Where am I?

[graceabounds]

Yes. That’s it.

Nothing missing. Nothing wrong. Just this.

Now, without adding anything, without reaching for a conclusion—just stay here. Not as a practice, not as a technique—just this, as it is.

Is there any need for a next step? Or is the idea of a next step just another movement of mind?

[You]

I read until the third line, stayed there and observed. I had the last line of your message covered up and hadn’t read the two questions yet. There was actually no real need for a next step present in mind. Only one short flash came up in the background about continuing the fetter work, and yes: that was just another movement of mind, a thought.

[graceabounds]

Lovely. So let’s give it a couple days… out in life. See what is present and if anything emerges to be explored.

[You]

Thank you for your wonderful guidance to this point. I’ll be in touch.
🤍🙏

[You]

Hello Becca,

It´s time for an update.

… Struggling for words … Started a sentence several times, all words seem unfit; incomplete and at the same time too defining… There had been some “planning” going on in the mind (more about that later) about what to write here, and now it´s all gone. … 20 minutes have passed since I started writing this message…. Ok. I´ll try. Please read beyond/behind/between the words.

These last few days there has been an almost constant stream of looking/being conscious. Either knowing/seeing that there is no “I”, or inquiring if there is one; not forgetting anymore as it had been the weekend before the last one when I tried to just marinate in direct experience. Many (most?) thoughts were seen as just arising out of causes and conditions. Discovery: It´s when the cause/trigger of a thought is not immediately seen, that this thought gets automatically attributed to an “I”. Especially thoughts about what “I” would DO later - among other things, what I would report or ask here - had that kind of hook these days. But ever since friday an emergency brake has been active that stops those thoughts from spiralling into full blown I-illusion/identification: a question pops up, like for example “Can it be seen that also this just arose out of causes and conditions?” and either it becomes obvious directly, or a further inquiry is sparked like, for example:
- This thought is fed by the idea that I could do something wrong here.
- But wait: Is there an I, anyway? Stay here! Look!

There was also an emotional/behavioral pattern present that has its roots in adolescence. Same as those thoughts that get attributed to an “I” when their actual causes are not seen, this emotional pattern also has/had a hook into feeling like “I”. Dealing with that has not been as “easy” as this almost automated unhooking of thoughts. There were several “sessions” of struggling with it; too much trying to force a change/shift, but yesterday evening, a more gentle way to meet it happened.

I guess the biggest revelation of these past few days was to notice that these moments of identification or contraction and even longer stretches of struggles did NOT mean that everything (the seeing/experiencing that there is no “I” in the center, and the ability to be really present in direct experience) was lost again permanently. It always came back.

Some other points from notes taken these days:

- Seeing familiar things suddenly as if they weren’t familiar
- At times the feeling as having landed in the life of someone else
- Understanding: It’s not about a positive or even blissful state. It’s about seeing in every state that thoughts are just arising, that they are not “mine” and that there is no “I” running the show, or struggling, or having successes and failures; not even writing this, writing just happens, and also these thoughts just arose out of causes and conditions.
- An action happened almost effortlessly, one that I had been putting off for some weeks now out of fear/shame/hiding.
- More of this spontaneity and openness in communication/interactions I had already mentioned before
- Often a sensation of pressure inside the head
- Lots and lots of this heart pounding. At some point I even measured my resting heart rate to check if everything was fine. Result: it’s in the normal range. It’s just the intensity that is so much stronger…
- Short scrolls through YouTube. No single video watched. Reaction to even the most interesting titles: nope, not necessary. There is SO much to see and explore RIGHT HERE, that’s more than enough! The recommendation page almost looks like someone else’s.
- Like silence after the storm, or like time having stopped, or at least like a train having stopped
- Understanding: The importance of recognizing that something is ‘just a thought’ is not primarily in taking into account that it could be untrue or is irrelevant, but that it - even if it may seem like it - can not be taken as an indicator that there is an inherent self after all.
- Often drawn to being alone and just sit or walk in presence

So, that’s my status report so far. If you want me to clarify/elaborate on something or dig/look deeper into something, I’m ready.

🤍

[graceabounds]

Beautiful update.

Discovery: It´s when the cause/trigger of a thought is not immediately seen, that this thought gets automatically attributed to an “I”.

Great noticing. That’s the mechanism of selfing, right there. The “I” is just an assumption filling in gaps where clarity hasn’t landed yet. And you’re catching it in real time and it is being seen through in an organic way. Perfect.

