Feeling Stuck
Re: Feeling Stuck
Vince,
An awfully long post from you, a lot for me to take in and reply to, been struggling with what to say or where to start, so will digress a little which may help me to explain.
This year is an anniversary of sorts; back in Feb of 2015 I was living on my own and had been for 20 years, through choice, I wasn’t ambitious neither did I have a master plan, I was just content with the direction my life was taking. Then a series of events occurred that turned my world on it’s head in a very short 12 month period; since then numerous other circumstances have continued to thwart my life, despite my best efforts to set a course, little seems to have worked, and whilst my life isn’t ‘bad’ in any way, it’s not where I could/should/want to be, so there is a lot of resentment, bitterness, fear and anger leading to resistance to ‘what is’
I’ve just re-read Huxleys’ Island this week, a few relevant quotes:
and knowing all the time that where it’s going is where I want to go, where I have to go:
what always and everywhere has to be done by anyone who has a clear idea about what’s what.
and awareness of the not-sensation in every sensation.
to feel that nothing is quite real—including yourself?
to make the me more conscious of what the not-me is up to
you may suddenly find yourself paying attention to the not-you on the further side of consciousness
Start by being fully aware of what you think you are. It’ll help you to become aware of what you are in fact
tried to find out which of me was frightened and why she was frightened
But there’s another one who doesn’t get frightened.” “Which one is that?” “The one that doesn’t talk—just looks and listens and feels what’s going on inside
This ‘me’ and ‘not me’ is something I can vaguely feel, though not happy with where I am, it’s where I’m supposed to be, it’s somehow ‘right’ yet ‘wrong’ at the same time “ strange and inexplicable things happen in your life because it’s taking you where you need to be”. It might be where I need to be, but not where I want to be. Maybe I can see it, but resent it so refuse to accept it? Spiritual dissonance? Or just plain stubborn.
Paul.
An awfully long post from you, a lot for me to take in and reply to, been struggling with what to say or where to start, so will digress a little which may help me to explain.
This year is an anniversary of sorts; back in Feb of 2015 I was living on my own and had been for 20 years, through choice, I wasn’t ambitious neither did I have a master plan, I was just content with the direction my life was taking. Then a series of events occurred that turned my world on it’s head in a very short 12 month period; since then numerous other circumstances have continued to thwart my life, despite my best efforts to set a course, little seems to have worked, and whilst my life isn’t ‘bad’ in any way, it’s not where I could/should/want to be, so there is a lot of resentment, bitterness, fear and anger leading to resistance to ‘what is’
I’ve just re-read Huxleys’ Island this week, a few relevant quotes:
and knowing all the time that where it’s going is where I want to go, where I have to go:
what always and everywhere has to be done by anyone who has a clear idea about what’s what.
and awareness of the not-sensation in every sensation.
to feel that nothing is quite real—including yourself?
to make the me more conscious of what the not-me is up to
you may suddenly find yourself paying attention to the not-you on the further side of consciousness
Start by being fully aware of what you think you are. It’ll help you to become aware of what you are in fact
tried to find out which of me was frightened and why she was frightened
But there’s another one who doesn’t get frightened.” “Which one is that?” “The one that doesn’t talk—just looks and listens and feels what’s going on inside
This ‘me’ and ‘not me’ is something I can vaguely feel, though not happy with where I am, it’s where I’m supposed to be, it’s somehow ‘right’ yet ‘wrong’ at the same time “ strange and inexplicable things happen in your life because it’s taking you where you need to be”. It might be where I need to be, but not where I want to be. Maybe I can see it, but resent it so refuse to accept it? Spiritual dissonance? Or just plain stubborn.
Paul.
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Re: Feeling Stuck
In *Island*, wasn't Huxley pointing directly at **this very moment**?I’ve just re-read Huxleys’ Island this week
Rather than a conceptual paradise or an ideal state, he pointed relentlessly toward seeing reality clearly—free of the habitual patterns of conditioning, free of illusions, and especially free from the belief in a separate "self."
Right now, instead of interpreting Huxley conceptually—can you directly *see* what he's indicating?
Not a future state or an exotic island—but the immediacy of **this**. What if awakening was nothing more (and nothing less) than clearly seeing what's already right here, right now?
Look—without interpretation, what is this moment lacking?
Who needs something more?
Yes—stop. Don't struggle. That's just mind trying to organize and control again.An awfully long post from you, a lot for me to take in and reply to, been struggling with what to say or where to start
Right now, forget the previous posts—forget everything I've said.
Just pause here. Nothing to figure out.
What's here if you drop all effort to "reply," "understand," or "get somewhere"?
Isn't this simplicity itself already awake—already complete?
Who is struggling, and who needs to reply?
Can you actually find that one?
with love
vince
Re: Feeling Stuck
Vince.
