Seeking more than an intellectual understanding

[solstice]

There's no doer, this includes doing thinking.
As we have seen there's no control over thoughts.

You had no say in being born or which school you first went to. When did you make your first decision?

This makes sense. Would it be fair to say a decision was made at some point to believe in a self/doer? Or is even that just something that occurs?

[jrm72]

Morning Solstice,

Or is even that just something that occurs?

Tell me something that doesn't just occur (even the response to this question)?


❤️🖖

[solstice]

Tell me something that doesn't just occur (even the response to this question)?

I cannot, there is nothing

[jrm72]

Hey Solstice,

I cannot, there is nothing

Enjoy the ride.


❤️🖖

[solstice]

Enjoy the ride.

🫡😂

[jrm72]

Afternoon Solstice,

Is it still just an intellectual understanding?


❤️🖖

[solstice]

Is it still just an intellectual understanding?

It seems to be more now. Although it also may have always been more and it was just being overlooked? In a way nothing has changed.

I still have thoughts but they are less (at least for now) and more easily seen as thoughts, and so the same amount of suffering is not attached to them (however certain thoughts still get the better of me).

The illusion I still hold the tightest is that of the body, although it can be seen to be made of sensation that is not the default.

[jrm72]

Evening Solstice,

It seems like you're there.
Obviously there is no there and there is no you, as you said ‐

In a way nothing has changed.

There's a set of questions, that I can send you.
Your answers are circulated amongst the guides and if they agree you've seen through the illusion of self, then there's additional parts of LU you can access for any help and guidance you may want.

Welcome to the beginning.

Would you like the questions?


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[solstice]

Would you like the questions?

yes please :)

[jrm72]

Morning Solstice,

Ok here are the questions.
Respond from experience (we're not being intellectual here)

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?
Was there ever?

2) Describe how the illusion of an independent, self came into being by giving examples from actual experience.
Then give some experiential examples of how life changed for you after seeing through this illusion.

3) How does it feel to see this?
What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

4) Can you remember any specific inquiry that resulted in an epiphany? ..a before and after seeing the actuality of the Self. Was there a point when you ‘got it’?

5) a) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work?
Give examples from your own recent experiences to how these things happen and how they work.

b) What are you responsible for? Give examples from your own recent experiences to how this works.

6) Anything to add?


❤️🖖

[solstice]

Sorry have had a bit of trouble connecting to the site recently so hopefully this posts properly

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?
Was there ever?

No there is not, there is only direct experience and thoughts. There was never an I only the illusion of one.

2) Describe how the illusion of an independent, self came into being by giving examples from actual experience.
Then give some experiential examples of how life changed for you after seeing through this illusion.

Thoughts create the illusion of an I as they bring up past experiences and attempt to plan for future ones. They do this by speaking in first person using phrases along the lines of “I messed up saying that, next time I see that person I will say this instead.” This creates the illusion of an “I” that is the one that that did things in the past and will do things in the future.

Experientially thoughts have less of a grip on attention as they are seen to be just thoughts. This allows for more time directly experiencing life. However thoughts do still arise and sometimes do still hog attention, although it feels as though this hogging of attention is diminishing. So in a way it is like nothing has changed. The biggest change seems to be attention rests in the senses & experience more often now, whereas before it was predominantly in the thoughts.

3) How does it feel to see this?
What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

There is some relief, some indifference, at points in the process there was fear, sadness, anger, etc.
The past few days it is almost comical when thoughts that would once have given rise to mental anguish are seen as thoughts and let go of so quickly.

4) Can you remember any specific inquiry that resulted in an epiphany? ..a before and after seeing the actuality of the Self. Was there a point when you ‘got it’?

Not really I have not had a big singular aha moment. (Which I guess has given rise to doubtful thoughts causing the process to take longer) It moreso has felt like a slow realisation that what is being pointed to is exactly what had been overlooked the whole time so the searching could take place if that makes sense? Nothing new arose, and nothing left.

5) a) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work?
Give examples from your own recent experiences to how these things happen and how they work.

Decision - the idea that a choice is made by some self which is then carried out
intention - the idea that some self carries out an action with a certain end state in mind
free will - the idea that some self is capable of making choices and influencing the future
choice - a conscious selection by some self from a number of options
control - the idea that some self is making decisions, with intention, etc

all of these can be seen to be illusions in experience as things just unfold, there is no self that has any intentions, or makes any choices, or decisions, or has control, or free will.

I am not really sure how it all works I could give my best guess based on my understanding of psychology, biology, etc but it would be no more than thoughts & guesses.

b) What are you responsible for? Give examples from your own recent experiences to how this works.

nothing life unfolds on its own

6) Anything to add?

I look forward to hearing back from you, and for next steps, thank you for all your help so far on the path
❤️🖖

[jrm72]

Morning Solstice,

The site has been down for a while, but seems to be back up and working now.

Your q&a's have been circulated, hopefully only a short wait for replies.

Will give you links and where to look next as soon as I'm given the go ahead.

❤️🖖

[jrm72]

Afternoon Solstice,

Another guide has a question for you -

Is there any doubt left, if there is a separate self? Weather yes or no, please write more about it.

❤️🖖

[solstice]

Is there any doubt left, if there is a separate self? Weather yes or no, please write more about it.

There is the occasional doubt thought “I still have more to figure out” “I haven’t seen what these others have” “I still have thoughts so I can’t have seen through self”
These are all just thoughts, illusory in nature, that when looked at are seen to be nothing more. They do get less by the day, almost like they are the fading echo of a dying belief.

[jrm72]

Hello Solstice,

Thank you for the beautiful reply.


One more question, then I think we're done -

In Q3 Solstice say "There is some relief, some indifference" I'd be really interested to hear a little more about the relief and also the indifference if you could ask please?

❤️🖖