The Gate

Tell me Lisa, what is your answer to your question?

Honestly, I feel that the labels nowhere, anywhere and everywhere could be used interchangably in this case. Thoughts come from an unidentifiable place. There is no "I" controlling them.

This is our goal here. Are you saying you have seen thru the illusion?
Or just intellectually?

Yes. I have actually seen through the illusion, but I haven't had 'the pop', and I haven't seen with the kind of vivid clarity Laurent describes in LOOKING.

Are your thoughts possessive? Are they all about you?

Confused about this...seems like two (ambiguous) questions.

1. Thoughts do not belong to me. There is no me to possess thoughts. If you're asking do jealous thoughts run through my mind, I would say yes, sometimes.
2. There is no me/no self for thoughts to be about; this awareness is quite new and is by no means comfortable or the norm (yet). It's part of the tragicomedy I'm experiencing right now as a result of seeing through the illusion. Prior to finding LU, I was 'trying' to give death to my ego. Though "my" thoughts weren't "all about me", I felt a bit narcissistic because the processs was so painful. Now, I realize I was trying to kill something that didn't exist.

How does something get to be MINE?
What the process that makes something mine?

Ownership is an extension of the illusion of self. No-one owns...there is no-one to own. As humans, we invent many stories and lies in order to feel secure; they are all ultimately fallible.

This is our goal here. Are you saying you have seen thru the illusion?
Or just intellectually?
Yes. I have actually seen through the illusion, but I haven't had 'the pop', and I haven't seen with the kind of vivid clarity Laurent describes in LOOKING.

Hi Lisa - Good work. You're doing great!
I will do my best to point to this to you on a more visceral level.
You may or may not have a 'pop'.
Did the short explanation on LOOKING help any? Maybe clarify things?

Are your thoughts possessive? Are they all about you?
Confused about this...seems like two (ambiguous) questions.
1. Thoughts do not belong to me. There is no me to possess thoughts. If you're asking do jealous thoughts run through my mind, I would say yes, sometimes.
2. There is no me/no self for thoughts to be about; this awareness is quite new and is by no means comfortable or the norm (yet). It's part of the tragicomedy I'm experiencing right now as a result of seeing through the illusion. Prior to finding LU, I was 'trying' to give death to my ego. Though "my" thoughts weren't "all about me", I felt a bit narcissistic because the processs was so painful. Now, I realize I was trying to kill something that didn't exist.

Lisa, what I'm getting at here is that almost all of our thoughts are possessive
in the sense that they are about us, in some way shape or place.
Not all, to be sure, but most all. LOOK to see if that's true for you.
Remember we want 100% honesty here and we're not going for 'right' answers.
The only right ones are the ones that are true in your direct experience.

And ownership, possession is really not possible without a thought.
We have believed all along that this 'I' is a real thing. But we're going to find that its
only a thought we've been let to believe since we were about two years old. We can
look really hard but not find this 'I' in reality.

Do you see how literaly all thoughts are stories?
We see, a label is put on what we see, and then a story is developed.
Every thought is essentially past tense in its nature.
Describing something that has happenend in the past.
The only thing that is real is what is happening right now and here.
To see this we need a willingness to really LOOK.
We need a willingness to see prior to labels being put on what we see.

Now how about the body? Is that owned and controlled in reality, by a self?

Now lets look at it and see if there is an owner or entity controlling it.
Lift one of your hands. either one.
Move it to the right. Now move it left. Look with your eyes what is happening. Did a self move the hand?
Or did the hand just move?
Direct observation. Move it again. Check it.
Which is more true, the hand moved, or a self moved the hand?

One last thing....

What does this mean to you?

Well its a very simple thing that needs to be resolved...
There is this thought, I,... and once you see that I is just a thought
And you see that thought itself does not think
It clicks!
Its very very simple.

Remember we want 100% honesty here and we're not going for 'right' answers.
The only right ones are the ones that are true in your direct experience.

