My imagined thread

[Canfora]

Okay. Happy for you! You can take your time answering these questions, there is no need to answer them all in the same day. I'll be following your replies:


1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there
ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from
your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue?
Please report from the past few days.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How
does it work? What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.

6) Anything to add?

[Florisness]

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there
ever?

Not at all.

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from
your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

It seems that there is a build-in self survival mechanism, it attaches to the only things that are more or less always appearing, the mind and body. But the feelings in the head are just as much a me as the sound of a bird is. The I is just a thought/label attached to everything the body does, but all is automatic. The I thought seems to convey continuity, but there is none, all changes (except the I am sense). It's ridiculously obvious, things just are here.

3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue?
Please report from the past few days.

With the belief of an I present, it feels a bit like always being hunted, always busy protecting and strategizing, etc. There is more a laid-back sense now. Life seems more receptive or accessible, friendly and open. Also the need to cling to thoughts and feelings loosened.

It's a bit odd to see others being so busy with the whole I business. I do notice an urge to tell others this, but maybe that won't be appreciated. In your experience, are people in general a bit open to this or is it a huge resistance?

will answer the other two later, going for a nap now.

[Canfora]

Nice answers, thank you.

In your experience, are people in general a bit open to this or is it a huge resistance?

I've spoken with only a few "outside the internet" people about this (maybe 4 or 6 persons).
The reactions ranged from anger ["what the hell are you talking about"] to ["yes, that's obvious"] (but I'm not sure if they understood what I was talking about) to ["I'm not interested, I don't want to know"].

One of the reasons I guide, is to talk about these subjects with people that want to talk about this. In my everyday life I don't feel the need to talk about this stuff.

Looking forward to read the remaining answers!

[Florisness]

Oh I see, yes thank you.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

There was hardly a last push needed, all that needed to be seen and known where already there. It was more a 'okay now just don't be a sissy, shut the fuck up, get real and see it'. But actually yesterday I sort of already saw it. I noticed that there was a fear of believing in an I in the brain, and I thought about it and realized that even if there was a part which you'd like to call I that sends stuff from the brain, it would still just appear here without control in .. nothing.. and than I got some kind of sense that this was all happening in nothing, or a place of nothing.

5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How
does it work? What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.

The illusion of free will is just caused by thoughts. Just blahblahblah talk with an I thrown into that. Decisions happen on there own. It seems like sometimes you feel an impulse to do something and between that impulse and the body taking that action can be a couple of seconds time. In that in-between time mind likes to sneak in thoughts like an I makes the decision.

6) Anything to add?

No

Is this illusion based on an I what they mean when they say the dream? I'm wondering if they mean that all that is experienced for an I is the dream. Like I can hear someone insulting "me", now the interpretation of insulting is probably just interpreted that way from an I-land viewpoint, some kind of for-me perspective. But than what would be the experience of not living in the dream? Just hearing sounds? Or awareness manifesting as sound?

Btw, do you have a speed-track tip for clearing up fast after this seeing?

[Florisness]

for if you miss it, above this reply is another reply of mine.
When I woke up, there sneaked up fears and doubts. After a while an idea for a visualization came up, did that and it was like a re-realization, actually deeper and fuller than the original one.

I find the ego odd, not sure what to think of it. I know there is no I, and that ego is not attached to anything, but.. I don't know, it's odd. It's like ego can't just be discarded or seen as oh it doesn't matter at all what desires/fears there are, because however there may not be an I, there is still this body that's doing all kinds of stuff and emotion pop up and all that.
It's very weird haha! There is no me, but does that mean ego doesn't matter? I have no idea

[Canfora]

Hello. I've asked the other guides to read our conversation and we have no more questions for you regarding the seeing of the illusion of being a separate self. I suggest that you join the LU groups and ask for a guide that will help you with further investigation. You can start by questioning the believe that an ego exists :)

It was a great pleasure being your guide and I'm going to say hi to you in the aftercare group. Feel free to send me a PM every time you want to talk about something or ask a question.

Hug!

[Florisness]

I'm up for joining the groups, i've read that there are several groups which I found interesting:

LU Aftercare (members only)
all freshly gated are added here.

Unleashed (members only)
is a LU general socializing group for everyone that has been though the gate.

Dealing with the Residue (members only)
The Work for Liberated using Byron Katies The Work as a tool for seeing through residual patterns and beliefs. Deep inquiry, an extension of the Gate.

I don't know if hanging around in three groups is wise to do. Anyway, I've been looking and looking (jeez, looking never stops) but can't find how to join any of it. Found a FB liberation unleashed program but I don't think that's it.

Again, thank you very much for all help!

[Florisness]

I mean I really looked, but I can't seem to realize that this group doesn't exist, it's just staying intellectual you know..
sorry for the poor joke, but I enjoyed it myself anyway

[Canfora]

Ups. Sorry! One of the LU administrators will send you more information and invite you to join the groups.
I think that is done by PM - private message. You're going to receive a notification.
You will also have access to other foruns here in this site.