To me it is conceptual. I can see to what he's pointing and agree with it wholeheartedly, but I'm 'seeing' it through the eyes of Paul who only sees obstacles. Here and now is disappointing, frustrating, the future is where it's at once I've achieved xyz. The mind is always looking for distractions from the here and now, whilst writing this I've got the 3D printer running alongside me creating something I need later, the future.
Thank you for your patience :)
Paul.
"Attention, Attention" "Here and now boys, here and now"In *Island*, wasn't Huxley pointing directly at **this very moment**?
To me it is conceptual. I can see to what he's pointing and agree with it wholeheartedly, but I'm 'seeing' it through the eyes of Paul who only sees obstacles. Here and now is disappointing, frustrating, the future is where it's at once I've achieved xyz. The mind is always looking for distractions from the here and now, whilst writing this I've got the 3D printer running alongside me creating something I need later, the future.
Purpose? Meaning? Time is slipping away, need to seize the day and do something!what is this moment lacking?
Yes, the mind, or at least this mind, is controlling, planning, cajoling. Using the blue sky analogy, I see the occasional gap in the clouds, but it's quickly covered up by another 'thought'.That's just mind trying to organize and control again.
Paul is struggling, 'not Paul' is present, just a feeling, but overwhelmed by the constant 'need' to plan, plot, analyse life in the future; focussing on what is seems almost negligent when 'he' could, and should, be doing something constructive.Who is struggling, and who needs to reply?
Thank you for your patience :)
Paul.
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Re: Feeling Stuck
Hi Paul,
The here and now, as Paul sees it, is never enough. It’s a means to an end, a stepping stone to something better, something more fulfilling, something *later*.
But notice—this is just a story, isn’t it? A mental overlay placed *on top* of direct experience.
Right now, before Paul speaks, what is actually *wrong* with this moment?
Not the *story* about it. Not the commentary. But the raw, direct experience—sounds, sensations, breathing, presence.
Does that need to change? Or is it only Paul who says so?
And if Paul’s voice is just another *happening*—like the sound of the 3D printer whirring—does it need to be followed? Or can it just be noticed, like background noise, without buying into its urgency?
If nothing needs to be achieved—if no "xyz" is required—what remains?
Time slipping away—for whom? Who is running out of time? Can you find the one who needs to "seize the day," or is there just a thought *about* seizing?
Look—before Paul jumps in, before the story of "not enough" arises—was there a problem?
What if nothing needed to be seized?
What if this—just as it is—was already whole?
Right now, instead of trying to hold onto a gap—what happens if you simply let the thoughts come and go, without resisting, without controlling?
The mind plans, cajoles, strategizes—fine. Let it. But *who* is being controlled? Is there actually a separate "you" being pushed around, or is it just thought moving on its own?
Look now—without trying to stop thought, without trying to force clarity—what is already here, behind it all?
Right now—just for a moment—let everything be as it is. No resisting, no controlling, no *trying* to be present.
Paul will keep talking. Fine. Let him rant. But is he *actually* in charge, or is he just a voice, just noise appearing in awareness?
If no effort is made—if nothing needs to be planned, fixed, or changed—what remains?
with love
vince
Yes—Paul only sees obstacles. Paul only sees *lack*.here and now"
To me it is conceptual. I can see to what he's pointing and agree with it wholeheartedly, but I'm 'seeing' it through the eyes of Paul who only sees obstacles. Here and now is disappointing, frustrating, the future is where it's at once I've achieved xyz. The mind is always looking for distractions from the here and now, whilst writing this I've got the 3D printer running alongside me creating something I need later, the future.
The here and now, as Paul sees it, is never enough. It’s a means to an end, a stepping stone to something better, something more fulfilling, something *later*.
But notice—this is just a story, isn’t it? A mental overlay placed *on top* of direct experience.
Right now, before Paul speaks, what is actually *wrong* with this moment?
Not the *story* about it. Not the commentary. But the raw, direct experience—sounds, sensations, breathing, presence.
Does that need to change? Or is it only Paul who says so?
And if Paul’s voice is just another *happening*—like the sound of the 3D printer whirring—does it need to be followed? Or can it just be noticed, like background noise, without buying into its urgency?
If nothing needs to be achieved—if no "xyz" is required—what remains?
Who says this moment *needs* purpose or meaning? Isn't that just Paul again, insisting that *now* isn't enough?what is this moment lacking?
Purpose? Meaning? Time is slipping away, need to seize the day and do something!
Time slipping away—for whom? Who is running out of time? Can you find the one who needs to "seize the day," or is there just a thought *about* seizing?
Look—before Paul jumps in, before the story of "not enough" arises—was there a problem?
What if nothing needed to be seized?
