Looking for some guidance
Re: Looking for some guidance
Hi Mark
Quick update
a) b) and c)
Brought up a list of what seems like the recurring thoughts. I had a little hard time letting go of my eternal optimism ( which sounds kinda ridiculous from reading my posts but somewhere in there I always believe everything is going to be ok) so I adjusted the statements using the word 'maybe'. This seemed to allow me to get into the emotion of it. Like: maybe everything I have done has been wrong, maybe all really is lost, maybe there is no way out, maybe this is all just a waste of time, maybe I really will lose my house, etc, etc.
They seem to me to be some sort of spiral energy attaching to or pushing away a thought, idea, belief.
Sometimes both to the same thought which is an energy as well.
They seemed to be attaching to the sense of 'Robert'. Which seems to be another expression of energy. And nothing behind the energy.
Just thoughts ideas energy.
Thought I had this while doing exercise 3) but.
yes I understand but is there not a clarity of seeing that removes all doubt? A shift of perception beyond question where one realizes they are not the 'self' but the 'Incomprehensible Beingness'. For lack of a better word.
Looking at this I first noticed the body. Then there seems to be a sense of a Robert. That seems to be the different ideas about Robert many of which are associated with the body. There was this awareness that was seeing this while seeing the birds, water, sand, sky, clouds, etc. Looking at this there was a sense of separateness but there was also the sense that there was no distinct line between the sense of Robert, the seeing and that which was seen. I really had to look for the line to see it wasn't there. I saw that it does whatever it does because it is whatever it is.
Doing this seemed to make looking at attachment/aversions easier. If there was no distinct line for all this then would it not be the same for all thoughts, emotions, attachments, energy. That everything was 'contained' which is really not the right word by this seeing and if this seeing was not contained in the body then where were it limits. This was all not very clear but somehow there.
There is something I can't quite put my finger on. Something to do with attachments, nothing behind the energy, the no separating line, and the no self. Like I sense it but don't see it.
That's what I have right now.
Thanks
Robert
Quick update
a) b) and c)
Brought up a list of what seems like the recurring thoughts. I had a little hard time letting go of my eternal optimism ( which sounds kinda ridiculous from reading my posts but somewhere in there I always believe everything is going to be ok) so I adjusted the statements using the word 'maybe'. This seemed to allow me to get into the emotion of it. Like: maybe everything I have done has been wrong, maybe all really is lost, maybe there is no way out, maybe this is all just a waste of time, maybe I really will lose my house, etc, etc.
d)Notice what do these bonds actually consist of? Anything physical? A belief? A thought? A sense of being needed by, or of needing, something/someone? Stay with: what does that attachment actually consist of? Look into it.
They seem to me to be some sort of spiral energy attaching to or pushing away a thought, idea, belief.
Sometimes both to the same thought which is an energy as well.
e) Then ask: who is it who is attached to a certain outcome/person/object? Is there any more there than an energy? Who/what is there here to be attached?
They seemed to be attaching to the sense of 'Robert'. Which seems to be another expression of energy. And nothing behind the energy.
f) So, who or what would be there to resist Life just happening as it happens?
Just thoughts ideas energy.
g) Could it be OK just to acknowledge that it is all just happening as it happens, and to go along with the wild ride? To acknowledge that it always has been this way, in the 'success times' as well as the 'failure times', and that it always will be?
Thought I had this while doing exercise 3) but.
True liberation is not in freedom from the 'low' but freedom from the notion of the whole 'high/low' cycle itself and to see the actual situation: that there is no person to benefit or to suffer, there is just the energy which has been labeled as such. Of course for the play (the hide-and-seek game) to continue the 'belief in a self' has lots of manifestations, including a sense of drama and suspense in the story, fear of nothingness etc.
yes I understand but is there not a clarity of seeing that removes all doubt? A shift of perception beyond question where one realizes they are not the 'self' but the 'Incomprehensible Beingness'. For lack of a better word.
Jot down what you notice (noting any other senses as well as the seeing). Now, as you observe, where is the line between i) Robert, ii) the looking/experiencing and iii) what is being experienced? Spend time looking for it? Are any of those distinctions real? Play with this for a while. Is anything happening that should not be happening?
