I can't quite get "there"

[jeffdilbeck]

Hahaha!!! Cool. So is anything actually separate from anything else? :D

[cummins55]

Well so far all I can see is everyone is empty. We're all being functioned by the One Life. It's the belief we're seperated from everything that causes suffering. My mind still tries to tug me back into thinking it is it's idea. And is trying to make it up as we go along. BUT I just keep picturing a shell with a brain in it. Now, I still look thru my eyes. I keep remembering what you said about looking coming from no where. I'm in this body and I feel like I'm not supposed to be, which gives me a feeling of separation. I think

[jeffdilbeck]

Linda,

You said "I'm in this body and I feel like I'm not supposed to be, which gives me a feeling of separation. I think.."

Is there a you inside your body?

Can we switch bodies as subjects and know who we were?
Are we the deciders of decisions?
Are we able to control thinking, separate from thinking?
Is the sense I, an I?

There are all sorts of senses, a sense of reading, of typing, of thinking, but are you the reader, the typer, or the thinker?

What is a sense anyway? What is an I anyway?

Keep staring at the gate.

Is there an I, in a you? How many are you? How many are you and I? When I say you and I, what am I even referring to?

Please answer all the questions, and use the quote feature if needed.

Like this:

Ok!

:D

[cummins55]

Linda,

You said "I'm in this body and I feel like I'm not supposed to be, which gives me a feeling of separation. I think.."
Is there a you inside your body?
The sense of me.

Can we switch bodies as subjects and know who we were?
I imagine if I switched bodies with someone I would bring my experiences with me and still be a linda. Unless I died and was born again then I would start new experiences and be who ever that was.

Are we the deciders of decisions?
I would think if the great I Am is making decisions for me they wouldn't be so stupid. So I think I'm making my stupid decisions. (having a bad day):P

Are we able to control thinking, separate from thinking?
No that's inspired thought.

Is the sense I, an I?
No, it's a label

There are all sorts of senses, a sense of reading, of typing, of thinking, but are you the reader, the typer, or the thinker?
All I can feel is me. Stuck

What is a sense anyway? What is an I anyway?
A sense is a happening. I is a sense of me, linda, experiencing stuff in a shell.

Keep staring at the gate.

Is there an I, in a you? How many are you? How many are you and I? When I say you and I, what am I even referring to?
To be honest sometimes I got 2 voices in my head. You're referring to labels just to keep the conversation going.


poop

[jeffdilbeck]

Hey Linda,

Vince is going to take over from here.

Sometimes a fresh perspective is all that is needed.

Thanks for letting me walk with you this far.

Jeff

[vinceschubert]

Good morning Linda, vince(?) here.
i have read the last two pages of your thread, and frankly i'm confused about where you are.
Would you summarize the changes in experience that have occurred since starting this process.
...and give me a 5 line description of what you think experiencing might be like, post gate.

[cummins55]

OOOOOO! I'm sorry! I am having such a bad day!! I'm sorry to Mr. Dilbeck. I'm confused too.
So much has changed since I have started this process! I feel disconnected from everything and everyone. I'm kind of light headed. I feel like I'm in between here and there. Where ever that is. I just still feel seperated. I'm also feeling sad.
After?
Really I don't know anymore. All my amaginings are torn assunder.
Simply I would be set free from separation.
I would be ok with everything and everyone.
I would no longer have judgments.
I would be compassionate.
There would be peace.

[vinceschubert]

OOOOOO! I'm sorry! I am having such a bad day!! I'm sorry to Mr. Dilbeck.

Hi Linda. The sorry stuff is in the old world for us, so no need for that. The story you had that elicited the sorry was probably something like "oh, I've caused problems" or a version of it.
Can you see that it was a response to a thought story ?

I'm confused too.

Confusion is ok. Out of confusion comes clarity.

I feel disconnected from everything and everyone.