What if this—just as it is—was already whole?
Yes—thought rushes in, covering the gap, filling the space. But does it actually *obscure* anything? Or is the blue sky always there, untouched, even when the clouds pass through?Yes, the mind, or at least this mind, is controlling, planning, cajoling. Using the blue sky analogy, I see the occasional gap in the clouds, but it's quickly covered up by another 'thought'.
Right now, instead of trying to hold onto a gap—what happens if you simply let the thoughts come and go, without resisting, without controlling?
The mind plans, cajoles, strategizes—fine. Let it. But *who* is being controlled? Is there actually a separate "you" being pushed around, or is it just thought moving on its own?
Look now—without trying to stop thought, without trying to force clarity—what is already here, behind it all?
Yes—Paul insists that staying with *what is* is negligent, a waste of time. He says, *"You should be doing something!"* But *who* is this "he" that should be in control? Can you actually find him?overwhelmed by the constant 'need' to plan, plot, analyse life in the future; focussing on what is seems almost negligent when 'he' could, and should, be doing something constructive.
Right now—just for a moment—let everything be as it is. No resisting, no controlling, no *trying* to be present.
Paul will keep talking. Fine. Let him rant. But is he *actually* in charge, or is he just a voice, just noise appearing in awareness?
If no effort is made—if nothing needs to be planned, fixed, or changed—what remains?
No patience needed—there’s nowhere to get to, and nothing missing. (but thanks anyway)Thank you for your patience :)
with love
vince
Re: Feeling Stuck
Crikey Vince, are on call 24/7, you replied in less than an hour!
I can sense what you're saying, where you're pointing to, it's there I know, just elusive to see, not to grasp onto it but for that 'click' of knowing.
Paul.
Everything seems to be wrong with this moment, Paul is in the wrong place, he is anxious, fed up, impatient, intolerant and lots of other negative thoughts feelings and emotions, He wants to be somewhere else.Right now, before Paul speaks, what is actually *wrong* with this moment?
The direct experience of this moment is that of discomfort, physical tension, slight ringing in ears through tinnitus, though on the plus side sun is out and relatively warm for this time of year; thoughts running away with what else I need to accomplish today.Not the *story* about it. Not the commentary. But the raw, direct experience—sounds, sensations, breathing, presence.
Paul would say yes, not paul doesn't have a voice, drowned out by Paul.Does that need to change? Or is it only Paul who says so?
Heaven on earth, not being driven to accomplish all the time, endless 'to do' lists to be fulfilled, and added to. Remove that urge and peace....If nothing needs to be achieved—if no "xyz" is required—what remains?
No, I can remember periods in my life when that was the case, brief but real, the absence of Paul allowed the experience of the here and now to be experienced, without judgement, without an agenda.Look—before Paul jumps in, before the story of "not enough" arises—was there a problem?
Thoughts are addictive, maybe a way to escape the present which is perceived as unpleasant and to be avoided.Right now, instead of trying to hold onto a gap—what happens if you simply let the thoughts come and go, without resisting, without controlling?
Judgemental is what's happening, endless thoughts comparing what is, to what could/should be, immediately followed by a plan to achieve that goal. Then daydreaming about that time in the future when all is well.Right now—just for a moment—let everything be as it is. No resisting, no controlling, no *trying* to be present.
I can sense what you're saying, where you're pointing to, it's there I know, just elusive to see, not to grasp onto it but for that 'click' of knowing.
Paul.
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Re: Feeling Stuck
Hi Paul,
Can you see that the story of it being the wrong place is what is making it the wrong place?
When you wake up the experience will be different. Not because circumstances are different but because the story will be different.
How so? Because if the circumstances promote discomfort, the focus will be within looking for what got triggered by them.
For you at the moment your focus is on the circumstances. looking outward for an explanation of the unpleasantness.
It doesn't require repeats or incessant worrying about how it will go. That is what generates the discomfort and tension.
Right now, focus on remembering that brief moment while watching the body and see if you feel different.
What happened?
with love
vince
just coincidental timing.Crikey Vince, are on call 24/7, you replied in less than an hour!
Yes, I get that. (remember it)Everything seems to be wrong with this moment, Paul is in the wrong place, he is anxious, fed up, impatient, intolerant and lots of other negative thoughts feelings and emotions, He wants to be somewhere else.
Can you see that the story of it being the wrong place is what is making it the wrong place?
When you wake up the experience will be different. Not because circumstances are different but because the story will be different.
How so? Because if the circumstances promote discomfort, the focus will be within looking for what got triggered by them.
For you at the moment your focus is on the circumstances. looking outward for an explanation of the unpleasantness.
There's nothing wrong with planning the jobs for the day, but a mental list is all that is required. Then the focus is on the actual happening in the present.thoughts running away with what else I need to accomplish today.
