Support needed

[ImMadeofDragons]

The conditioning was done by culture, family, friends, television, teachers. These things that shaped the sense of I. This conditioning could be labeled as thought in my mind. Analyzing, thinking out scenarios, having a voice that will not leave when you lay down to sleep. This is my conditioning and wether insane or not it thinks about it and doesn't like self destruction. This entity is separate from Consciousness and very constant in his brutal attack. Now this may make me crazy but I would argue that would make most ppl crazy.
If there is no free will and I believe there is not. Who is controlling me during thought? Awareness? Or a self that has identified with this body and enjoys control. If our awareness is god and we have created an anti god is it not feasible to think an unconscious being has a closer stream of thought to god.
I am looking for insight to rid myself of this. I know that I must be like the Buddha and be aware in every moment but they are very fleeting. Also this self is needed in society in rare circumstances. How can I be more aware more often and fight thought? So that it will take a submissive role. The one this body currently holds

[ImMadeofDragons]

Yes nick I am aware of that. I have felt seen and smelled awareness. It is different and it is right. My being and my self are 2 different people currently in an abusive relationship that is intrinsically false.

[Nick]

Rob, you seem to be suggesting some kind of split between "being" and "awareness" and an ordinary state. I think you may be maybe confusing states of heghtened attention (or mindfulness as some people like to say), and calling this "awareness" or true self...

In factawareness is present at all times and in all experiences. There is awareness of thinking and awareness of not thinking. So this doesn't change. Being as well, whatever that means, is always present.

From time to time, you may enter states of altered consciousness or very heightened attention, when everything seems more real, and this can be mistaken for some type of enlightenment. The problem is, as you have seen, that these states come and then they go. There's nothing wrong with them and they can be very enjoyable, but they are not permanent.

Also plz do not take "absence of thought" as a goal to attain. This is not possible except as a temporary meditative state. Thoughts are fine, they are occuring constantly. It is belief in the thoughts that leads misery.

I suggest you "step back" a bit from this story that you've built up about "awareness" and "entities separate from consciousness" and all that. Don't try to stop thinking, just relax and look at the thoughts happening, see if you can find where they are occuring. You asked "who is controlling me durign thought?" See if you can find out who or what is controlling the thoughts. See if it is possible to know what thought will come next, or if you can stop a thought before it happens. See if these attempts are themselves just more thoughts. Can you find a thinker?

Nick

[ImMadeofDragons]

I feel like I need to do acid again and delve into the pain and loss more because it's so hard to accept what I know.... Honestly so much of what I do is intense thought. What I would really Like Is tips and help to fight the processes of thought... I know this to be true... In the right way but thoughts are real and mine very negative. I don't feel trying further to make me see my thought is all my identity is. Fleeting in every moment and not at all something that is tangible. My thought is my idea of self. I find myself using the I in my thoughts very often now and it's very painful. I want to have this self but I want to know it's false which I do but also be above it and in control or at least closer to that control.

[ImMadeofDragons]

My normal state is thought. That's what I mostly do. Being and awareness are the same. It is realizing you are composed of your senses and there is nothing else but the now and your expierence of it. All else is a delusion not based in reality thought is intrinsically wrong. That's why it is prone to so many things that go wrong, inconsistencies.

[Cam-RT]

Good Evening...

I feel like I need to do acid again and delve into the pain and loss more because it's so hard to accept what I know...

You realize that just like any other medication "What go's up must come down." then what? Same shit different day.

What we're trying to do here, is break a dysfunctional thought pattern that's all...

Honestly so much of what I do is intense thought. What I would really Like Is tips and help to fight the processes of thought... I know this to be true... In the right way but thoughts are real and mine very negative.

It's the brains job is to think even when you're asleep. It's a muscle, that processes energy...

The mind, in addition to being an incredible processing and storage device, is also a labeling machine that labels experience as soon as perception happens.

Here's how it occurs...

Thought triggers feeling, feeling gets labeled---New trigger---Feeling gets more intense ---More labels--->Vicious feedback loop...

This is what go's on endlessly when " I " is at the centre...

***Here's an analogy that might help put things in a different perspective...

Think of the mind like the sky... and thoughts are the clouds, they have no mass, they come and they go...there are big "Ominous" dark clouds and bunches of little ones ( kinda like "chatter.")   You can't reach up and whisk them away...
They just are...so let them be...( like the old Beatles song..."Let it be")

So your mind is like the sky...everything else is just the Weather.

My thought is my idea of self.