Thanks, Bill. I see now that "I" am trying to force the process, rather than trusting the unfolding.

Right now, I am directly experiencing lots of "I" centered thoughts: " I" should do..., "I" think..., "I" love...
The "I" is dissipating more rapidly, but yes I recognize that thoughts are possessive.

Did the short explanation on LOOKING help any? Maybe clarify things?

I've watched it close to a hundred times, and yes it's helping; I hear something new each time. Just watched it again and it's so there...but NOT! Frustrated...must take break.

Just returned from sitting outside...I just felt it! My absence!!! I don't know if I'm there yet, but this "being ok with my absence" is the part I hadn't felt. Haha, and it is truly OK! It's not only ok; it's so much better! As I was sitting, a passage from Elena in GG came up (paraphrasing) "Scrutinize "it". If it is real, there is no reason to cling to it, it will remain." (something to that affect)...

This is what was happening when it happened:

Breeze blowing cool sensation on the skin ("I" am nowhere to be found), breathing in hints of Rosemary and sage ("I" am nowhere to be found), toes feel a tickling sensation from the soft clover below ("I" am nowhere to be found); all sorts of green things waving back and forth ("I" am nowhere to be found). Above, birds singing ("I" am nowhere to be found), clouds rolling ("I" am nowhere to be found). In all this perfection, "I" am nowhere to be found.

One last thing....
What does this mean to you?

Well its a very simple thing that needs to be resolved...
There is this thought, I,... and once you see that I is just a thought
And you see that thought itself does not think
It clicks!
Its very very simple.

"I" doesn't exist outside thought. Once that (simple but profound thing) is seen, the rest of the illusion (successive thoughts that rely on the thought "I") no longer has a "foundation" on which to build (more lies), and the whole of it crumbles; then Liberation happens.

Hi Lisa..... did you miss this?

Now how about the body? Is that owned and controlled in reality, by a self?

Now lets look at it and see if there is an owner or entity controlling it.
Lift one of your hands. either one.
Move it to the right. Now move it left. Look with your eyes what is happening. Did a self move the hand?
Or did the hand just move?
Direct observation. Move it again. Check it.
Which is more true, the hand moved, or a self moved the hand?

Sorry...didn't cut and paste this exercise:

Now how about the body? Is that owned and controlled in reality, by a self?

Now lets look at it and see if there is an owner or entity controlling it.
Lift one of your hands. either one.
Move it to the right. Now move it left. Look with your eyes what is happening. Did a self move the hand?
Or did the hand just move?
Direct observation. Move it again. Check it.
Which is more true, the hand moved, or a self moved the hand?

The hand moved automatically; no self involved.

Good work Lisa!

Remember we want 100% honesty here and we're not going for 'right' answers.
The only right ones are the ones that are true in your direct experience.

Thanks, Bill. I see now that "I" am trying to force the process, rather than trusting the unfolding.
Right now, I am directly experiencing lots of "I" centered thoughts: " I" should do..., "I" think..., "I" love...
The "I" is dissipating more rapidly, but yes I recognize that thoughts are possessive.

Good noticing! This is exactly how we LOOK. We SEE what's really there. Prior to the BS being added.

Did the short explanation on LOOKING help any? Maybe clarify things?

I've watched it close to a hundred times, and yes it's helping; I hear something new each time. Just watched it again and it's so there...but NOT! Frustrated...must take break.

Haha.... 100 times?? OCD?
Just relax. You'll get it. don't worry.
Your desire is great and it will happen.

Just returned from sitting outside...I just felt it! My absence!!! I don't know if I'm there yet, but this "being ok with my absence" is the part I hadn't felt. Haha, and it is truly OK! It's not only ok; it's so much better! As I was sitting, a passage from Elena in GG came up (paraphrasing) "Scrutinize "it". If it is real, there is no reason to cling to it, it will remain." (something to that affect)...
This is what was happening when it happened:
Breeze blowing cool sensation on the skin ("I" am nowhere to be found), breathing in hints of Rosemary and sage ("I" am nowhere to be found), toes feel a tickling sensation from the soft clover below ("I" am nowhere to be found); all sorts of green things waving back and forth ("I" am nowhere to be found). Above, birds singing ("I" am nowhere to be found), clouds rolling ("I" am nowhere to be found). In all this perfection, "I" am nowhere to be found.