It doesn't require repeats or incessant worrying about how it will go. That is what generates the discomfort and tension.
Excellent. That experience was noted by the body and remains accessible.Look—before Paul jumps in, before the story of "not enough" arises—was there a problem?No, I can remember periods in my life when that was the case, brief but real, the absence of Paul allowed the experience of the here and now to be experienced, without judgement, without an agenda.
Right now, focus on remembering that brief moment while watching the body and see if you feel different.
What happened?
Excellent seeing. No "maybe". Definitely. Now don't go to a story about what is missing. Just relax into that seeing...Right now, instead of trying to hold onto a gap—what happens if you simply let the thoughts come and go, without resisting, without controlling?Thoughts are addictive, maybe a way to escape the present which is perceived as unpleasant and to be avoided.
with love
vince
Re: Feeling Stuck
Vince,
Sorry for late reply.
David Carse said something along the lines of "maybe inexplicable events happen in you life that put you where "you" need to be in the future". That certainly seems to be the case with me, not happy where I am, but sense that it is "right".
Deconstructing 'Paul' seems to be a key to me, seeing through what defines me to what's behind the facade, seperate the actor form the character, spend too much time in character.
Paul.
Sorry for late reply.
I've been doing a lot of navel gazing trying to figure things out; who am I? Take away all that defines 'Paul', his attributes, his foibles, his habits, his beliefs and what's left? Who (what) is doing this analysing?Excellent. That experience was noted by the body and remains accessible.
Right now, focus on remembering that brief moment while watching the body and see if you feel different.
What happened?
It's difficult to avoid thinking about what is missing; for example today is unusually warm and sunny which then brings on the resentment and frustration of having my plans of moving to Spain being thwarted by external events, no fault of mine.Excellent seeing. No "maybe". Definitely. Now don't go to a story about what is missing. Just relax into that seeing...
David Carse said something along the lines of "maybe inexplicable events happen in you life that put you where "you" need to be in the future". That certainly seems to be the case with me, not happy where I am, but sense that it is "right".
Deconstructing 'Paul' seems to be a key to me, seeing through what defines me to what's behind the facade, seperate the actor form the character, spend too much time in character.
Paul.
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Re: Feeling Stuck
Hi PAUL, I've been listening to Jed. The first book. Between almost 20 years since I last listened to him and that was before waking up. Now it seems really different. It all makes a lot of sense.
Look now—not conceptually, not philosophically—just look.
This analyzing, this search, this questioning—who is doing it?
Is there someone there doing the looking, or is there just looking happening?
If Paul is just a collection of thoughts, memories, and habits… Then there is nobody or no thing left - from your perspective.
No, I know that logic says that there has to be an experiencer to have an experience, and that there has to be something to be experienced, but in actual fact those only exist as a mental concept. Only the experiencing has any actual existence.
Of course, it's not enough to believe these words. This has to be experienced. Only then will you believe that all you are is experiencing happening. (remember the cup exercise?)
Let's do it with sound;
Take a chair and sit near the refrigerator. ..or the air conditioner, or a fan. Anything that puts out a constant sound.
Close your eyes and listen. Keep listening and watch thoughts that arrive.
Do this only for a few minutes then ignore thoughts by focussing on the sound.
Keep attention on the sound until you start to feel the sound in the body.
Invite the sound into the body. Feel the body synchronise with the sound.
When this is established, mentally ask "who is hearing the sound?" at the same time watching what happens to the relationship between the sound and the body (hearing)
Can you continue to hear when asking "who is hearing" or "what is being heard"?
What characteristics would you like the new character to exhibit?
much love
vince
Yes—strip away Paul’s attributes, habits, beliefs, and what’s left?I've been doing a lot of navel gazing trying to figure things out; who am I? Take away all that defines 'Paul', his attributes, his foibles, his habits, his beliefs and what's left? Who (what) is doing this analysing?
Look now—not conceptually, not philosophically—just look.
This analyzing, this search, this questioning—who is doing it?
Is there someone there doing the looking, or is there just looking happening?
If Paul is just a collection of thoughts, memories, and habits… Then there is nobody or no thing left - from your perspective.
No, I know that logic says that there has to be an experiencer to have an experience, and that there has to be something to be experienced, but in actual fact those only exist as a mental concept. Only the experiencing has any actual existence.
Of course, it's not enough to believe these words. This has to be experienced. Only then will you believe that all you are is experiencing happening. (remember the cup exercise?)
Let's do it with sound;
Take a chair and sit near the refrigerator. ..or the air conditioner, or a fan. Anything that puts out a constant sound.
Close your eyes and listen. Keep listening and watch thoughts that arrive.
Do this only for a few minutes then ignore thoughts by focussing on the sound.
