now reminding me of Vipassana. I just want to stop typing and to be. I am wanting. I am feeling my back having pressure. I am feeling tightness above my chest. My eyes are tired. My feet are sweaty. I hear that loud machine. My fridge isn't as loud as that. I am worrying about my family. I want them to have happiness. I am having my thoughts go to the future. I am trying to be present and to keep typing. But how do I stay present and type anything worthwhile. Wow the timer went = }
Okay now I will set the timer again and do this again...............................

[phoenix]

breathing. Typing. soreness. tightness. hearing machine. thinking. Hearing machine. Hearing silence beneath the machine. Pressure on back. breathing. Tightness on chest. Sore eyes. Tired hands. Pressure on legs. thinking. Gaps in thoughts. Thinking. Pressure on elbows. Clumsy hands. Strange sensation in them. Hear sounds beneath machine. Breathing. Typing. Being. Thinking. Gaps in thoughts. Many sensations. Many sensations. Thinking of sensations. Tightness. Boredom. Sensation in hands. Breathing difficult. Breathing. Eye sensations. Ear sensations. Body sensations. Sweaty feet. Bright screen. Distracting. Feeling of snow outside. Seeing darkness on periphery of vision. Breathing. Typing. Forgetting the keyboard. All of hands sensations. Uncomfortable. Moving. Rolling chair moving. Sitting straight. Bored. Thinking to quit prematurely. Typing. Breathing. Blinking. Open lips. Swallowing. Moving leg. Tightness in chest. Tiredness in arms. Feeling vibrations beneath the feelings. Feeling smaller vibrations. Thinking. Pausing. Pausing. Moving fingers and feet. Thinking to be still. Sensations louder. Thisnking is pausing. Diffiuclty typing. Stoping. Wrists hurting. Sensations. Sensations . Moving wrists. Moving toes. Breathing. Thinking. Experiencing. Experiencing. Looking. Looking. Nothing. Looking at nothing. Timer went.
I get it! That was a very good exercise. Thank-you. Just sensations, experiences and looking. I was not there.
Thanks again Smudge. Best wishes.

[smudge]

Beautiful! Lots going on and 'you weren't there'.

So, is there an I that see's or an I that hears, feels, thinks, tastes, smells? Or is it all just happening?

How have the last 24 hrs been since doing the excise in which realisation of 'you' not being there happened?

Looking forward to hearing
Smudge

[phoenix]

Hi Smudge,
Thanks for the positive feedback!
In the last 24 hours of doing the exercise in realizing "I" am not here - I lost that. There were some moments when I thought of it and if I was quiet I could experience it....but mostly I got engulfed in "my story." That is I got an unexpected phone call yesterday for me to have an interview later this morning. So I had a whirlwind of preparation. And in being consumed by everything that I needed to do - I lost realizing I am not here.

I did have one moment though, when I looked out at the panoramic scene below and I realized that it was just happening - it was like another sensation. I had been Looking at the sensations and thoughts in my self and as I looked out it seemed as I wasn't there and there was just this scene in front of me that was just a form that was just happening. Because I wasn't really there. That surprised me! That is the first time with form I have experienced that. But then it was lost during the day.

Now when I am on the computer, it is easier for me to experience that it is all just happening. I cannot control the sensations or thoughts and I do not know where they are coming from. But yesterday when I was phoning my references, printing my resume etc, it really seemed that there was an I that was thinking, hearing, doing.

I have to really slow down and be consciously Looking in order not to lose that epiphany that I am not here.

Already I have to say thank-you for all of your help. When I think of the panoramic view that was just happening - I am surprised at how quickly your guidance and this process has helped me. Thank-you!

Wish me luck in my interview.
Phoenix

[smudge]

Good luck with your interview!

if I was quiet I could experience it

&

I lost realizing I am not here.

Where is this I that can 'choose' to be quiet and experience 'it'? or the 'I' that can realise not being there'?
Really look for this I? what is found?

Well done, you noticed story from reality:

but mostly I got engulfed in "my story.

Report back when you have investigated the above,
Don't give me stories about the I, give me I (if you can find one)! ;-)
Warmth,
Smudge x

[phoenix]

Good morning Smudge,

Where is this I that can 'choose' to be quiet and experience 'it'? or the 'I' that can realise not being there'?
Really look for this I? what is found?