Feels like a lot of effort still here. Or maybe its all the repetive decription..
But yes, that is it!
Just let things be. Let them flow.
This is just so simple and easy. You will be surprised.

One last thing....
What does this mean to you?

Well its a very simple thing that needs to be resolved...
There is this thought, I,... and once you see that I is just a thought
And you see that thought itself does not think
It clicks!
Its very very simple.

"I" doesn't exist outside thought. Once that (simple but profound thing) is seen, the rest of the illusion (successive thoughts that rely on the thought "I") no longer has a "foundation" on which to build (more lies), and the whole of it crumbles; then Liberation happens.

Excellent summation there. You have a very good conceptual understanding.
The rest will come. Just trust the process.
Its almost like once you have a really good understanding, and can then just relax,
the SEEING often happens.

As you move around in your day, check and see if you can find a self moving the body around.
Walking, driving, typing, dressing yourself, etc.
Is there a self living your life?
Or are there just thoughts about everything, including a self, seeming to live your life?
Just look at the evidence. In your daily life, in all your actions, keep returning to this focus on the thoughts as you move around.
Keep checking if there is something real, besides a thought, that owns and directs the body.

Haha.... 100 times?? OCD?
Just relax. You'll get it. don't worry.
Your desire is great and it will happen.

Haha...you're spot on! Hilarious that tone can sometimes be lost through writing; yet "mine" seems to be ringing through loud and clear. Maybe there could be a "WORRY YOUR WAY TO LIBERATION" subforum for those of us who insist on making it torture. LOL

Good noticing! This is exactly how we LOOK. We SEE what's really there. Prior to the BS being added.

The rest will come. Just trust the process.
Its almost like once you have a really good understanding, and can then just relax,
the SEEING often happens.

Cool, thanks for the assurance that I'm on the right track. Just knowing that brings relaxation.

As you move around in your day, check and see if you can find a self moving the body around.
Walking, driving, typing, dressing yourself, etc.
Is there a self living your life?
Or are there just thoughts about everything, including a self, seeming to live your life?
Just look at the evidence. In your daily life, in all your actions, keep returning to this focus on the thoughts as you move around.
Keep checking if there is something real, besides a thought, that owns and directs the body.

Will do. On my way out of town. This weekend will be an excellent opportunity to gather evidence. My posts will probably be short (there's a possibility that tomorrow I may not have internet access), but I will continue to work and definitely report back on Sunday.

Much Gratitude,
Lisa

Look forward to your post on

As you move around in your day, check and see if you can find a self moving the body around.
Walking, driving, typing, dressing yourself, etc.
Is there a self living your life?
Or are there just thoughts about everything, including a self, seeming to live your life?
Just look at the evidence. In your daily life, in all your actions, keep returning to this focus on the thoughts as you move around.
Keep checking if there is something real, besides a thought, that owns and directs the body.

Something I wrote a while back you might appreciate.

See that what you are looking for, searching for is here, right now.
Its always been here. We just haven't noticed it.
LOOK. truly LOOK.
This moment, right now, is the one you've wanted your whole life.
There's nothing, absolutely nothing that needs to be changed
either on the inside or your outer circumstances.

The brain says NO. NO. It can't be this simple. Its got to be different than this, more flashy,
greater insight, more bliss.... and on and on and on.
So we overlook this precious moment in hopes of a better one
Of course off in the future. The one that never comes.
See this delusion. It has to be seen.