Looking at this I first noticed the body. Then there seems to be a sense of a Robert. That seems to be the different ideas about Robert many of which are associated with the body. There was this awareness that was seeing this while seeing the birds, water, sand, sky, clouds, etc. Looking at this there was a sense of separateness but there was also the sense that there was no distinct line between the sense of Robert, the seeing and that which was seen. I really had to look for the line to see it wasn't there. I saw that it does whatever it does because it is whatever it is.
Doing this seemed to make looking at attachment/aversions easier. If there was no distinct line for all this then would it not be the same for all thoughts, emotions, attachments, energy. That everything was 'contained' which is really not the right word by this seeing and if this seeing was not contained in the body then where were it limits. This was all not very clear but somehow there.
There is something I can't quite put my finger on. Something to do with attachments, nothing behind the energy, the no separating line, and the no self. Like I sense it but don't see it.
That's what I have right now.
Thanks
Robert
Re: Looking for some guidance
Hi Robert,
Good work. I really enjoyed reading this post. This is kinda going in reverse order now:-
1. I loved your report from out in Nature, and would like to encourage you to do it again, looking maybe for the joins and separations in Nature. Is anything actually independent of the rest? Does the whole have preferences? Is it separate from the 'body organism' called Robert? So, does it feel as though there is any real Robert there in that body? If so, what is that feeling? You mentioned the question of whether there were any separating lines in all that's happening. Can you see any breaks at all in one continuity? Make notes and tell me more about what you find.
2. "yes I understand this but is there not a clarity of seeing that removes all doubt? A shift of perception beyond question where one realises..."
Continuing on from what I wrote last time about the 'cycle':- In actuality, there is nothing BUT clarity of seeing. It is SHRIEKING at the top of its voice ALL the time. We totally know this. We ONLY know this. But Life loves to play as well as to see. But the 'individual' is one and the same thing as the activity of Life putting its fingers in its ears and shouting 'LALA LALALA LALALALA!", intentionally NOT seeing the obvious, intentionally pretending to block out the shrieking of "everything is absolutely perfect just the way it is: this IS IT!". This 'blocking' activity is one and the same 'thing' as what we call 'I'. It's actually an activity. "I am an (insert adjective) individual" embedded in every thought. Once it's rumbled what's going on, the game is basically up, although the dominos may seem to fall bit by bit. So in a sense, it's a case of painstakingly wiping all the s*#t out of the eyes, and then what's left can happen by itself (but with NO expectation of how that may feel, mind!).
Ironically though, one of the best ways to avoid stopping the game is to keep the attention occupied by going round and round, highs and lows, chasing some special experience, no matter what that is called eg 'a clarity of seeing that removes all doubt, a shift of perception where one realises". Actually a shift in perception where 'one' realises still needs a 'one' to be present. How would that work? What you are experiencing now is ALL THERE IS!
Please excuse all the capitals there, Robert. Please read it all again slowly.
Interesting to ask the question, however, is the illusion inferior or superior to just WHAT IS? Is there a preference between the two? If so, a preference for whom or what, and is there anything which doesn't have such a preference?
3. In your a) b) and c):-
Now, when habitual thought patterns kick in, such as 'everything I have done is wrong' etc etc, you are right, it is interesting to see these as thought patterns rather than accepting the invitation to go into the labyrinth (which then evokes the apparition of "I am an (insert adjective) individual"). Your 'maybe' helps to stand back and do this, as would rephrasing them as questions. It really is a case of bulls*#t busting EVERY time this is spotted for a while. I like the exercise of a friend of mine: every time a thought is spotted arising like that, actually laugh (maybe a chuckle, maybe an outright guffaw, but it is supposed to make the stomach muscles actually contract, thus releasing oxytocin hormone which actually helps to reestablish new synapse connections in the brain, instead of the old habitual ones). I would like to invite you to do this exercise, whenever possible: let's call it Laughing at Thoughts (no need to judge them, though!). Here is a TED video about it: https://www.dropbox.com/s/mskv8uxmnmf2f ... _Being.mp4
However, health warning: don't see this as the 'path to clear seeing'. What I wrote above still holds. It is just a way of clearing habitual mental bulls*#t. It's not the new path to a destination. All 'paths' to destinations are (sneakily) what keep us from seeing that we are already home!
e) So, in reality, is there anything at all that the preferences are attaching to? Anything at all?
f) So, in reality, is anything resisting? Other than the thought that something is resisting?
g) I don't understand your answer to this one. Maybe you could take another look.