That's interesting. Post gate you will probably feel like everyone and everything is part of you and you part if them/it.
The disconnect is likely a fear reaction to an imagined annihilation of the self. Is there any experiencing of fear or anxiety ?

I feel like I'm in between here and there.

You are.

I'm also feeling sad.

Is there any grief associated with this ?

All my amaginings are torn assunder.

Excellent. It may not be comfortable, but it puts you in a condition to LOOK with fresh perspectives.

I would be set free from separation.

You are not separate now. It only seems that way, for the moment.

I would be ok with everything and everyone.

Will you still be OK when shit happens ?

I would no longer have judgments.

There will be judgements (at least for a while) but they will be seen. It is the SEEing them occur that engenders a de-conditioning process. Judgements and opinions are habits that will diminish with practice.
Do you imagine that it will be a complete and instant happening ?

I would be compassionate.

Yes, very likely.

There would be peace.

...and everything else as well.

Linda, if you drag your mouse over the questions and highlight them (after you have clicked on "reply") then click on the quote button. Then put your response after the quote.
While on this, i am much more interested in your response to the question (as you consider it) than in an actual answer. (but give me that too)

love

vince

[cummins55]

Hi Vince,
I tried the quote thing 3 times and this is the best I can do until I can figure it out. So anyway this is my response.
Can you see that it was a response to a thought story ?
As I read your response I'm having contractions in my solar plexus. Everything you've said is dead on the money. I have been so lost in my thought story.

[/quote]Confusion is ok. Out of confusion comes clarity.
I have felt as tho something is fighting to hang on.

I feel disconnected from everything and everyone.

That's interesting. Post gate you will probably feel like everyone and everything is part of you and you part if them/it.
I am relieved to hear that I will feel a part of everyone and everything. I'm dissoriented.

The disconnect is likely a fear reaction to an imagined annihilation of the self. Is there any experiencing of fear or anxiety ?
I've always been pretty calm but here lately I've been in some fear and anxiety.

I feel like I'm in between here and there.

You are.
haha right!

I'm also feeling sad.

Is there any grief associated with this ?
I have had enough experience with letting go of old character defects to recognize sadness as grieving the loss. Yes there is grief. I feel like the dead walking among the living.

All my amaginings are torn assunder.

Excellent. It may not be comfortable, but it puts you in a condition to LOOK with fresh perspectives.
This is true. I feel like wiping the slate of everything I think I know. Starting from scratch since I did'nt know anything to begin with.

I would be ok with everything and everyone.

Will you still be OK when shit happens ?
haha well ok. But like the Buddhist said I would only suffer once.

I would no longer have judgments.

There will be judgements (at least for a while) but they will be seen. It is the SEEing them occur that engenders a de-conditioning process. Judgements and opinions are habits that will diminish with practice.
That I really understand.
Do you imagine that it will be a complete and instant happening ?
I'm hoping so. I'm really hoping so. But the reality of it is probably not. I'm just so sad.

Linda, if you drag your mouse over the questions and highlight them (after you have clicked on "reply") then click on the quote button. Then put your response after the quote.
After 3 tries, I did'nt do very good with that. I did my best.

While on this, i am much more interested in your response to the question (as you consider it) than in an actual answer. (but give me that too)
My whole body is responding to all this like it's terrified. I'm relieved. Thank you so much for taking this on.

gratefully
linda

[vinceschubert]

I have felt as tho something is fighting to hang on.

There is then. Ask it "what are you hanging on to/for ?", then notice the first thought that arises.

but here lately I've been in some fear and anxiety.

The fear is your friend. Ask the fear "What are you trying to protect me from ?"

Yes there is grief.

Good to recognize this. Before the gate, grieving was an expression of loss for me. Post gate when my friend and sister-in-law died, there was grief that had no loss associated. It was very interesting, grief without sadness.
Allow a grieving process to happen. Say goodby to whatever is dieing. You don't even have to identify what it is. Just a blanket acknowledgement that dieing seems to be happening is enough.

I feel like the dead walking among the living.