Keep attention on the sound until you start to feel the sound in the body.
Invite the sound into the body. Feel the body synchronise with the sound.
When this is established, mentally ask "who is hearing the sound?" at the same time watching what happens to the relationship between the sound and the body (hearing)
Can you continue to hear when asking "who is hearing" or "what is being heard"?
Of course, we can't control what thoughts arrive, but it seems we can develop a skill in simply pushing them away without engaging in their content.It's difficult to avoid thinking about...(anything)
There is great freedom in trusting your intuition.That certainly seems to be the case with me, not happy where I am, but sense that it is "right".
You almost have it... There is only the character. Not someone playing the character. So let's rewrite the script and play a better character. It's not possible to be a non-character.Deconstructing 'Paul' seems to be a key to me, seeing through what defines me to what's behind the facade, seperate the actor form the character, spend too much time in character.
What characteristics would you like the new character to exhibit?
much love
vince
Re: Feeling Stuck
Vince,
With eyes closed other senses heightened, feel bum on chair, elbows on table, chin resting in hands.
Eyes closed = darkness, analyse that... Great observational skills, completely useless to me in this context!
Paul.
When I first read Jed back in 2019, there was something in his words that made me know that this was the real deal, unlike other authors whose words rang true, but not quite....? This guy knew what he was talking about, the price he put on it though scared me.I've been listening to Jed. The first book. Between almost 20 years since I last listened to him and that was before waking up. Now it seems really different. It all makes a lot of sense.
Eyes closed listening to 3D printer clattering away alongside of me, natural instinct is to analyse the sound, what is it? Does it sound right? Is that rattle normal?Take a chair and sit near the refrigerator. ..or the air conditioner, or a fan. Anything that puts out a constant sound.
Close your eyes and listen. Keep listening and watch thoughts that arrive.
With eyes closed other senses heightened, feel bum on chair, elbows on table, chin resting in hands.
Eyes closed = darkness, analyse that... Great observational skills, completely useless to me in this context!
Seems to be a skill I lack, at least when Paul is around.Of course, we can't control what thoughts arrive, but it seems we can develop a skill in simply pushing them away without engaging in their content.
That sounds like a trick question! Do I have a choice? I didn't choose this character I currently play, it seems to have evolved of it's own accord, I can make an effort to change, but whether or not this succeeds seems to be outside of my control.What characteristics would you like the new character to exhibit?
Paul.
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Re: Feeling Stuck
Hi Paul,
Do it again now and report fairly quickly while it's still fresh…
I'm not meaning to hook you back into the illusion of Control. Without doubt this ignoring of certain thoughts already happens so the skill will develop by noticing those times. It's a bit of a trick because we're asking you to notice when you don't notice something that happens. By employing memory you are able to recognise that it happens.
So, watch your mind for the next couple of minutes and notice thoughts that seem to have no impact, thoughts that seem irrelevant and get dismissed. Then apply the same thing to a thought that might or might not be relevant even if you push it away with another thought that says you'll attend to it later.
Have another go at developing that fantasy.
with love
vince
yes, I get that. As I'm listening to him, I'm realising that I'm not fully awakened or enlightened. If I need a description I might more Fit his description of being an adult human. As I go down this path I realise that there are "progressions". The main criteria I've used for this is the recognition that I still hold some things as important. And then there is of course that I still get triggered from time to time. So, I wouldn't worry about his "paying the ultimate price" statement.the price he put on it though scared me.
did you do this part?Do this only for a few minutes then ignore thoughts by focussing on the sound.
Keep attention on the sound until you start to feel the sound in the body.
Invite the sound into the body. Feel the body synchronise with the sound.
When this is established, mentally ask "who is hearing the sound?" at the same time watching what happens to the relationship between the sound and the body (hearing)
Can you continue to hear when asking "who is hearing" or "what is being heard"?
Do it again now and report fairly quickly while it's still fresh…
Does that mean you're not interested in developing that skill?Of course, we can't control what thoughts arrive, but it seems we can develop a skill in simply pushing them away without engaging in their content.Seems to be a skill I lack, at least when Paul is around.
I'm not meaning to hook you back into the illusion of Control. Without doubt this ignoring of certain thoughts already happens so the skill will develop by noticing those times. It's a bit of a trick because we're asking you to notice when you don't notice something that happens. By employing memory you are able to recognise that it happens.
So, watch your mind for the next couple of minutes and notice thoughts that seem to have no impact, thoughts that seem irrelevant and get dismissed. Then apply the same thing to a thought that might or might not be relevant even if you push it away with another thought that says you'll attend to it later.
no, it's not a trick question. no, it's not a trick question, did you notice that you avoided answering the question. I asked you to produce a fantasy and you gave me a whole lot of reasons why that fantasy might not come true.What characteristics would you like the new character to exhibit?That sounds like a trick question!
