Take 2 new guide needed please

[Stacyg888]

Oops. I clearly misunderstood the word "autonomous". There is no autonomous self in the flow, just what is.

[CarefulDog88]

Hi Stacy,

That has helped me accept whats happening a lot, even though I don't fully understand all this yet.

Thank you for sharing this.
Could anything be different to what actually is?

Logically, that must mean I am awareness. I sat with that for a while and it seemed like the only obvious answer but this morning I'm not so sure again. Doubt is just a thought though.

Let’s have a look, can you find a separate autonomous awareness ?

Are you truly awareness?

Do experiences truly arise in awareness in a literal sense?

Anything That cannot be seen, heard, touched, smelled or tasted is simply a thought, a mental concept.

Start with trying to find awareness. This bword is used for all kinds of context. “Cup” is the name of a vessel you drink out of.

What sensory experience is awareness the name for?

where in this sensory experience, is the information that this is you?

Hold what you call awareness, in your experience and listen to the sounds that are present. When the sound seems to arise in awareness there should now be two entities.

awareness and sound are there two things?

Where does the sound end and the awareness of it start?

What is the boundary between the sound and awareness made of?

Can the point in time be found at which the sound crosses the border from being unknown to being known?

Does it feel like it is awareness that knows the sound?

at which exact moment does the sound become known to awareness?

What exactly is it that knows the sound and experience in the senses not only thought of it?

Does it feel like sound and awareness are 1?

The sound can be heard. what is the proof for an additional element awareness being there?

[Stacyg888]

Hi Paul,

So many great questions! Thank you!

I am away on a camping trip working through them, looking at awareness ans sensations. I will get back to you in the next few days.

I hope your last few days in Morocco are amazing!

[CarefulDog88]

Hi Stacy,
Yes had an amazing time there.
No problem, take your time and sit with the questions.
Enjoy your camping trip.🏕️
I’m still travelling this week so no rush.

[Stacyg888]

Hi Paul,

I'm sure you've had a wonderful holiday!

Could anything be different to what actually is?

No, but sometimes I still wonder if it could happen differently. Eg if different thoughts had come to my husband and I, those thoughts might have encouraged us to stay in Aus then it would have turned out differently for us.

Are you truly awareness?

It feels Ike I am awareness captured in a body experiencing all that is through the senses.

Do experiences truly arise in awareness in a literal sense?

No, experiences are always there, ebbing and flowing.

where in this sensory experience, is the information that this is you?

Only that this is how it is perceived by "me"

awareness and sound are there two things?

Yes but they seem to merge when attention (awareness) flows to the sound.

Where does the sound end and the awareness of it start?

The sound is always there, it only becomes apparent to awareness when awareness puts attention on it.

What is the boundary between the sound and awareness made of?

I can't find a boundary.

Can the point in time be found at which the sound crosses the border from being unknown to being known?

Just that moment when awareness becomes aware.

Does it feel like it is awareness that knows the sound?

Yes

at which exact moment does the sound become known to awareness?

When attention flows to the sound

What exactly is it that knows the sound and experience in the senses not only thought of it?

Awareness.

Does it feel like sound and awareness are 1?

No, though they seem to merge into 1 once awareness notices the sound.

The sound can be heard. what is the proof for an additional element awareness being there?

There is a perceiver and the perceived, no sound without something or someone to be aware of it.

I found these questions quite tricky, I'm not really sure what we are talking about here.

[CarefulDog88]

Hi Stacy,
Apologies for the delayed response but have been dealing with a 10hr timezone jet lag :)
how was your camping trip?

I found these questions quite tricky, I'm not really sure what we are talking about here

That's OK these are just questions to help explore and discover what needs to be looked at, there is no right or wrong answers, how could there be :). We will come back to awareness, for the moment lets explore the thoughts you have shared.

Could anything be different to what actually is?

No, but sometimes I still wonder if it could happen differently. Eg if different thoughts had come to my husband and I, those thoughts might have encouraged us to stay in Aus then it would have turned out differently for us.

How does this feel with what it actually is?

How does it feel when you have the thoughts about having different thoughts?

Tell me what are you doing precisely in order to think?

How do you make a thought into existence?

Can any thought be relied on as being 100% true?

What is it, when you don't think about what you could have thought about differently?

Can you describe using sensory experience (seen, heard, touched, smelt or tasted), how would a different thought have changed what actually is?

[Stacyg888]

Hi Paul,

Welcome back! Camping was great fun thanks :)

I actually replied days ago but just saw now that didn't go through :( So Take 2 again ...

How does this feel with what it actually is?

I'm not sure I understand the question properly but I think it feels confused, tight, restricted.

How does it feel when you have the thoughts about having different thoughts?

It feels like thoughts upon thoughts, hard work, an effort.

Tell me what are you doing precisely in order to think?

It seems like I am using my brain power but through this work, I know there is nothing I can do to actually think.

How do you make a thought into existence?

I can't.

Can any thought be relied on as being 100% true?

No.

What is it, when you don't think about what you could have thought about differently?

It is peace, contentment, acceptance.

Can you describe using sensory experience (seen, heard, touched, smelt or tasted), how would a different thought have changed what actually is?

I'm not sure how to do that using the senses ( I don't think it's possible). But different thoughts might have resulted in a different outcome.

[CarefulDog88]

Hi Stacy,

Can any thought be relied on as being 100% true?

No.

From this then, In your actual experience there is no truth to any thought!

Let's see if we can dig a little deeper.

Can you describe using sensory experience (seen, heard, touched, smelt or tasted), how would a different thought have changed what actually is?