Hm, when navigating normal daily living, i feel like the only awake person in a dream.

Starting from scratch

This is happening Every moment, anyway. It is only the mind that brings a (apparent) continuity to your experiencing.

I'm hoping so. I'm really hoping so. But the reality of it is probably not.

It happens like that for 1% of the people i've seen Waking up, and even for them it fades back to THIS.

I'm just so sad.

This is also IT.
Thank the sadness and tell it that the story that summoned it might be wrong, and that you will get it back if required after checking.

I did'nt do very good with that.(quoting stuff)

You managed to quote yourself ok.
After you've clicked "reply" go to my post and highlight the question and click 'quote'

Thank you so much for taking this on.

I didn't. There is just experiencing with talking to Linda. An element of that experiencing is gratitude to you and Jeff and everything involved in the birth of that happening. (and as i say that, there is realization that there is nothing & nobody that isn't involved) Thank you !!
(with tears in these eyes, love flows)
Thank you Linda !, thank you Jeff !, thank you world !, thank you 'me', thank you! thank you!

love

vince

[cummins55]

I'll keep trying on the quote thing cause when I highlight and hit quote the whole conversation goes into the post box.
Next time. Here's what I responded to:
Ask it "what are you hanging on to/for ?", then notice the first thought that arises.
It's hanging on to live.

The fear is your friend. Ask the fear "What are you trying to protect me from ?"
Loosing what I'm comfortable with. Being in harms way in the unknown.

Allow a grieving process to happen. Say goodby to whatever is dieing. You don't even have to identify what it is. Just a blanket acknowledgement that dieing seems to be happening is enough.
As I read this a big feeling of grief came up. Now it's gone.

Hm, when navigating normal daily living, i feel like the only awake person in a dream.
I went to school and rethought this comment and I'll have to say, it is as you say. I was the only one awake, and it was ok.

This is happening Every moment, anyway. It is only the mind that brings a (apparent) continuity to your experiencing.
Understood.

It happens like that for 1% of the people i've seen Waking up, and even for them it fades back to THIS.
I just would think waking up would be a big feeling. I mean that non-duality experience. Where I'm no longer me and them. That feeling/knowing wouldn't last?

Thank the sadness and tell it that the story that summoned it might be wrong, and that you will get it back if required after checking.
The sadness is gone.
Thank you to you Vince.
hugs, hugs to Mr. Dilbeck too.

[vinceschubert]

I'll keep trying on the quote thing cause when I highlight and hit quote the whole conversation goes into the post box.

Open the post box first, before you highlight and click quote.

It's hanging on to live.

This also (like the sadness) is predicated on a false foundation. It takes the story as being true, without checking.
How can something that 'never was', die ? The story that there is actually a self, turns out to be a furfy.
But yet, the struggle for survival is very real.
Tell it to take a holiday and that you'll yell if any real danger approaches.

Loosing what I'm comfortable with. Being in harms way in the unknown.

Is that the same as being afraid of developing a sense of adventure ?

As I read this a big feeling of grief came up. Now it's gone.

Many of these thing evaporate when you examine them.

I was the only one awake, and it was ok.

Was there any loneliness associated with it ?

I just would think waking up would be a big feeling.

Does a feeling have any more credibility than thoughts. Is there any connection at all to what is true ?
If you see a snake and experience a survival rush, then it turns out that what you thought was a snake was in fact, a piece of garden hose or rope. What reality was that feeling expressing ?
Experiences always end. Feelings change.

I mean that non-duality experience.

i was seeking in the non-duality area before waking up. To this day, i have no idea of their experiencing. I have a story. i have had some experiencing of what i might call Oneness. It happened this morning when you thanked me for taking this on.
It's a lovely experience, but means as much as a good piece of chocolate, but there is no idea of when the next piece might come along.