Cheers
Mark
Good work. I really enjoyed reading this post. This is kinda going in reverse order now:-
1. I loved your report from out in Nature, and would like to encourage you to do it again, looking maybe for the joins and separations in Nature. Is anything actually independent of the rest? Does the whole have preferences? Is it separate from the 'body organism' called Robert? So, does it feel as though there is any real Robert there in that body? If so, what is that feeling? You mentioned the question of whether there were any separating lines in all that's happening. Can you see any breaks at all in one continuity? Make notes and tell me more about what you find.
2. "yes I understand this but is there not a clarity of seeing that removes all doubt? A shift of perception beyond question where one realises..."
Continuing on from what I wrote last time about the 'cycle':- In actuality, there is nothing BUT clarity of seeing. It is SHRIEKING at the top of its voice ALL the time. We totally know this. We ONLY know this. But Life loves to play as well as to see. But the 'individual' is one and the same thing as the activity of Life putting its fingers in its ears and shouting 'LALA LALALA LALALALA!", intentionally NOT seeing the obvious, intentionally pretending to block out the shrieking of "everything is absolutely perfect just the way it is: this IS IT!". This 'blocking' activity is one and the same 'thing' as what we call 'I'. It's actually an activity. "I am an (insert adjective) individual" embedded in every thought. Once it's rumbled what's going on, the game is basically up, although the dominos may seem to fall bit by bit. So in a sense, it's a case of painstakingly wiping all the s*#t out of the eyes, and then what's left can happen by itself (but with NO expectation of how that may feel, mind!).
Ironically though, one of the best ways to avoid stopping the game is to keep the attention occupied by going round and round, highs and lows, chasing some special experience, no matter what that is called eg 'a clarity of seeing that removes all doubt, a shift of perception where one realises". Actually a shift in perception where 'one' realises still needs a 'one' to be present. How would that work? What you are experiencing now is ALL THERE IS!
Please excuse all the capitals there, Robert. Please read it all again slowly.
Interesting to ask the question, however, is the illusion inferior or superior to just WHAT IS? Is there a preference between the two? If so, a preference for whom or what, and is there anything which doesn't have such a preference?
3. In your a) b) and c):-
Now, when habitual thought patterns kick in, such as 'everything I have done is wrong' etc etc, you are right, it is interesting to see these as thought patterns rather than accepting the invitation to go into the labyrinth (which then evokes the apparition of "I am an (insert adjective) individual"). Your 'maybe' helps to stand back and do this, as would rephrasing them as questions. It really is a case of bulls*#t busting EVERY time this is spotted for a while. I like the exercise of a friend of mine: every time a thought is spotted arising like that, actually laugh (maybe a chuckle, maybe an outright guffaw, but it is supposed to make the stomach muscles actually contract, thus releasing oxytocin hormone which actually helps to reestablish new synapse connections in the brain, instead of the old habitual ones). I would like to invite you to do this exercise, whenever possible: let's call it Laughing at Thoughts (no need to judge them, though!). Here is a TED video about it: https://www.dropbox.com/s/mskv8uxmnmf2f ... _Being.mp4
However, health warning: don't see this as the 'path to clear seeing'. What I wrote above still holds. It is just a way of clearing habitual mental bulls*#t. It's not the new path to a destination. All 'paths' to destinations are (sneakily) what keep us from seeing that we are already home!
e) So, in reality, is there anything at all that the preferences are attaching to? Anything at all?
f) So, in reality, is anything resisting? Other than the thought that something is resisting?
g) I don't understand your answer to this one. Maybe you could take another look.
Cheers
Mark
"I": a simple case of mistaken identity.
Re: Looking for some guidance
Hi Mark
Quick update
This was a little easier to see today when I focused on looking for the lines of separation. During that time I had the sense, it was all one thing. There were no preferences here, everything just was. The first sign of separation seems to come from the mental habit of labeling everything.
On one hand I had a sense of a Robert energy that was not separate and on the other hand the persistent sense of, I am an individual, separate from the all. This seems to stem from looking out from these eyes and the sense of being ' almost trapped' within the body. Like I am housed within this body looking out through these eyes. This seems habitual. This also seems to be reinforced by limited perspective. I can only see what I am looking at.
