Here are my responses.
No, there’s no self and there’s never been one, only the illusion of self created by the mind and its stories that can be seen as thoughts (beliefs, values, memories etc.) + the body and its sensations that the mind wants to call a part of “me”.1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?
Was there ever?
But…
you asked me earlier
"Where is “you” in this field of seeing?
Is seeing happening inside a body?
Or is it just happening, with no source, no center, no watcher?"
and I guess there’s something left in this “Seeing is happening through the body” belief. I know it’s thoughts that say I see through my eyes, but the experience confirms it in a way- when I close my eyes I don’t see, I see things only in front of the body, not behind my head etc. It was easier to "get it" with the hearing. And the knowledge of how the body perceives sensory stimuli is not helping here. Perhaps there are more ways of addressing it.
The illusion came into being by living in the world, where the illusion of self is taken as true- observing my family reacting to me and each other as if we were separate selves, f.e. telling me that I did something wrong and shouldn’t allow it to happen again, as if I had a choice and was to be blamed. The mind’s needs are to belong and be safe, so it figured out that it’s safer if I have power, some sense of agency, which with time made the identification even stronger.2) Describe how the illusion of an independent self came into being by giving examples from actual experience.
Then give some experiential examples of how life changed for you after seeing through this illusion.
The way my life changed after seeing through the illusion - f.e. there’s more lightness in the interactions with my clients, as it’s often remembered that things can’t be any different and there’s no one to be blamed. There’s no me so it’s not that I did or didn’t do something- it just happened. In the past there used to be a lot of ruminations coming from the mind and now it’s either quiet or the stories are seen and not believed in, so there’s less guilt and more trust.
There’s more connection to the bodily sensations and body’s needs, when in the past some decisions regarding what to eat etc. were guided by the mind and its ideas of what would be good for this body. Now there’s more feeling and checking with the body.
In certain cases (close relationships) there’s still a thought that I need to (and can) do something and the mind believes it and it’s not seen as an illusion. But then when the mind ruminates about it for some time, this feeling “let’s leave it” sometimes comes. Not always though and now it’s seen there’s nothing “I” can do about it, it either happens or not.
It feels lighter, refreshing, eye-opening, yet it’s subtle. I feel like thanks to your guidance to check what really is - not what the mind believes is- it was felt deeply that there’s no self, no me as a body, but just a bunch of sensations and thoughts. And there's this knowing that even if “I” forget it all or feel like it’s not true, it’ll be only thoughts and the mind trying to get its power back, as there’s no me to do anything now. Feels liberating.3) How does it feel to see this?
What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.
“I” can see the many places where identification still happens and the mind expects and hopes to see changes in those areas, but I don’t know what will come.
I guess it happened gradually, like uncovering the truth from many angles, that resulted in this clearer seeing. I remember that this exercise of checking with the body with my eyes closed to see if I can feel its shape or just some warmth, pressure etc. was an important one.4) Can you remember any specific inquiry that resulted in an epiphany? ..a before and after seeing the actuality of the Self. Was there a point when you ‘got it’?
There was no me to get it so I didn’t do anything here, it just happened.
Well, feels like they are all an illusion- something the mind believes in but in reality there’s no one who can make any decision or have control over anything. I don’t know what makes things happen - they just happen. No idea how it works but what feels true now is that “I” have nothing to do with it, as there’s no me to be able to do anything. So, f.e. when I say something, I know it’s not me choosing the words, they just come out of this body for some reason in this way or another. The mind can judge it but it’s seen as the mind’s limited perspective and not taken that seriously and personally.5) a) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work?
Give examples from your own recent experiences to how these things happen and how they work.
I can't be responsible for anything as there's no me. Seeing this truth helped “me” to feel more relaxed in relationships, knowing that I don’t choose what happens. Any regrets about the past are seen as just thoughts and there’s this understanding that it couldn’t be any different. It was exactly the way it was supposed to be and it’s only the mind who can argue with that, believing that “we” had a choice. We didn’t.b) What are you responsible for? Give examples from your own recent experiences to how this works.
Hmm, right now if any questions come up it’s seen that they come from the mind and quickly the realisation comes up that there’s no me, there’s nothing to be done etc. This level of “alertness” is not present all the time, but I know it’s not up to me for it to be there or not. It’s not “my” choice.6) Anything to add?