These thoughts, no matter how much they mess with you, are still just pulses of energy; feeding on the attention you give them...pull the plug! Ask any that get in your way..."Is this Bullshit REALLY TRUE? IN REAL LIFE??" call "it" all out and then LET IT GO!! I'm sure your tired of it all...

I find myself using the I in my thoughts very often now and it's very painful.

If " I " is just a thought,.. then "who is " I " ?

What is " I " ??

[ImMadeofDragons]

I is nothing and I understand it. It's hard though and i am very tired and I have seeen the loop. Besides understanding this and knowing it WHST else can
I do to push it into the mud and burnnnn it off of me

[Cam-RT]

Hey Rob...

I is nothing and I understand it.

Alright so I is nothing just a construct reenforced by thought, also illusion. Belief can be a very powerful thing, ONLY if you allow it.

Forget the thoughts, there's nothing there to support them except the "belief" they actually exist.
Demons/thoughts are empty projections of "The Self"...Their objective is to "Occupy" us not to defeat us...

Everything we know, no matter how sure we are, is really just Belief, and ALL beliefs are self limiting, and serve to reduce the truly infinite to falsely finite...

Try focusing on what's behind these thought's, the "nothingness" that supports these thoughts...
Without these thoughts who are YOU really??

[dreamer]

Hi Rob

What happens if you try this:
There is thoughts
instead of
I have thoughts

This is a bypass of the mind.
Vivi

[ImMadeofDragons]

there is no self... But there is. Im battling it constantly. I can deny it and accept my denial but what is that doing to my thoughts exactly? Is there any more intensive way that you can come at me because I just keep hearing that this I is not real and I just need to realize that. But you still have thoughts... I will still have thoughts. Are you trying to get me to a 3rd person POV? thats what I would like but this really doesnt seem to be helping me. I BELIEVE to know that there is no self. but i feel there definatly is. I also feel it is in and of itself wrong and a creation of my own mind. Really need some help here. the analogys are just idiotic honestly. and to the dreamer you are really not helping me with anything just frustrating me talking to me like a child without even grammar

[Eloratea]

Rob,
Let's come to direct experience here, right now. That's the place where reality should be, right?
Can you point to your self? Where are you exactly right now? Not your body, your self?
Are you in your body or body is in you?
Look at your hand. Are you in it, or it is in you?
Sounds you are hearing right now. Are they inside or outside of you?
And thoughts you are having - are you in them? Or they are as everything else in this space, awareness; here, right now?

[dreamer]

Hi Rob
Sorry that my english isn't correct. It is not my mother tongue. There seem to be a limit of how complex sentenses I can do. You are frustrated of that you say. Look at that frustration, where does it come from? Where is it? Who is frustrated, can you find the frustrated entity?

[ImMadeofDragons]

hat's the place where reality should be, right? yes
Can you point to your self? no Where are you exactly right now? planet earth Not your body, your self? nowhere
Are you in your body or body is in you? I am my body
Look at your hand. Are you in it, or it is in you? neither
Sounds you are hearing right now. Are they inside or outside of you? outside
And thoughts you are having - are you in them? no Or they are as everything else in this space, awareness; here, right now? there not here when awareness is.


No dreamer I cannot. It is my ego.

[dreamer]

No dreamer I cannot. It is my ego.

And where is your ego? Is it in your body? Is it a part of you? Which part? What is it?

[ImMadeofDragons]

dreamer you can stop replying to me. your asking me redundant questions and its insulting. IF I DIDNT KNOW THE ANSWERS TO THESE QUESTIONS WHY THE FUCK WOULD I BE HERE. i mean honestly this is going nowhere and im getting no help. Maybe some more advanced ppl can help me along with this.

The ego is not a part of awareness. Therefore is intrinsically wrong and sumthing culture, society, AND CONDITIONING have created. Wether it does or does not intrinsically exist is fucking null. IF IT DID NOT EXIST I WOULDN'T BE HERE. IF IT WAS NOT REAL THAN SOCIETY AS WE KNOW IT WOULD ALSO NOT BE "REAL"

It exists. If it didnt. THIS WEBSITE, THESE PEOPLE, AND YOU DREAMER WOULD NOT BE HERE.

stop replying or talk to me like an adult. I'm done with the redundant pointless questions I wanted help moving forward AFTER REALIZING THIS.

This is doing nothing please give me some better help. and im not angry I would just love some actual insight NOT REDUNDANT DELUSIONAL BULLSHIT. YOUR OPINION OFREALITY IS SADLY FALLIBLE ONCE AGAIN IF IT WASNT WE WOULD NOTTTTT BE HERE