Especially thoughts about what “I” would DO later - among other things, what I would report or ask here - had that kind of hook these days. But ever since friday an emergency brake has been active that stops those thoughts from spiralling into full blown I-illusion/identification

You saw how thoughts about what “you” will do later pull identification in. Is there ever a real decider? Can you catch the moment when a decision actually happens? Or does the thought “I will do this” just appear, already fully formed?

There was also an emotional/behavioral pattern present that has its roots in adolescence. Same as those thoughts that get attributed to an “I” when their actual causes are not seen, this emotional pattern also has/had a hook into feeling like “I”. Dealing with that has not been as “easy” as this almost automated unhooking of thoughts. There were several “sessions” of struggling with it; too much trying to force a change/shift, but yesterday evening, a more gentle way to meet it happened.

Sounds like this resolved itself gracefully but for the next time: Can you sit with these emotions the way you do thoughts? Instead of trying to shift them, just let them be what they are, without the story, without the ownership?

Often a sensation of pressure inside the head

Very common. At the end of the day we are turning ‘your’ world upside down.

Short scrolls through YouTube. No single video watched. Reaction to even the most interesting titles: nope, not necessary. There is SO much to see and explore RIGHT HERE, that’s more than enough! The recommendation page almost looks like someone else’s

Yes!
Would you say there is still seeking or has that subsided?

Like silence after the storm, or like time having stopped, or at least like a train having stopped

We haven’t inquired into time directly so here are two inquiries to deepen into this experiencing:
Does time actually exist outside of thought? Is there ever anything other than this immediate happening?

I guess the biggest revelation of these past few days was to notice that these moments of identification or contraction and even longer stretches of struggles did NOT mean that everything (the seeing/experiencing that there is no “I” in the center, and the ability to be really present in direct experience) was lost again permanently. It always came back.

Excellent. You have the tools, and are using them. Stay with what’s raw and direct. Keep looking at where the “I” wants to sneak back in. You’re already seeing that awakening isn’t about bliss or special states—it’s just about seeing clearly.

[You]

Can you sit with these emotions the way you do thoughts? Instead of trying to shift them, just let them be what they are, without the story, without the ownership?

That´s exactly what happened yesterday evening :) They showed up while I was sitting in presence and for the first time I was able to just let them be there and observe how the sensations moved and changed in the body, without scaring them away by trying to grasp them or do something with them.

You saw how thoughts about what “you” will do later pull identification in. Is there ever a real decider?

No, because the decision is also just the result of causes and conditions…

Can you catch the moment when a decision actually happens?

No, actually not… The type of thoughts that ordinarily are called “decisions” are just that: a floating thought, a fantasy… But in the Now, in direct experience, where I expected to find a decision, there is just a gap between one thing and the next… Or the beginning of the next action…
Just yesterday, when I returned home after a walk, I had absolutely NO idea what I would do next. Normally I would have had my head full of things I want/ need/should/have to do, but this time there was only a completely blank “let´s see what happens” state. In the house, the thought of an email I had received popped up, and next “grabbing laptop” and “answering email” happened. I can find no decision taken by an “I” in the memory of this sequence.
And, something from yesterday´s notes, regarding future decisions: “Also, the question of what I should do becomes irrelevant… Eventually there will be an observation of an action happening, that’s all.“

Or does the thought “I will do this” just appear, already fully formed?

I´m not sure if I understand that question right… But, regarding the thoughts I mentioned in my last post, the ones about what “I” would do later: Those were more about the supposed doer, not the supposed decider…

Would you say there is still seeking or has that subsided?

What I did do with some of the videos, was put them on the “watch later” list. So there was (is?) still this notion that they could be useful in some future [strange… writing that now feels somehow absurd - my mind is already going to your questions about time], but in that moment and for that moment, there was no seeking energy, and right now there isn´t either.

Does time actually exist outside of thought?

I don´t know… What I know is this: I can only ever experience the present moment. And every thought about the “future” or the “past” is also just a mental experience happening right now, in the present moment.

Is there ever anything other than this immediate happening?

No.

Wow. When I wrote the note “like time having stopped, or at least like a train having stopped” what had happened between these two analogies was one more thought: “That sounds too radical, since time cannot stop”. But an illusion CAN stop. So this feeling of time (= the illusion of time) stopping was maybe much more true than I allowed myself to admit… It was no analogy, no feeling as if, it was an experience!!!