I need a little more time contemplating this from the perspective of thoughts, attachments and emotions. They seem to be energies within the all. All thoughts seem to be equally valid. Nothing seems to be judged from this perspective. Almost like this Observing can pick from All Thought to play with. Attachments and aversions seemed more like energies floating in space. Not attached to anything and almost not really even there.
Yes I can see how this can be the root of all delusion. I am an individual separate from the All. I guess the process is what the process is. I am impressed to look, so I look. Can anything else be done?
Good point. The illusion would be an aspect of the All but not judged to be inferior because it is the All. So what is, is the All, as is the illusion, as is everything.
I actually watched that video a few months ago. Thanks for the reminder and the timing couldn't be better. Started doing it today and think its a great way to just finish off some of those persistent thoughts. Already noticed how some of those statements just make me laugh now.
Also laughing seems to tap into essence of our nature. I had a dream years ago where there was just Space and all it was doing was belly laughing.
No. If they appear to it is to whatever is remaining of, I am an individual separate from the All.
No
I need to take a little more time and look closely at these last few questions tomorrow.
That's it for right now
Thanks
Robert
Quick update
Is anything actually independent of the rest? Does the whole have preferences? Is it separate from the 'body organism' called Robert?
This was a little easier to see today when I focused on looking for the lines of separation. During that time I had the sense, it was all one thing. There were no preferences here, everything just was. The first sign of separation seems to come from the mental habit of labeling everything.
So, does it feel as though there is any real Robert there in that body? If so, what is that feeling?
On one hand I had a sense of a Robert energy that was not separate and on the other hand the persistent sense of, I am an individual, separate from the all. This seems to stem from looking out from these eyes and the sense of being ' almost trapped' within the body. Like I am housed within this body looking out through these eyes. This seems habitual. This also seems to be reinforced by limited perspective. I can only see what I am looking at.
You mentioned the question of whether there were any separating lines in all that's happening. Can you see any breaks at all in one continuity?
I need a little more time contemplating this from the perspective of thoughts, attachments and emotions. They seem to be energies within the all. All thoughts seem to be equally valid. Nothing seems to be judged from this perspective. Almost like this Observing can pick from All Thought to play with. Attachments and aversions seemed more like energies floating in space. Not attached to anything and almost not really even there.
Continuing on from what I wrote last time about the 'cycle':- In actuality, there is nothing BUT clarity of seeing. It is SHRIEKING at the top of its voice ALL the time. We totally know this. We ONLY know this. But Life loves to play as well as to see. But the 'individual' is one and the same thing as the activity of Life putting its fingers in its ears and shouting 'LALA LALALA LALALALA!", intentionally NOT seeing the obvious, intentionally pretending to block out the shrieking of "everything is absolutely perfect just the way it is: this IS IT!". This 'blocking' activity is one and the same 'thing' as what we call 'I'. It's actually an activity. "I am an (insert adjective) individual" embedded in every thought. Once it's rumbled what's going on, the game is basically up, although the dominos may seem to fall bit by bit. So in a sense, it's a case of painstakingly wiping all the s*#t out of the eyes, and then what's left can happen by itself (but with NO expectation of how that may feel, mind!).
Yes I can see how this can be the root of all delusion. I am an individual separate from the All. I guess the process is what the process is. I am impressed to look, so I look. Can anything else be done?
Interesting to ask the question, however, is the illusion inferior or superior to just WHAT IS? Is there a preference between the two? If so, a preference for whom or what, and is there anything which doesn't have such a preference?
Good point. The illusion would be an aspect of the All but not judged to be inferior because it is the All. So what is, is the All, as is the illusion, as is everything.
I would like to invite you to do this exercise, whenever possible: let's call it Laughing at Thoughts (no need to judge them, though!).
I actually watched that video a few months ago. Thanks for the reminder and the timing couldn't be better. Started doing it today and think its a great way to just finish off some of those persistent thoughts. Already noticed how some of those statements just make me laugh now.
Also laughing seems to tap into essence of our nature. I had a dream years ago where there was just Space and all it was doing was belly laughing.
e) So, in reality, is there anything at all that the preferences are attaching to? Anything at all?
