Need guidance

[uncontested]

When you look at the word label ‘GREEN' , what is the actual experience?

Is the color red ‘experienced’, or is the color green ‘experienced’ as the label suggests?

Does the label ‘GREEN’ have a one-to-one correspondence with ‘reality’? Or does the label suggest something else other than what is here now (red colour)?

The actual experience of the image isn’t possible to describe truthfully in words. Since this image is learned to be labeled red, that’s what pops up in mind, not green (opposite could happen if past learning was different). In this particular case label green has zero correspondence to reality.

Is 'green' associated in any way with the experience of the colour red; or is green just a label that overlays the actual experience of red?

All words are symbolic overlays of DE.

If the label ‘GREEN’ is replaced with the label ‘GOOD’ or ‘BAD’ , is the redness affected in any way as the labels suggests?

Does redness become ‘good’ or ‘bad’, or do the labels have no affect whatsoever on ‘reality’?

Labels have no effect whatsoever.

[Anastacia42]

All true. You went a little beyond. but that's okay.

let's look at this idea of "choice."

Palm Flipping Exercise

1. Hold a hand in front of you; palm turned down.

2. Now turn the palm up. And down...and up and so on.

Watch like a hawk.

Don't go to thoughts – examine your direct experience.

Do this as many times as you like, and each time inquire:

How is the movement controlled?

Does a thought control it?

Can a ‘controller’ of any description be located?

How is the decision made to turn the hand over?

Track any decision point when a thought MADE THE DECISION to turn the hand over and the hand turns over immediately.

Who or what ​ chose which hand - the left or right hand for the exercise?

Can you find a separate individual or anything that is choosing when to turn the palm up or down?

Loving,

[uncontested]

How is the movement controlled?

Does a thought control it?

Can a ‘controller’ of any description be located?

How is the decision made to turn the hand over?

Instructions appeared on my phone screen (no choice on “I/me/mine” part) and were executed automatically (without thoughts). So no labeling like “my choice” or “I made a decision” even had opportunity to occur. So controller could remotely be described as circumstances.

Who or what ​ chose which hand - the left or right hand for the exercise?

Can you find a separate individual or anything that is choosing when to turn the palm up or down?

Again, you cought me in a thoughtless space, so no individual “me doing this” had an opportunity to come to mind. In other cases, what seems to happen is thoughts like “it is my decision” come alongside or even after certain action is being carried out. In other words, labeling keeps overlaying labels on automatic events, creating a sense of control.

[uncontested]

I guess what keeps the illusion of control is that labeling mechanism is quite good at predicting illusory future. When predicting labels eventually match the presence (not perfectly but good enough), thoughts like “I decided that and that happened” have a place to stick. And the cycle repeats reinforcing itself.

[Anastacia42]

Please...

One quoted question.

One answer

Next quoted question

Next answer

!And so on.

Not all together or grouped. This will be very important later when we share some of your answers with other guides. Also I do this on my phone.

Thank you.

[Anastacia42]

So when you do Palm Flipping, how does it FEEL to see thought does not control it?

Loving

[uncontested]

Okay.

How is the movement controlled?

Automatically.

Does a thought control it?

No.

Can a ‘controller’ of any description be located?

No.

How is the decision made to turn the hand over?

There is no decision. There is an act which afterwards is labeled as “my decision”.

Who or what ​ chose which hand - the left or right hand for the exercise?

Noone.

Can you find a separate individual or anything that is choosing when to turn the palm up or down?

I can’t.

So when you do Palm Flipping, how does it FEEL to see thought does not control it?

Liberating.

[Anastacia42]

We are looking for a shift in perception. For descriptions, read Gateless Gatecrashers downloaded from Resources, Books here. Yours will be different but it will give you some idea.

ButtChair

Please LOOK for any place where your butt ends & the chair begins.

Is there any clear dividing line between them? Or only the Sensation with no clear division?


It is simple direct & nonverbal. Just LOOK.

Then write what is true.

I did only this and nothing else for 3 months and then saw. It crept up on me while I was sitting at a stoplight. Seeing often happens when we are simply relaxed and looking. I should say, it ONLY happens when we are relaxed and LOOKING.

Loving

[uncontested]

Is there any clear dividing line between them? Or only the Sensation with no clear division?

So should I report something everyday or write back my findings only when clear seeing (shift in perception) happens (which can take a while)? My immediate response is: there is a sensation of pressure as DE. Beyond that, to look for a separation I must go into my head. I don’t know how profound and unmistakable this shift in perception must be but I guess I will know when/if it happens.

[Anastacia42]

It is helpful to write each day There are other pointers I may give you depending on what is coming up for you

Read Gateless Gatecrashers downloaded here from the Resources Books area to get examples of what it will sound like when you do have that shift in perception. Yours will be your own, but examples can help you know what it is. Once in a while, somebody has that shift from reading the book.

Keep LOOKING with ButtChsir.

This is not about right answers. It is a meditation.

Here is a link to about a dozen more pointers from my DropBox. Those may be helpful. Please report your experience with those.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/ksba3zhi9uuz ... hsk1a?dl=0

Loving,

[uncontested]

Read some Gateless Gatecrashers' dialogues. I don't think I miss anything they come to realise at the end of conversations. This liberation/awakening/enlightment is simply ability to differentiate between DE and thought stories. "I" exist only in thought stories, there is no other medium for it. Now, if thoughts arise that's OK. It's not about eradicating the occurrence of them, just not getting entangled in their stories. And this LOOKING/SEEING thing doesn't seem that hard to me. It's not like DE is not already or somehow hidden in secret places. Worst that can happen is getting distracted yet by another story.

PS. Really enjoying the first meditation from your dropbox.

[Anastacia42]

Yes. exactly. Very good

Also, it is unlikely you will see while you're in the middle of your practice. It's more likely to creep upon you when you're relaxed and not paying attention. But doing the practice sets up the conditions.

You must be relaxed.

Really enjoying the first meditation from your dropbox.

Good.
Loving,