Have another go at developing that fantasy.
with love
vince
Re: Feeling Stuck
Vince,
Sitting alongside printer whirring away, eyes closed to aid concentration. At first just noise, but soon can distinguish between the different types of sound.
Question arises, there must be a listener otherwise there would be no sound (if a tree falls down in a forest and there’s no-one there does it make a sound?).
Who poses this question and who answers it?
The external sound is real, the internal ‘sound’ of thoughts isn’t, but is given credibility by ‘me’.
After about 10 minutes a sort of pleasant trance is experienced, very pleasant.
Opening eyes is a shock to system, visual overload, thoughts rushing in, quickly close eyes again. Interesting.
Paul.
I did do it correctly last time and wrote the answer immediately.did you do this part?
Do it again now and report fairly quickly while it's still fresh…
Sitting alongside printer whirring away, eyes closed to aid concentration. At first just noise, but soon can distinguish between the different types of sound.
Question arises, there must be a listener otherwise there would be no sound (if a tree falls down in a forest and there’s no-one there does it make a sound?).
Who poses this question and who answers it?
The external sound is real, the internal ‘sound’ of thoughts isn’t, but is given credibility by ‘me’.
After about 10 minutes a sort of pleasant trance is experienced, very pleasant.
Opening eyes is a shock to system, visual overload, thoughts rushing in, quickly close eyes again. Interesting.
The majority of thoughts throughout the day are relevant to current circumstances, lot of things going on in life that require forward planning; occasionally get caught up in ruminating over past events, or possible future scenarios and things over which there is no control; futile but difficult to break.So, watch your mind for the next couple of minutes and notice thoughts that seem to have no impact, thoughts that seem irrelevant and get dismissed. Then apply the same thing to a thought that might or might not be relevant even if you push it away with another thought that says you'll attend to it later.
It's not so much about creating new characteristics, more of being able to drop the facade of the false, more like a step backward, dismantle this personality to reveal the true nature behind it: "what was your face before you were born", before being labelled as 'Paul' and adopting all the traits ascribed to him, and to which he clings.What characteristics would you like the new character to exhibit?
That sounds like a trick question!
no, it's not a trick question. no, it's not a trick question, did you notice that you avoided answering the question
Paul.
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Re: Feeling Stuck
Hi Paul,
Did you stop hearing while you were engaged in the conceptual world (of thought)?
Can you find thoughts that seem to be irrelevant? What happens to them? - Look for the answer to this in experience.
By creating this fantasy you are altering expectations. Play along with me on this.
with love
vince
No you didn't. What happened when you were immersed in the sound and you asked "Who poses this question and who answers it?"I did do it correctly last time and wrote the answer immediately.
Did you stop hearing while you were engaged in the conceptual world (of thought)?
I get what you are saying, BUT.. the external, so-called "real" sound is generated by your brain. If you are hearing an internal sound it happens exactly the same. All you are referring to is the apparent origin of the stimulus that eventually causes the brain to give you an experience of sound.The external sound is real, the internal ‘sound’ of thoughts isn’t
Is this credibility another way of saying that you have a story or one that you believe and a story of the other that is different?is given credibility by ‘me’.
The majority of thoughts that you are aware of seem to be linked to those circumstances.The majority of thoughts throughout the day are relevant to current circumstances,
Can you find thoughts that seem to be irrelevant? What happens to them? - Look for the answer to this in experience.
How many times do these thoughts repeat?lot of things going on in life that require forward planning;
This one is important. Don't try to break that habit. Simply be aware that it is happening. Don't judge it. (and don't judge the judgement if that happens)futile but difficult to break.
Ok, how's this working out for you?It's not so much about creating new characteristics, more of being able to drop the facade of the false, more like a step backward, dismantle this personality to reveal the true nature behind it:
By creating this fantasy you are altering expectations. Play along with me on this.
with love
vince
Re: Feeling Stuck
Morning Vince,
Think it’s time for me to recap where I am and where I’m going (I think…).
I don’t view this process as spiritual, or about enlightenment, or truth realisation, Liberation is how I would describe it, as in liberation from incessant domineering thoughts that seem to define me. Whilst living on my own for 20 years, I was largely able to insulate myself from the madness of the external world, now though being in the middle of a large extended family that is no longer possible, plus the disappointments of the last decade have led me to living in my head, ‘reality’ is frustrating and bitter sweet, thoughts are an attractive distraction, but at the same time stressful. Having experienced brief periods of ‘no self’ or that lack of ‘Paul’ interfering, I know the truth is out there, or in here?