[graceabounds]

Hello 'You' :)

You're describing action happening without an agent, decisions appearing without a decider, life unfolding without interference. The 'self' that was supposedly orchestrating all of this--does it even make sense anymore?

And time stopping--what is that if not the absence of projection? No future to move toward, no past to reference, just THIS. Not as an idea, not as a philosophy, but as what's undeniably happening.

At this point I'd like to give you some checkpoint questions to work with. Their purpose is to excavate anything that may have been missed in our conversation thus far, and I may also share your responses with my community of guides for further opportunities to clarify or deepen.

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before we started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over; made you look? Was there a moment of shift with a distinct before and after?

5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. Consider and describe each if these separately.

6) What makes things happen? How does it work?

7) What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.

8) Anything to add?

In gratitude,
Becca

[You]

Dear Becca :)

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

No. There is just experiencing, facilitated by the senses and the mind. Thoughts are sparked by sensory input and by other thoughts; they always arise out of causes and conditions.

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

The illusion of separate self is the identification with parts out of the whole of experience.

For example: an arising thought is actually just an experienced phenomenon in the same way as a sound or a sight. When this is not seen and there is a division made, there is the illusion of separate self.

Experiencing without a division, and hence without the illusion of a separate self, happens:

A: in a more meditative state, focusing completely on direct experience, when everything just arises and passes away, not only the thoughts, but also sound, form/colour etc.
B: in a more relative setting while interacting with the ‘world’, where the cause of a sound is relevant (car approaching from behind etc.), when not only the causes of the sensory input are seen, but also the causes of thoughts and feelings.

The illusion of separate self kicks in when A and B are mixed; when moving in the relative world and attributing input to its causes while not seeing the cause of a thought or emotion. Then the thought or emotion gets automatically attributed to an “I” and the illusion “I thought that / I believe that / I have that emotional need” etc. starts.

When through inquiry it is seen that also these thoughts and emotions have arisen only out of causes and conditions, it becomes clear that the supposed agent behind them, the separate self, was always an illusion; that there was never a “manager” or “thinker” in the center.

3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before we started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

It feels mind blowing, freeing, at times also scary.

It´s a change in perspective. It feels like a shift from “small little me confused in a big world” to “the world in experience” (meaning: with mental events also being part of the world).

One example: I mentioned scrolling through YouTube and not watching anything. There was more to that than simply the lack of necessity for more pointers/information. It has to do with this shift in perspective: It´s difficult to describe, but the thing is, it feels as if behind these thumbnails and titles there are no videos. Of course I still know that on a relative level they are there, produced and uploaded and accessible, but the perspective has changed; I’m seeing from the perspective that the only reality I will ever have access to is experience, and so it feels like unless I click on them and watch them, THEY DON´T EXIST! In other words: There is only emptiness behind the thumbnails and behind the whole page when I look at it.

For other examples about the past few days, would it be ok to reference my last two posts?

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over; made you look? Was there a moment of shift with a distinct before and after?

There were several shifts, both before and after what was probably the decisive one, with some of them happening quite unexpectedly and surprisingly fast. In retrospect I would say that the decisive shift was sparked on Thursday 20th by the question “Look now—right now—what is missing?” and the answer to it, and was further reinforced by the line of questioning the next day that started with “Is there I?”

5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. Consider and describe each of these separately.

Decision: What is normally called a decision is just adopting a thought; starting to believe one fantasy about the future instead of another. The real decisive moment that defines which way is actually taken is a gap between one action and the other, or even already the beginning of the next action itself; anyway, it’s ungraspable.

Intention: the mutual reinforcement of several believed thoughts and motivations that point into the same direction.

Free will: an illusion. Everything happens out of causes and conditions. So even if it seems as if I had done something out of free will, this volition was conditioned.

Choice: an illusion, too.

Control: “I” can have no control, because it is an illusion. Certain thoughts can get the upper hand over other thoughts and in this sense, take control, and in the end, it’s also just a play of causes and conditions.

6) What makes things happen? How does it work?

The thoughts/emotions that have the biggest mutual reinforcement spark the action.

I’ll give an example of an observation. It happened after the decisive shift and I observed the following unfolding in real time:

Context: “I” had been putting off an action for some weeks, and in order to finally do it, first I had to come out of hiding and communicate this intent to someone specific.