No. If they appear to it is to whatever is remaining of, I am an individual separate from the All.
f) So, in reality, is anything resisting? Other than the thought that something is resisting?
No
I need to take a little more time and look closely at these last few questions tomorrow.
That's it for right now
Thanks
Robert
Re: Looking for some guidance
Hi Robert
Good work.
I look forward to hearing the rest from you tomorrow.
Cheers
Mark
Good work.
I look forward to hearing the rest from you tomorrow.
Cheers
Mark
"I": a simple case of mistaken identity.
Re: Looking for some guidance
Hi Mark
Update
While looking at all the questions and doing the exercises there seemed to be something nagging me throughout the day. Then as I sat late in the day the thought, I still don't got it, man what the heck, I can sense it, at times I see it, but I can't seem to get it. If I could just do, be, have, then I would do, be and have. If I could just get this, see this, then ....
Then after really looking at this, the thought came up, I really need to get this, my whole world depends on it. I can't believe I've taken myself to the edge of the cliff, I am really out on a limb.
And then I saw it, the 'I' 'Robert' was taking credit for leading and pushing me to 'put it all on the line' to discover the truth.
How could that be?
All of a sudden there is not this 'I' that has made all these mistakes or hasn't seen or done, this or that to bring me to this point. Or even the 'Robert' who hasn't thought or done the 'right' things yet to make things work.
I am not sure of the full ramifications of this yet but I know it has to do with question g). If the 'I' is not responsible for bringing me down this path, then it certainly cannot be responsible for this moment of the path or the unfolding of anything yet to come.
There seems to be some sort of huge pressure release with this. I am going to sit with this a while and do the exercises again tomorrow but I wanted to get something over to you. Any additional thoughts are always welcome.
Thanks
Robert
Update
While looking at all the questions and doing the exercises there seemed to be something nagging me throughout the day. Then as I sat late in the day the thought, I still don't got it, man what the heck, I can sense it, at times I see it, but I can't seem to get it. If I could just do, be, have, then I would do, be and have. If I could just get this, see this, then ....
Then after really looking at this, the thought came up, I really need to get this, my whole world depends on it. I can't believe I've taken myself to the edge of the cliff, I am really out on a limb.
And then I saw it, the 'I' 'Robert' was taking credit for leading and pushing me to 'put it all on the line' to discover the truth.
How could that be?
All of a sudden there is not this 'I' that has made all these mistakes or hasn't seen or done, this or that to bring me to this point. Or even the 'Robert' who hasn't thought or done the 'right' things yet to make things work.
I am not sure of the full ramifications of this yet but I know it has to do with question g). If the 'I' is not responsible for bringing me down this path, then it certainly cannot be responsible for this moment of the path or the unfolding of anything yet to come.
There seems to be some sort of huge pressure release with this. I am going to sit with this a while and do the exercises again tomorrow but I wanted to get something over to you. Any additional thoughts are always welcome.
Thanks
Robert
Re: Looking for some guidance
Hi Robert,
So who/what is this, really, that is writing, that is reading these words?
What can be claimed as 'Robert', as separate from Life Itself?
Nothing to add for now....
Cheers
Mark
So who/what is this, really, that is writing, that is reading these words?
What can be claimed as 'Robert', as separate from Life Itself?
Nothing to add for now....
Cheers
Mark
"I": a simple case of mistaken identity.
Re: Looking for some guidance
Hi Mark
I shall answer fully answer all the questions shortly.
A correction: the initial concept was important to see but that path statement was not quite correct. What path? Only a thought. I noticed memories take up a lot of space in space. Just even subtle emotions that go with those thoughts. All just a collection of thoughts, images and emotions, "the story of my life". This also applies to future unfolding events,thoughts,ideas. Just dragging it all around. The past and future are just thoughts about a story, of a story. Plus I also noticed there was a whole lot 'Trying' in that story.
I'll post soon
Thanks
Robert
I shall answer fully answer all the questions shortly.
A correction: the initial concept was important to see but that path statement was not quite correct. What path? Only a thought. I noticed memories take up a lot of space in space. Just even subtle emotions that go with those thoughts. All just a collection of thoughts, images and emotions, "the story of my life". This also applies to future unfolding events,thoughts,ideas. Just dragging it all around. The past and future are just thoughts about a story, of a story. Plus I also noticed there was a whole lot 'Trying' in that story.