I mentioned on Zoom that experience I had one morning, similar events have occurred more recently; a couple of weeks ago I was idly flicking through TV channels when I came across a film I hadn’t seen, can’t remember but it was a Harry Potter prequel, when I tuned in there were two wizards having a pitch battle on the streets of 30’s America, blasting each other with their wands, I sat watching entranced and entertained, not having seen the film I had no idea of the plot or the characters, but after a few minutes I twigged who the ‘bad’ wizard was and who the ‘good’ wizard was. From that moment my whole demeanour changed, suddenly I was rooting for the good guy, and getting angry at the bad guy, pretty good metaphor as to how I view the world in general.
Bibliomancy? One morning this week I woke up feeling pretty p****d off with life and the world in general, sat down to continue reading the book On Having No Head by D. E. Harding, the first page I read these words jumped off the page:
After all, one’s initial in-seeing - no matter how “brief” and “shallow”
It was the essential quantum leap from the fiction of egocentricity to the fact of zerocentricity.
is always demonstrating that the gaining of our separate and personal goals yields only the briefest
satisfaction, and after that delusion and boredom, if not disgust:
how severely our desires darkened and distorted and hid what there was to see,
It’s these bread crumbs that keep me going despite my frustration and lack of progress.
Paul.
Think it’s time for me to recap where I am and where I’m going (I think…).
I don’t view this process as spiritual, or about enlightenment, or truth realisation, Liberation is how I would describe it, as in liberation from incessant domineering thoughts that seem to define me. Whilst living on my own for 20 years, I was largely able to insulate myself from the madness of the external world, now though being in the middle of a large extended family that is no longer possible, plus the disappointments of the last decade have led me to living in my head, ‘reality’ is frustrating and bitter sweet, thoughts are an attractive distraction, but at the same time stressful. Having experienced brief periods of ‘no self’ or that lack of ‘Paul’ interfering, I know the truth is out there, or in here?
I mentioned on Zoom that experience I had one morning, similar events have occurred more recently; a couple of weeks ago I was idly flicking through TV channels when I came across a film I hadn’t seen, can’t remember but it was a Harry Potter prequel, when I tuned in there were two wizards having a pitch battle on the streets of 30’s America, blasting each other with their wands, I sat watching entranced and entertained, not having seen the film I had no idea of the plot or the characters, but after a few minutes I twigged who the ‘bad’ wizard was and who the ‘good’ wizard was. From that moment my whole demeanour changed, suddenly I was rooting for the good guy, and getting angry at the bad guy, pretty good metaphor as to how I view the world in general.
Bibliomancy? One morning this week I woke up feeling pretty p****d off with life and the world in general, sat down to continue reading the book On Having No Head by D. E. Harding, the first page I read these words jumped off the page:
After all, one’s initial in-seeing - no matter how “brief” and “shallow”
It was the essential quantum leap from the fiction of egocentricity to the fact of zerocentricity.
is always demonstrating that the gaining of our separate and personal goals yields only the briefest
satisfaction, and after that delusion and boredom, if not disgust:
how severely our desires darkened and distorted and hid what there was to see,
It’s these bread crumbs that keep me going despite my frustration and lack of progress.
Lead on!Play along with me on this.
Paul.
- vinceschubert
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Re: Feeling Stuck
Hi Paul,
Yes—**liberation.** Not from life, not into some mystical state, but from the tyranny of **Paul’s** relentless narration.
But here’s the thing—liberation isn’t something to *attain* later. It’s the simple recognition that **you were never actually bound.**
Right now, are thoughts actually *domineering*—or do they just **appear** and then claim ownership?
If a thought says, *"I am Paul, I am thinking, I am in control,"*—is that anything more than just another passing sound?
Look now: when a thought arises, does it **belong** to anyone? Or is it just happening, like wind moving through an open space?
What if there was never anything to be free *from*?
Who told you this was a journey with steps and milestones? Wasn’t that just another thought, another story?
Right now—without referring to memory, without consulting Paul—**what is lacking?**
If you don’t measure, compare, or expect anything else… is there actually a problem? Or is there just this—**already here, already free, already whole**?
Now, don't keep it in your head. The value here is to notice the feelings that you avoid by getting into a conceptual world. (in your mind)
The reason that you rooted for the "good guy" is because of how you see yourself. (identification) - Now, wait a minute. Don't think about it. Use memory and replay it from before you worked out who was the goody and who was the baddy. Then notice the feeling or watch it again and intentionally root for the bad guy while watching your body for sensations.
vince
I agree entirely. i see it as removing the conditioned corruption that keeps a spontaneous, authentic human from experiencing what is actual (instead of experiencing the content of conceptual thinking)I don’t view this process as spiritual, or about enlightenment, or truth realisation, Liberation is how I would describe it, as in liberation from incessant domineering thoughts that seem to define me.
