Looking for Guidance

[Gary]

Hi,

Guess I should start with some personal info; I'm 43 and English. Meditated for a while when I was 20; not for so long, but it was enough for me to see that investigation of the mind yielded quite startling understandings. This understanding has 'haunted' (that's how it kinda feels) me ever since - I could never really go totally into anything 'in the world', for it seemed that the 'answers' weren't to be found there.

Visited Osho's place in Pune, India, for a couple of years in my mid-twenties. Had a blast, became a lot more loosened up emotionally, but didn't have any memorable insights into the mind.

Subsequently went on a decade long fairly intensive journey into hedonistic delights while working in East Asia (damn that was tiring! :)

While traveling, around 3-4 years ago, I came upon the following Wei Wu Wei quote on a guesthouse wall. I was amazed!....

'Why are you unhappy?
Because 99.9 per cent
Of everything you think,
And of everything you do,
Is for yourself -
And there isn't one.'

This was the first time I had been really introduced to such an idea. Spent the next few years (and still) watching hundreds of videos of Non-Dual teachers, Mooji, Byron Katie, Katies Davis, Tolle, Ramana Maharshi, Nisargadatta, etc etc etc...

Moved back to England 2 years ago. Took (legal) psychedelics by myself (had never taken them before) with the specific goal of having insight into 'myself' around 10 times; the final trip bringing the insight that the ego is just a (quite charming?) construct of beliefs that we mistakenly gather, from a very young age, and take to be ourselves.

It was a hell of a shock!!! And basically that's why I am here. I saw that I am seeing myself and everyone through a dreamy haze of mistaken self-identity. I feel enormous desire to wake the fuck up!

...Is anyone available for guidance?

Sincerely,
Gary

[Yari]

Hi Gary,

the ego is just a (quite charming?) construct of beliefs that we mistakenly gather, from a very young age, and take to be ourselves.

Exactly...how does he do that, what is its trick? Let's look at it.
It says "I am you".
So the error in perpection is in Self-awareness, you heard that already didn't you?
What is the Self? It is the mind reference to itself: "I am"

When you hear the word "me" in your head, that is ego. Or better, it is ego when you identify with your identity, with the "me". But what is it?
Who is speaking anyway? It is the brain.

This is how it works: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JpsnVoRgDwY

I feel enormous desire to wake the fuck up!

This is enough to start the enquire, willingness to crack it. If you really want it you get it, but you gotta be ready to lose yourself. Honesty is key too
If you want we can work together, but i ask you to always observe directly at your experience and cut away all the mind game, not a place for intellectualization here. You gotta erase the idea you have about this whole story and just go for what you experience first hand. The answers you are looking for are right in front of your eyes.

[Gary]

Hi Yari,

That's wonderful! Thank you so much!

When you hear the word "me" in your head, that is ego. Or better, it is ego when you identify with your identity, with the "me". But what is it?
Who is speaking anyway? It is the brain.

This is how it works: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JpsnVoRgDwY

Ha! I thought this was about the ego when I watched it years ago. Great scene!

I sat outside with a cup of tea after watching it, and a belly laugh came - there seems to be so much 'me-ing' going on almost relentlessly. It feels like an obsession! Hahahaha!!!

This is enough to start the enquire, willingness to crack it. If you really want it you get it, but you gotta be ready to lose yourself. Honesty is key too
If you want we can work together, but i ask you to always observe directly at your experience and cut away all the mind game, not a place for intellectualization here. You gotta erase the idea you have about this whole story and just go for what you experience first hand. The answers you are looking for are right in front of your eyes.

Absolutely! I'm in!

Thanks again.

[Yari]

I sat outside with a cup of tea after watching it, and a belly laugh came - there seems to be so much 'me-ing' going on almost relentlessly. It feels like an obsession! Hahahaha!!!

Ok, that's fine, there is clearly a "me" dialogue. The me is obsesed of the me and it is of course the most important thing to it, what a surprise. This is precisely the ego movement.

Let' s observe where all that chattering comes from.
Is it a voice? Are they thoughts inside your head?

Who speaks...but most importantly -who listens?

Absolutely! I'm in!

Cool, let's do it! :-) How long it will take to be resolved is up to you. It is a matter of resistance, but what is it to resist, and to what? eheh
Be clear in what you want to get out of this.

[Gary]

Let' s observe where all that chattering comes from.
Is it a voice? Are they thoughts inside your head?

Yes and yes.

Who speaks...but most importantly -who listens?

The ego and the ego.

How long it will take to be resolved is up to you. It is a matter of resistance, but what is it to resist, and to what?

To avoid looking at the ego.

Be clear in what you want to get out of this.

To see the ego clearly for what it is.

To clarify: I think I've read here that I shouldn't use words such as 'it seems' or 'apparently', is that correct?
If so, how should I state uncertainty? - Or is that not appropriate in these exchanges?

[Gary]

Yari wrote Who speaks...but most importantly -who listens?

Yari wrote Who is speaking anyway? It is the brain.

Ah okay, so it is the brain speaking through the filter of the ego, so the ego listens.

[Gary]

Be clear in what you want to get out of this.

To clearly see the ego for what it is, and to be free of it.

[Gary]

It's been some time, Yari. Are you waiting for me to write more?

[Yari]

Who speaks...but most importantly -who listens?

The ego and the ego.

Ok, but who is the ego?
Let's find it.
Where is it and WHAT is it?
Be clear and simple.