I'll post soon
Thanks
Robert
Re: Looking for some guidance
Hi Mark
Here's an update
Had a question and an answer yesterday.
Why? ..... To kill the 'I'.
I know the I is not killed or destroyed but it was the concept that was important. If everything that happens is to remove the delusion of the I, that changes the entire perspective on circumstances. Everything is the All. That's All There Is. If there is an impression to sit and contemplate, than what other 'action' should be taken. What other action would be fruitful? That is the action, that is the activity. If the impression to 'do some particular thing' is there than how could that not be done. If it is all, the All, then what is happening is what should be happening. Even if it seems like everything is crumbling, you are being crushed and destruction is all encompassing. This typically is where the mind is freaking out, the 'I' is freaking out, go, go, go, do, do, do, try this, try that, do something. Which, in actuality would be fruitless and ineffective if the impression is sit, contemplate and dissolve the I. Trusting that when it's time to do, I do and when it's time to sit, I sit. That's if life is looking to reveal itself to itself through the removal of the I thoughts or dissolving of the I concepts.
So right now I am contemplating preferences, happening as it happens, noticing the All one thing and everything is absolutely perfect just as it is. Since I am not separate from the All, Life is revealing the remaining thoughts and emotions that are enforcing the sense of separateness. Since everything is the All, then who am 'I' to question the order and timing of this.
That's what I have right now.
Thanks
Robert
Here's an update
Had a question and an answer yesterday.
Why? ..... To kill the 'I'.
I know the I is not killed or destroyed but it was the concept that was important. If everything that happens is to remove the delusion of the I, that changes the entire perspective on circumstances. Everything is the All. That's All There Is. If there is an impression to sit and contemplate, than what other 'action' should be taken. What other action would be fruitful? That is the action, that is the activity. If the impression to 'do some particular thing' is there than how could that not be done. If it is all, the All, then what is happening is what should be happening. Even if it seems like everything is crumbling, you are being crushed and destruction is all encompassing. This typically is where the mind is freaking out, the 'I' is freaking out, go, go, go, do, do, do, try this, try that, do something. Which, in actuality would be fruitless and ineffective if the impression is sit, contemplate and dissolve the I. Trusting that when it's time to do, I do and when it's time to sit, I sit. That's if life is looking to reveal itself to itself through the removal of the I thoughts or dissolving of the I concepts.
So right now I am contemplating preferences, happening as it happens, noticing the All one thing and everything is absolutely perfect just as it is. Since I am not separate from the All, Life is revealing the remaining thoughts and emotions that are enforcing the sense of separateness. Since everything is the All, then who am 'I' to question the order and timing of this.
That's what I have right now.
Thanks
Robert
Re: Looking for some guidance
Hi Robert
Nice work and seeing. It feels like a bit of a calm descending for the moment? Whatever the feeling, I enjoyed reading this post.
Just a few things to ponder along with your contemplations, along with preferences, happening as it happens etc:-
1. Since Life/Being/the Absolute/'That's All There IS' does not have the ability NOT to be everywhere or not to permeate everything, who/what was it that wrote that last post? Who was it Really?
2. Could total liberation be just what is happening right now? Appearing as pleasure and pain? Appearing as questioning? Appearing as answering? Appearing as whatever it appears as? With whatever feelings arise and evolve?
3. Interesting that you write at the beginning: "To kill the 'I'. I know the I is not killed or destroyed" then later "contemplate and dissolve the I"
Yes, how can something be dissolved or destroyed that isn't actually there and never has been? Is it just that the whole act is being rumbled?
4. "That's if life is looking to reveal itself to itself through the removal of the I thoughts".
The very fact that you are here, having this conversation, tends to indicate that Life is indeed doing this, yes?
Is it the actual thoughts that Life is removing, or is it the being taken in by them and believing in a 'Robert'?
5. "Life is revealing the remaining thoughts and emotions that are enforcing the sense of separateness". Consider whether the emotions, the sensations that come up, ARE life itself, and whether the thoughts are any more than labels and stories trying to bring attention to the story of a suffering 'Robert'? So, Life in 'play' mode?