Yes—**liberation.** Not from life, not into some mystical state, but from the tyranny of **Paul’s** relentless narration.
But here’s the thing—liberation isn’t something to *attain* later. It’s the simple recognition that **you were never actually bound.**
Right now, are thoughts actually *domineering*—or do they just **appear** and then claim ownership?
If a thought says, *"I am Paul, I am thinking, I am in control,"*—is that anything more than just another passing sound?
Look now: when a thought arises, does it **belong** to anyone? Or is it just happening, like wind moving through an open space?
What if there was never anything to be free *from*?
Frustration about *what*, exactly? Lack of *progress* toward *where*?despite my frustration and lack of progress.
Who told you this was a journey with steps and milestones? Wasn’t that just another thought, another story?
Right now—without referring to memory, without consulting Paul—**what is lacking?**
If you don’t measure, compare, or expect anything else… is there actually a problem? Or is there just this—**already here, already free, already whole**?
Do you recognise the implication of what you saw?I sat watching entranced and entertained, not having seen the film I had no idea of the plot or the characters, but after a few minutes I twigged who the ‘bad’ wizard was and who the ‘good’ wizard was. From that moment my whole demeanour changed, suddenly I was rooting for the good guy, and getting angry at the bad guy, pretty good metaphor as to how I view the world in general.
Now, don't keep it in your head. The value here is to notice the feelings that you avoid by getting into a conceptual world. (in your mind)
The reason that you rooted for the "good guy" is because of how you see yourself. (identification) - Now, wait a minute. Don't think about it. Use memory and replay it from before you worked out who was the goody and who was the baddy. Then notice the feeling or watch it again and intentionally root for the bad guy while watching your body for sensations.
vince
Re: Feeling Stuck
Hi Vince,
didn't realise it was so long since I replied, lot of things going on in my life at the moment keeping mind preoccupied, and stressed out.
Today I've had a brief conversation with that ChatGPT link you recently sent, despite my skepticism I found it surprisingly helpful; annoying and persistent yes, but that's what I need! However I would like to continue on here if that's ok with you?
Paul.
didn't realise it was so long since I replied, lot of things going on in my life at the moment keeping mind preoccupied, and stressed out.
Liberation from Pauls' incessant critique of the world and people around him. I recently came across the philosophical question "If you had an unlimited amount of money, had already travelled the world and had no fear, what would you do with your life?". Though I've read this before, previously I couldn't answer it, this time I immediately came up with the answer "Buy myself an Island in the Caribbean!" Live my life in relative isolation with no distractions from the outside world, or the people in it, and pleasant weather for most of the year, barring the odd typhoon or hurricane..... :) Whilst it's probably the right answer for me, it will never happen of course, plus it probably reveals a hidden agenda, that of creating my own personal nirvana outside of reality. (Deep sigh)Yes—**liberation.** Not from life, not into some mystical state, but from the tyranny of **Paul’s** relentless narration.
Because of my disappointment with reality, thoughts are trying to create my reality, maybe a substitute for real reality, create an alternative, a virtual world where I 'will' be happy?Right now, are thoughts actually *domineering*—or do they just **appear** and then claim ownership?
Because it is in 'my' head it seems real, it's 'my' thought, I created it so it must be real, I must take ownership of it.If a thought says, *"I am Paul, I am thinking, I am in control,"*—is that anything more than just another passing sound?
Thoughts are like a limitation, a restriction they tend to dominate the waking mind and need constant attention. The train station analogy of standing on the platform and not boarding any passing thought train seems to be impossible, it's more like being swept off the platform into the train.What if there was never anything to be free *from*?
It's the sense of impending failure, fail to grasp what is blindingly obvious to some people, what is 'easy' and right in front of my nose, eyes or whatever.Frustration about *what*, exactly? Lack of *progress* toward *where*?
Who told you this was a journey with steps and milestones? Wasn’t that just another thought, another story?
Right now—without referring to memory, without consulting Paul—**what is lacking?**
I don't feel free or whole, chained by thoughts and the limitations of Paul and his habitual (unhealthy) thought patterns.If you don’t measure, compare, or expect anything else… is there actually a problem? Or is there just this—**already here, already free, already whole**?
Yes! If I ruled the world it would be a 'better' place, by my definition at least.The reason that you rooted for the "good guy" is because of how you see yourself. (identification)
As I've now seen it once, my mind is set in it's way, so wouldn't work for me, yet again I've had that fleeting taste what it feels like to be free of Pauls' constant narrative of how the world should be.Then notice the feeling or watch it again and intentionally root for the bad guy while watching your body for sensations.
Today I've had a brief conversation with that ChatGPT link you recently sent, despite my skepticism I found it surprisingly helpful; annoying and persistent yes, but that's what I need! However I would like to continue on here if that's ok with you?
Paul.
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