When you see it, you can relax and know that it is this moment that is the one.
Just ordinary everyday life as it is. We don't have to hope for something better.
The seeking can stop. We can put all the books away. No more teachers are needed either.
There's nothing to learn really. We can't really lose this either because whatever occurs on the
inside or outside, it is always still this.
We just have to LOOK again to realize.

Hello Lisa

Wondering what happened to you?
Are things OK?

Hey Bill,

Yes, thanks for checking. All is well. The 'weekend' trip got extended; just returned to world of internet. I will report my findings tomorrow.

~Lisa

As you move around in your day, check and see if you can find a self moving the body around.
Walking, driving, typing, dressing yourself, etc.
Is there a self living your life?
Or are there just thoughts about everything, including a self, seeming to live your life?
Just look at the evidence. In your daily life, in all your actions, keep returning to this focus on the thoughts as you move around.
Keep checking if there is something real, besides a thought, that owns and directs the body.

Nothing real...No owner of the body. Just body doing; thoughts arising. Beginning to SEE thoughts hold no power because thoughts do not exist in NOW reality; they are all in the past.

repetitive soundtrack of Descarte's "Cogito ergo sum" reeling through my brain. It starts as Latin, then translates into "i think; therefore "I" am..."I DON'T THINK; THEREFORE "I" AM NOT".
funny that (despite the author's intent), the words resonate.

See that what you are looking for, searching for is here, right now.
Its always been here. We just haven't noticed it.
LOOK. truly LOOK.
This moment, right now, is the one you've wanted your whole life.
See this delusion. It has to be seen.
The brain says NO. NO. It can't be this simple. Its got to be different than this, more flashy,
greater insight, more bliss.... and on and on and on...
When you see it, you can relax and know that it is this moment that is the one.

That it is this moment that is the one

I SEE!!! THANKS, BILL ;)

Every moment is "the moment" in the moment! Reality is full of nothing special, and it is so good! "I" doesn't exist. All (in life-ing) oozing as one smooth, seamless, boundless, effortless (ORDINARY) continuous flow...a liberation "blob".

Just ordinary everyday life as it is. We don't have to hope for something better.
The seeking can stop. We can put all the books away. No more teachers are needed either.
There's nothing to learn really. We can't really lose this either because whatever occurs on the
inside or outside, it is always still this.
We just have to LOOK again to realize.

yes.

Lisa

Nothing real...No owner of the body. Just body doing; thoughts arising. Beginning to SEE thoughts hold no power because thoughts do not exist in NOW reality; they are all in the past.

repetitive soundtrack of Descarte's "Cogito ergo sum" reeling through my brain. It starts as Latin, then translates into "i think; therefore "I" am..."I DON'T THINK; THEREFORE "I" AM NOT".
funny that (despite the author's intent), the words resonate.

Great looking here.
yes Descarte's statement is a bit erroneous. I love Tolle's take on it..
"The philosopher Descartes believed that he had found the most fundamental truth when he made his famous statement: "I think, therefore I am." He had, in fact, given expression to the most basic error: to equate thinking with Being and identity with thinking."

See that what you are looking for, searching for is here, right now.
Its always been here. We just haven't noticed it.
LOOK. truly LOOK.
This moment, right now, is the one you've wanted your whole life.
See this delusion. It has to be seen.
The brain says NO. NO. It can't be this simple. Its got to be different than this, more flashy,
greater insight, more bliss.... and on and on and on...
When you see it, you can relax and know that it is this moment that is the one.

That it is this moment that is the one

I SEE!!! THANKS, BILL ;)

Every moment is "the moment" in the moment! Reality is full of nothing special, and it is so good! "I" doesn't exist. All (in life-ing) oozing as one smooth, seamless, boundless, effortless (ORDINARY) continuous flow...a liberation "blob".

It looks like you are seeing this Lisa. I like what you're writing here.

Do 'you' exist? Is there a real 'you' anywhere to be found?
LOOK.