6. How does it feel to see This Is All There Is, at the moment? Please note any difference from before you started our dialogue and in the last few days.
Give some time to each of those, and I look forward to hearing back from you.
Cheers
Mark
Nice work and seeing. It feels like a bit of a calm descending for the moment? Whatever the feeling, I enjoyed reading this post.
Just a few things to ponder along with your contemplations, along with preferences, happening as it happens etc:-
1. Since Life/Being/the Absolute/'That's All There IS' does not have the ability NOT to be everywhere or not to permeate everything, who/what was it that wrote that last post? Who was it Really?
2. Could total liberation be just what is happening right now? Appearing as pleasure and pain? Appearing as questioning? Appearing as answering? Appearing as whatever it appears as? With whatever feelings arise and evolve?
3. Interesting that you write at the beginning: "To kill the 'I'. I know the I is not killed or destroyed" then later "contemplate and dissolve the I"
Yes, how can something be dissolved or destroyed that isn't actually there and never has been? Is it just that the whole act is being rumbled?
4. "That's if life is looking to reveal itself to itself through the removal of the I thoughts".
The very fact that you are here, having this conversation, tends to indicate that Life is indeed doing this, yes?
Is it the actual thoughts that Life is removing, or is it the being taken in by them and believing in a 'Robert'?
5. "Life is revealing the remaining thoughts and emotions that are enforcing the sense of separateness". Consider whether the emotions, the sensations that come up, ARE life itself, and whether the thoughts are any more than labels and stories trying to bring attention to the story of a suffering 'Robert'? So, Life in 'play' mode?
6. How does it feel to see This Is All There Is, at the moment? Please note any difference from before you started our dialogue and in the last few days.
Give some time to each of those, and I look forward to hearing back from you.
Cheers
Mark
"I": a simple case of mistaken identity.
Re: Looking for some guidance
Hi Robert,
It's been a couple of days...
How are you getting on with THIS?
Are any fears and resistances arising?
Let me know what's coming up.
Cheers
Mark
It's been a couple of days...
How are you getting on with THIS?
Are any fears and resistances arising?
Let me know what's coming up.
Cheers
Mark
"I": a simple case of mistaken identity.
Re: Looking for some guidance
Hi Mark
This really doesn't convey where I am with this. It just does not seem to be a one day thing. (as much as i would like it to be) I spend practically the whole day doing the exercises, looking at the questions. Things come up. But I still can't honestly answer that last question.
I wasn't going to write just yet but I saw your post and that brought up whole issue of time, why is this taking so long why can't I just answer that last question. What am I not seeing or still holding onto or whatever?
This was a set of thoughts from earlier.
Can awareness trap itself so completely than even it cannot escape?
Can it create a scenario where even it cannot find a way out?
Can it destroy the body so completely as to render awareness useless?
Can it haunt itself so continuously as to never have peace, love or joy?
Can it create a situation where even it is powerless?
Can it constrict itself so completely as to extinguish itself?
The answer I get is Yes, but what would be aware of the happening of each one of those things? So it must just be the idea of these things that would make them seem real.
You know I get to that last question and It just doesn't feel right, I don't see it. Sometimes I feel like its right there, I can sense it and then I don't know what. All the other questions - I see them, they make sense, no problem.
I guess maybe I am just holding onto the thought that everything will be alright. Maybe everything won't be alright.
Thanks
Robert
The last questioning this post is referring to question g) everything happening as it happens
This really doesn't convey where I am with this. It just does not seem to be a one day thing. (as much as i would like it to be) I spend practically the whole day doing the exercises, looking at the questions. Things come up. But I still can't honestly answer that last question.
I wasn't going to write just yet but I saw your post and that brought up whole issue of time, why is this taking so long why can't I just answer that last question. What am I not seeing or still holding onto or whatever?
This was a set of thoughts from earlier.
Can awareness trap itself so completely than even it cannot escape?
Can it create a scenario where even it cannot find a way out?
Can it destroy the body so completely as to render awareness useless?
Can it haunt itself so continuously as to never have peace, love or joy?
Can it create a situation where even it is powerless?
Can it constrict itself so completely as to extinguish itself?
The answer I get is Yes, but what would be aware of the happening of each one of those things? So it must just be the idea of these things that would make them seem real.