To see the ego clearly for what it is.

To see it for what it is you need to observe at reality directly, like if you are only watching at a movie and you are not involved in it. So look at your thoughts now: there is a voice, the voice of brain; what happens when the voice says "me"? That is the ego, or better, the ego is identification with the personal identity, the "I".
"I think this"
"I do that"
Who is the I precisely? Who is speaking?

"ME! I AM SPEAKING!" Says the ego.
Did you notice it?
It says "me" in your head. It conviced "you" that it is you.

Put it like this: you are it. You are the one you are looking for. YOU ARE THE EGO. Who am i talking to?

To clarify: I think I've read here that I shouldn't use words such as 'it seems' or 'apparently', is that correct?
If so, how should I state uncertainty? - Or is that not appropriate in these exchanges?

Just be sure of what you say and write after you check for yourself, do not write what you think , that is useless (still mind) but only what you can observe and test first hand. We are trying to see at things for what they ARE, so there is no right and wrong answer, just your experience, so describe what you have in front of your eyes, not intellectual conclusions. It is not about being smart, but about being realistic.

Ah okay, so it is the brain speaking through the filter of the ego, so the ego listens.

Wrong. Check again.
If the ego is an illusory entity that doens't really exist, you then don't need one in the first place to be there "listening". Answer to this: where is the split "speaker/listener"?

It's been some time, Yari. Are you waiting for me to write more?

Oh no no, your writings are ok and enough, i was kinda busy so didn't have time to reply these days, will try to answer on a daily basis now on.

Talk to you soon, much love <3

[Gary]

Had nausea all day, will reply tomorrow morning :)

[Yari]

Take your time my friend, no hurry. Relax...

[Gary]

I see that I am quite nervous to do this wrongly :)

Ok, but who is the ego?
Let's find it.
Where is it and WHAT is it?
Be clear and simple.

-The ego isn't a "who", it's a thing that appears to be a who/me. Hmm, I've read that the ego is actually a verb (rather than a thing); I can't see that, though, other than the process of beliefs coming and going.

-In meditation it appears that when the thoughts come very slowly, and the mind becomes quiet, a sense of ego-self isn't really there; so the ego arises with mind.

-

the ego is just a (quite charming?) construct of beliefs that we mistakenly gather, from a very young age, and take to be ourselves.

...the ego is a set of beliefs about 'me'. An extremely convincing set of beliefs and thoughts. I seem to be missing an important understanding here.

To see it for what it is you need to observe at reality directly, like if you are only watching at a movie and you are not involved in it. So look at your thoughts now: there is a voice, the voice of brain; what happens when the voice says "me"? That is the ego, or better, the ego is identification with the personal identity, the "I".
"I think this"
"I do that"
Who is the I precisely? Who is speaking?

"ME! I AM SPEAKING!" Says the ego.
Did you notice it?
It says "me" in your head. It conviced "you" that it is you.

Put it like this: you are it. You are the one you are looking for. YOU ARE THE EGO. Who am i talking to?

Put it like this: you are it. You are the one you are looking for. YOU ARE THE EGO. Who am i talking to?

I feel confused with the last 4 sentences. I'll keep looking today.

Just be sure of what you say and write after you check for yourself, do not write what you think , that is useless (still mind) but only what you can observe and test first hand. We are trying to see at things for what they ARE, so there is no right and wrong answer, just your experience, so describe what you have in front of your eyes, not intellectual conclusions. It is not about being smart, but about being realistic.

Okay.

Ah okay, so it is the brain speaking through the filter of the ego, so the ego listens.

Wrong. Check again.
If the ego is an illusory entity that doens't really exist, you then don't need one in the first place to be there "listening". Answer to this: where is the split "speaker/listener"?

Right, okay. I have seen that the ego only has a relative reality, so therefore the brain must be the speaker and the listener. I'll also look at this one today and post later or tomorrow.

Thanks.

[Yari]

I see that I am quite nervous to do this wrongly :)

No right or wrong way, don't worry. Just follow your instinct, it will lead you where you need to go.

-The ego isn't a "who", it's a thing that appears to be a who/me.

The ego is YOU. It is when your mind looks at itself and goes "this is me!"
When you hear "me" in your head that is the brain talking about itself, not you.

The ego is the "I/me", the self-reference of the brain towards itself.
The SELF. "I am".
That indicates you are speaking about your Self. The brain has a concept of being a someone. I know this will all sound obvious to you but i have no other way to explain it, it is so simple, yet hard to grasp for those who don't know.
Close your eyes and think "I am the brain". Can you see the thinking is made by the brain/mind?

the mind becomes quiet, a sense of ego-self isn't really there; so the ego arises with mind.

So when you do not think you do not exist? That's right, the sense of self/identity comes from mind activity, meaning that you have to THINK about yourself to make up your persona. All your personality traits, dreams, habits, memories...are in mind. No mind activity, no self; just the pure presence.

...the ego is a set of beliefs about 'me'. An extremely convincing set of beliefs and thoughts. I seem to be missing an important understanding here.

When you identify with the me, that is ego. The me will stay after liberation as a reference to the body/mind, but you see you are not it, that's the whole point.

[Yari]

I strongly recommend you to print and read this very short but enlightening (and funny) document:

LINK:
http://www.efipaz.com/DeMello/How%20to% ... 20Mind.pdf

You won't regret it :-)

[Gary]

^^ Reading now, thanks :) Will respond to your comments later tonight.