What happened:
1. a sudden impulse to just say it, but shame+fear suppressing it before it could leave the mouth
2. a “fraction” in the mind system being discontent with this, bringing up thoughts about the importance of this action, reinforcing again the motivation to soon say it.

Not long ago, I would have identified with one of these both forces - normally with the one that wanted to do the action - and then beaten myself up about having failed again.
Now it was just obvious that in the whole mind system there was not yet enough volition built up at this moment for the communication to happen, and that it would build up over time and how it was already building up right now through the reaction of this “fraction” named under 2.

The next day, it had come to this point, the communication happened and two days later, the action was taken.

7) What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.

To say here “There is no I, it’s all causes and conditions, so there is no responsibility for anything” would be bypassing something important:
Even if there is no separate self, it is THIS mind/brain here through which consciousness has the only access to this body. No other mind can perceive this body and its signals from the inside. So there is the responsibility to take care of the piece of the world which is this body+mind here.
There is also the responsibility to not cause harm with this body+mind to other body
+minds, and even if there is no “I” that could have complete control that this won’t happen, it should be possible to hold this ideal dear in the mind together with the intention to reinforce itself, in the hope that this will lead to actions that are in line with this sense of responsibility.

8) Anything to add?

A thought has been present yesterday and today:
What’s happening here is not you waking me up, it’s consciousness waking itself up in another part of the world.

With love and so much gratitude for your clear and gentle guidance.
🤍

[graceabounds]

Lovely, very clear and precise answers with grounding in direct experience.

I have shared this with the other guides.

Guide M asks:
This final remark under "Anything to add":

Where exactly is this "other part of the world" that consciousness is waking up in? Is there a boundary somewhere? A line dividing one "part" from another?

Was consciousness asleep then? Who was there to know that?

[graceabounds]

Here’s another 🤍

Guide E asks:

You say, “Everything happens out of causes and conditions.”

Can you directly find these causes, say causes giving rise to a particular thought? Or is the idea of causality itself another thought, at best a helpful "pragmatic model", whereas what really makes things unfold or be is a mystery?

[You]

Where exactly is this "other part of the world" that consciousness is waking up in? Is there a boundary somewhere? A line dividing one "part" from another? Was consciousness asleep then? Who was there to know that?

What I mean by ‘other part of the world’ is this mind here. It’s exactly that there is no boundary. I know that when this thought appeared it was not grounded in direct experience. It was caused mostly by teachings I have heard from Rupert Spira - which is the reason why at the moment I don’t find an answer from direct experience to the last two questions.

But there was a direct experience connected with the thought after it appeared:

In the last days I had observed several times the mechanism of selfing (this sticky identification when the causes of a thought or emotion is not yet seen and it feels as if the thought or emotion represents ‘me’ / is ‘me’) and the freeing effect of seeing the cause when inquiring into it.

The day before yesterday there was a fear of loneliness and a grasping connected to the thought that this conversation could maybe end soon. Then this thought “It’s not ‘you’ waking ‘me’ up, it’s consciousness waking itself up” arose. It had this exact same freeing effect, and this feeling of separation and fear of loss dissolved completely.

You say, “Everything happens out of causes and conditions.”

Can you directly find these causes, say causes giving rise to a particular thought? Or is the idea of causality itself another thought, at best a helpful "pragmatic model", whereas what really makes things unfold or be is a mystery?

Yes, I can normally find the causes that give rise to a particular thought. It’s not just an abstract idea.

[graceabounds]

Then this thought “It’s not ‘you’ waking ‘me’ up, it’s consciousness waking itself up” arose. It had this exact same freeing effect, and this feeling of separation and fear of loss dissolved completely.

Was it the thought that dissolved the fear, or was it simply that the illusion of separation wasn’t being believed in that moment?

[You]

The thought was a spark that helped to see through the illusion of separation and not believe in it anymore.

[graceabounds]

Yes the thought was just a spark. The thought itself didn’t do anything—rather, it pointed to what was already true. The fear only existed because the illusion of separation was being taken as real. When that belief wasn’t upheld, the fear had nowhere to stand.

Now, look again—right now. Is there anything maintaining the illusion? Or is there just raw experience, unfiltered by the idea of “you”?

In other words, if another thought had appeared instead, would separation have remained? Or is it that separation was never real to begin with?