You know I get to that last question and It just doesn't feel right, I don't see it. Sometimes I feel like its right there, I can sense it and then I don't know what. All the other questions - I see them, they make sense, no problem.
I guess maybe I am just holding onto the thought that everything will be alright. Maybe everything won't be alright.
Thanks
Robert
The last questioning this post is referring to question g) everything happening as it happens
Re: Looking for some guidance
Hi Robert,
You didn't answer the questions from the previous post but one. Nor from the most recent one. (You did ask me to guide you, didn't you).
Just relax a bit, consider the questions, then report back. No need to try to 'cram the truth into your head' or anything like that.
Best
Mark
You didn't answer the questions from the previous post but one. Nor from the most recent one. (You did ask me to guide you, didn't you).
Just relax a bit, consider the questions, then report back. No need to try to 'cram the truth into your head' or anything like that.
Best
Mark
"I": a simple case of mistaken identity.
Re: Looking for some guidance
Hi Mark
Here is what I have so far.
There is an idea about writing. There is some sort of energy that seems to be writing. And there is the experience of reading and writing. What this is I do not know.
Yes, the All, expressing and experiencing the ongoing All of Itself. All thought, All emotion.
Yes a habit of thought perhaps.
That's what I have right now.
Thanks
Robert
Here is what I have so far.
Why, did you stop? :) I do appreciate the push to actually write the answers down though.You didn't answer the questions from the previous post but one. Nor from the most recent one. (You did ask me to guide you, didn't you).
Good advise once again.Just relax a bit, consider the questions, then report back. No need to try to 'cram the truth into your head' or anything like that.
In reality no. So all preferences are just thoughts, like any other thoughts but labeled as good/bad, like/dislike etc.e) So, in reality, is there anything at all that the preferences are attaching to? Anything at all?
No. Resistance is a just another thought that seems to depend on preference.f) So, in reality, is anything resisting? Other than the thought that something is resisting?
So who/what is this, really, that is writing, that is reading these words?
There is an idea about writing. There is some sort of energy that seems to be writing. And there is the experience of reading and writing. What this is I do not know.
Nothing. It is just an idea, another concept within the All.What can be claimed as 'Robert', as separate from Life Itself?
It seems What would be more appropriate. If I had to guess I would say an unlimited animating life force, without borders that uses mind, thought and emotion to create and experience the illusion of the expression of life.1. Since Life/Being/the Absolute/'That's All There IS' does not have the ability NOT to be everywhere or not to permeate everything, who/what was it that wrote that last post? Who was it Really?
Yes that has be. Since this energy is only Now.2. Could total liberation be just what is happening right now?
Appearing as pleasure and pain? Appearing as questioning? Appearing as answering? Appearing as whatever it appears as? With whatever feelings arise and evolve?
Yes, the All, expressing and experiencing the ongoing All of Itself. All thought, All emotion.
3. Interesting that you write at the beginning: "To kill the 'I'. I know the I is not killed or destroyed" then later "contemplate and dissolve the I" Yes, how can something be dissolved or destroyed that isn't actually there and never has been? Is it just that the whole act is being rumbled?
Yes a habit of thought perhaps.
Yes, Like a moth to the flame? Yet as you say there is nothing there to dissolve or destroy.4. "That's if life is looking to reveal itself to itself through the removal of the I thoughts".
The very fact that you are here, having this conversation, tends to indicate that Life is indeed doing this, yes?
Is it the actual thoughts that Life is removing, or is it the being taken in by them and believing in a 'Robert'?
So going beyond the labels, preferences, thoughts, emotions and the story there would only be one energy.5. "Life is revealing the remaining thoughts and emotions that are enforcing the sense of separateness". Consider whether the emotions, the sensations that come up, ARE life itself, and whether the thoughts are any more than labels and stories trying to bring attention to the story of a suffering 'Robert'? So, Life in 'play' mode?
That's what I have right now.
Thanks
Robert
Re: Looking for some guidance
Hi Robert
So, this All, are you anything separate from It, from any of it?
Whatever you answer to the above, please tell me how it feels to see that.
Cheers
Mark
So, this All, are you anything separate from It, from any of it?
Whatever you answer to the above, please tell me how it feels to see that.
Cheers
Mark
"I": a simple case of mistaken identity.
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