I cannot find any "I"choosing. I can just find sensation of moving etc. It seems if the I that is doing the looking is an even subtler vibration, one that pervades all other sensations and thoughts. Everytime I try to look at the Looker - I am unsuccessful. No matter what vantage point I look at the Looker from....the Looker is not there. Quite honestly, it hurts my head and is a difficult process. Every time I try to see the Doer - the Doer is not there, only movement.
I cannot find anything. And yet I am not having a Direct Experience of not finding anything. No Aha moments yet.

I think I won't get a chance to email for about 36 hrs. I will try but I think I have a crazy day with crazy commitments.

Metta,
phoenix
ps I will have to trial the quote function a little more!

[smudge]

Hi Phoenix,

No matter what vantage point I look at the Looker from....the Looker is not there.

Thats clear! yes there is no looker just looking. Simple.

No Aha moments yet.

And..your experience is absent of Aha. So a story of there should be an aha is being exposed. It is common for seekers to expect big wow experiences with insight, this can get in the way of acknowledging the actual experience for what it is. So the fact is there is no looker and there is movement and there is story about the absence of aha's.

You are doing great its just different to expectations, what emotions does this bring up?

To use the quote you copy the section you want and the highlight it and then click quote, when you post, it has quoted.

Much warmth
Smudge

[phoenix]

Hi Smudge,

You are doing great its just different to expectations, what emotions does this bring up?

Realizing the No Aha moment is normal, I feel comforted, but also disappointed. It is not life changing and I wonder if it will be.
Before the moment when I gazed at the panorama below me and felt that the view was just sensations - that felt like an aha moment. Something that I am not able to easily replicate, but it feels like a true epiphany.

It seems like Direct experience of no Looker should have a different feeling. Like if you were to imagine being invisible as compared to being invisible.

Thank-you for letting me know I am on the right track. I will continue trying and maybe as this Looking for the Looker becomes more natural, some accomplishment will be felt???

Best Wishes,
phoenix

[phoenix]

I see one quote worked. The other quote was supposed to be


[quote][/quote]No matter what vantage point I look at the Looker from....the Looker is not there.
Thats clear! yes there is no looker just looking. Simple.

I still have to work on the quotes )

[phoenix]

[quote][/quote]No matter what vantage point I look at the Looker from....the Looker is not there.
Thats clear! yes there is no looker just looking. Simple.

I

[phoenix]

Sorry, still can't get the hang of quoting. Not sure how it worked in the first one. I will continue to try that - but there may be a number of gaffs. )

[smudge]

Hi Phoenix,

Before the moment when I gazed at the panorama below me and felt that the view was just sensations - that felt like an aha moment. Something that I am not able to easily replicate, but it feels like a true epiphany.

yes direct experience is unique, how amazing!

and

It seems like Direct experience of no Looker should have a different feeling. Like if you were to imagine being invisible as compared to being invisible.

There are shoulds and expectations, these are stories yes?

And..there is a feeling of disappointment.This is feeling yes?

Is there a self in the feelings or the stories or are they just part of the vast display that is just happening?

Look forward to hearing x

[phoenix]

Hi again Smudge,
Yes Direct Experience is amazing! But in trying to remember it - something is lost. It is just a memory.[quote][/quote]

There are shoulds and expectations, these are stories yes?
Yes should and expectations are just stories. They are stories built on memory and projecting into the future. Exactly the opposite of Direct Experience which is not based on any memories and not expecting anything.

And..there is a feeling of disappointment.This is feeling yes?

Yes Disappointment is just another feeling, another sensation located in a particular area of "the body."

Sorry, I have to run. Will write more later.
All the best,
Phoenix

[smudge]

Hi Phoenix,
sounds like it is getting clearer.

But in trying to remember it - something is lost

another story.
Yes stories about there and then are simply that, stories. If you read a novel here and now, you know its a story being told here and now don't you. This is the same, there are stories being told here and now about there and then. Stories and feelings are not bad they are just part of the whole display. But what it sounds like you have seen is that the story about is different to the actual direct experience of. The fig! and the writing exercise which has an story of I am added to the actual experience of. The I am story isn't bad, its just that it is a story and gets mistake for reality. Just like you may have believed in Santa and then you didn't anymore, nice story, not real.

You are ready to go further, so from DIRECT EXPERIENCE answer the following, really look deeply: Are YOU the thinker of thoughts? Can YOU choose to think a thought? and does the body experience sensations and thoughts?

warm wishes
Smudge