[cummins55]

It worked!! OK now I'm in business,

This also (like the sadness) is predicated on a false foundation. It takes the story as being true, without checking.
How can something that 'never was', die ? The story that there is actually a self, turns out to be a furfy.
But yet, the struggle for survival is very real.
Tell it to take a holiday and that you'll yell if any real danger approaches.

Thank you I will keep that in mind.

Is that the same as being afraid of developing a sense of adventure ?

Actually I'm one to not hang too long in a comfort zone. I believe growth happens when things get changed, like home, job state. I definately have a sense of adventure. I'm in my 50's and I'm back in school to begin another profession. I believed this would improve my spiritual, emotional life. And so far I have dug deeper to improve. Hense entering the Gate.

Was there any loneliness associated with it ?

No lonliness at all. I rarely feel lonely or alone. I like to watch what happens around me, since I've started this, it's been very pleasant. I've noticed how I don't take too much personally these days and not so much fear. Everyone is getting nicer and nicer.

Does a feeling have any more credibility than thoughts. Is there any connection at all to what is true ?
If you see a snake and experience a survival rush, then it turns out that what you thought was a snake was in fact, a piece of garden hose or rope. What reality was that feeling expressing ?
Experiences always end. Feelings change.

I believe feelings are a result of thoughts. If someone is at peace and see a rope and imagine it to be a snake would not be so alarmed. The reality expressing is one of fear and fear is imagined.

i was seeking in the non-duality area before waking up. To this day, i have no idea of their experiencing. I have a story. i have had some experiencing of what i might call Oneness. It happened this morning when you thanked me for taking this on.
It's a lovely experience, but means as much as a good piece of chocolate, but there is no idea of when the next piece might come along.

You know since I've gone thru the questioning here I am no longer searching. A couple of experiences I've had here was when I noticed there was noone in this body of linda. I saw some thing Mr. Dilbeck mentioned, like we are all living "the" one life.
So I kind of got a glimpse of non seperation, like we're all finger puppets. I just don't get it. What's the point!?
I was so blessed as to have been able to have breakfast with Darryl Bailey and I asked him that and he said there is no point. We're all just an expression of nature, a happening. I wanted to dig deeper into this. So I found the Gate. But is it athiesm to a degree? I know there's love here and love is only the great "I Am" or Life. So I'm looking to meld with this love. To start with me and overflow. How do I experience the love that permeats everything, I know it's here for me. It holds me in the palm of it's hand, it's my perception of being outside that has so kept me with blinders on. How Vince?

hugs

[vinceschubert]

How do I experience the love that permeates everything,

linda, is there a choice about what you experience ?

I know it's here for me

This is either your experience or it is a story. Which one is it for you ?

it's my perception of being outside that has so kept me with blinders on.

Can your perception change reality ?
You say;

I believe feelings are a result of thoughts.

and yet you want to summon particular experiencing ?
linda, when i say "This is IT", what is the reaction there ?

[cummins55]

linda, is there a choice about what you experience ?

No, that's true, according to this modality, there is no choice. So my perception of, I should be, want to be, enlightened is just a happening. Right now in this frame of mind and place is just .... here, hoping. But I don't have to be hoping. As I write this I can change my perception to "here I am." Nothing more. Now is this "it"? My reaction? Kind of an anxious feeling. Like I'm dreaming.

This is either your experience or it is a story. Which one is it for you ?

I like this one! My story of "longing and hoping and searching far off distance to find God to love me" haha Yes, it is my story.

Can your perception change reality ?

I think it can. I mean that's what it sounds like I'm saying. I'm still saying I have a choice, because if I changed my perception, all this is as you say, even if I'm not really experiencing it. Even if I think I have a choice to change all this simple my changing my perception. The reality is not my perception or my choices.
The reality is, this is it.

and yet you want to summon particular experiencing ?
linda, when i say "This is IT", what is the reaction there

Disappointing. I'm searching for the excellence in it. It's very simple which takes the stress away of thinking I have to change it. So I just live and move and experience this. There's nothing in linda and nothing in this. So where's the "AHA?"