Hi Bill,

Sorry for not posting yesterday; the body responded to this process by temporarily shutting "off". An overwhelming, sinking feeling (followed by a twenty-four hour "death-nap") ensued. (A few brief interruptions involving an image of a very angry cat, coupled with skin-tingling ME-OWWWs) offered assurance that 1. cat exists 2. body is still, in fact, alive).

Awoke today with an intense sense of urgency to get up and go vote!!! (Distracting "I" thought arose, "As a political activist, this is probably not the best timing to get liberated.")


or

Maybe the timing is perfect...so many labels define the fictitious "I-lie".

Finding freedom in letting go of the constricting labels.

Many feelings are stirring. This space is not calm; yet it is also not frenetic.

Do 'you' exist? Is there a real 'you' anywhere to be found? LOOK.

The body feels ill and lethargic; the mind is reeling with "I" thoughts (mostly those of victim: why me? what am i supposed to do now?, this so-called liberation sucks! this isn't fair!), but the moment the thought "I" tries to "do something about it", "thought I" drifts away. nothing real but body doing; thoughts arising.

Just returned from voting. On the way there, sensations of anxiety and apprehension. Silly thoughts of, "How will this body and mind relate to the world now?" "Will they know "I" don't exist?" Do they know "they" don't exist?"...probably not; if so, there would be no voting. lol

In reality, the experience ran on automatic. LOOKING took over. It was a library; somewhat quiet, but still layers of buzzing, beeping, shuffling, low chatter etc; tons of images of books, tables, signs and various human forms standing, shifting, shuffling, walking; wafts of various smells; most of which were unpleasant to the olfactory sense ;)

Directly experiencing this environment was no different than directly experiencing any environment. Returning to LOOKING proves without fail: There is no "I" to be found...anywhere!

Bill, are feelings of disorientation normal? I've been avoiding talking to friends and family. It sounds silly, but since beginning this work, it feels as though I'm living a double life; conversations (not pertaining to this) seem futile.

Lisa

Yes Lisa, these feelings of being disoriented is fairly normal in this process.
There's certainly not a universal set of effects that all get but
feeling like you're 'falling' is a common one that a lot of us feel/have felt.
Maybe similar to the sinking feeling you were experiencing.
Just trust it to be OK.

Its not necessarily calm and bliss though they may be here.
All your years of conditioning are still here and all of it will
want to come up at some time to be looked at. We just hope
not all at once! So yes, strong feelings will arise. Allow them
to come and be looked at. There are no mistakes.

About the friends and family and talking with them...
do what you feel you with them and can handle right now.
You do know they're going to think you're out in left field with this no self
stuff, so you might get an argument or worse. So take it easy
and know that there's nothing that has to be proven to anyone else.
This can't be forced or even explained very well to someone who is
not in a position to want to hear it.

I'd like to go ahead and ask you the questions Lisa.
Its very clear you've SEEN from what you've communicated here.
After this, we have several FB groups that are places to discuss some
of this with many others who are right where you are.
And there's guiding also if that is something you want to do.

My first question is: do you think you have seen thru the illusion of self?
If affirmative, continue on to the following questions. If no, tell me about it...

Some of these may be redundant, I know...

1) Is there a 'me', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works.

3) How does it feel to see this? describe in detail.

4) How would you describe it to somebody who has never heard about this illusion but is curious about it.

5) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look? was there a specific moment when seeing happened or was it gradual? what exactly happened?

My first question is: do you think you have seen thru the illusion of self?
If affirmative, continue on to the following questions. If no, tell me about it...

Yes. I have seen thru the illusion of self; will get answering the questions and post them (tomorrow at the latest).

Feeling much gratitude for your nudging, guidance, humor, assurance...AND FOR HELPING ME SEE!

Today is a brighter day; just got off the phone with a friend. Throat is hoarse, so I listened to her drone on and on...snarky idea arose to tally the number of "I"s during twenty minute conversation: Total...127.

Liberation is fun :)

~~ Thanks for the FB info, and guiding (at some point) would be awesome!