I'm not sure how to do that using the senses ( I don't think it's possible). But different thoughts might have resulted in a different outcome.

This question has very specific pointers. It would be beneficial if you had another look at it and sat with it for some time before answering it. (in your seeing right now, is there evidence that a different thought would have changed what actually is being seen right now? In your Hearing of the sounds right now is there evidence that a different thought would have changed what actually is being heard? try this with Touch, smell and taste)

Is there any evidence that a different thought could have created a different outcome?

Can this different outcome be found in the senses or is it just another thought?

[Stacyg888]

Hi Paul,

Right, there is no truth to thoughts - therefore all thoughts must be lies.

Is there any evidence that a different thought could have created a different outcome? Can this different outcome be found in the senses or is it just another thought?

What is seen or heard is just what is, what is happening in the moment. They would happen regardless of any outcome, or even no outcome. They are just coming and going in the flow of life. This different outcome is just a thought. I see that now - it just feels like my whole life has been uprooted because of thoughts. But all thoughts are lies.

[CarefulDog88]

Hi Stacy,

it just feels like my whole life has been uprooted because of thoughts. But all thoughts are lies.

Thank you for this beautiful sharing.

How does this feel? describe in detail please Stacy

Right, there is no truth to thoughts - therefore all thoughts must be lies.

The more practical way to see thought is that it is illusory or an illusion.
If we look at thought as 'lies' it implies that we shouldn't have them, when in fact it's impossible not to have them.

What is being pointed to is that thought is illusory, not 100% True and when we see this, we can drop the belief in them and the associated attachments to the thought stories.

What is seen or heard is just what is, what is happening in the moment. They would happen regardless of any outcome, or even no outcome. They are just coming and going in the flow of life.

As we have discovered the senses in this way, isn't thought the same?

Are thoughts just happening or are they happening to you?

Does seeing have a connection to hearing?

Do the eyes hear?

Do the ears see?

Does a thought feel?

Is a sensation and a thought connected in any way, look and see?

Does a sensation tell a story?
isn't the story another thought?

[Stacyg888]

Hi Paul,

How does this feel? describe in detail please Stacy

It feels frustrating that I apparently have no choice but yet I feel that I do have choice. It's all very confusing. I am getting the sense that this pointing is pointing me to the only truth is in what I can see, hear, smell. DE is the only truth. But yet optical illusions mean I don't even fully trust what I see which means I can't trust DE fully either.

Thank you for explaining the illusory nature of thoughts. I get that they are part of DE and will always arise. Seeing them as illusory puts a new spin on them. That's actually quite fascinating. Now to see through the illusion. Can this knowledge start piercing the illusion for me?

As we have discovered the senses in this way, isn't thought the same?

As in part of DE? Yes. As such, thoughts can be observed but should not be believed.

Are thoughts just happening or are they happening to you?

They are just happening, with or without me. (Apparently there is no me but, for now, there does seem to be a me still.)

Does seeing have a connection to hearing?

No, they are independent of each other.

Do the eyes hear?

This kept me awake last night! It seems that the eyes see but when you ask it like this, it makes me wonder if that is fact.

Do the ears see?

Same. Ears hear, eyes see. That's how it has always been.

Does a thought feel?

No, a thought just arises, it just is, it can't feel.

Is a sensation and a thought connected in any way, look and see?

A sensation leads to a thought, a sensation makes certain thoughts (labels, commentary) arise about it. Like cause and effect.

Does a sensation tell a story?

A sensation leads to thoughts which tell a story, the thoughts tell the story, not the sensation.

isn't the story another thought?

Yes, it is all labels, commentary, stories, thoughts = illusion.

[CarefulDog88]

Hi Stacy,

It feels frustrating that I apparently have no choice but yet I feel that I do have choice. It's all very confusing.

It's OK Stacy, this takes effort, consistency and patience, there is a lifetime of beliefs and concepts, relax and lets open up a small space of not knowing and not needing to know.

Can you describe what this frustration is made up of?

How does this frustration feel in your direct experience?

Now to see through the illusion. Can this knowledge start piercing the illusion for me?

Try this, whenever you notice a thought, ask is this true?
look closely and wait for the answer, any answer will be another thought, so there is the illusion. Do this over and over and over, soon enough there will be a realization.

DE is the only truth. But yet optical illusions mean I don't even fully trust what I see which means I can't trust DE fully either.

the picture or the scene is not direct experience, an optical illusion is not the direct experience.

Seeing is the direct experiencing.
Tasting is the direct experiencing.
Hearing is the direct experiencing.
Smelling is the direct experiencing.
Feeling is the direct experiencing.

Is there a Direct Experience without memory of it?

What is memory, isn't memory a thought?

Is a sensation and a thought connected in any way, look and see?

A sensation leads to a thought, a sensation makes certain thoughts (labels, commentary) arise about it. Like cause and effect.

Do you know this for sure with 100% certainty?

Is there a thought for every possible sensation?(can you say this for sure)

Are thoughts just happening or are they happening to you?

They are just happening, with or without me. (Apparently there is no me but, for now, there does seem to be a me still.)

Can you describe this 'me' using your DE please, look closely at this and be 100% certain of your description?

[Stacyg888]

Hi Paul,

It's OK Stacy, this takes effort, consistency and patience, there is a lifetime of beliefs and concepts, relax and lets open up a small space of not knowing and not needing to know.

I can definitely go with not knowing and not needing to know most of the time, then Mind brings me back to doubt.

Can you describe what this frustration is made up of?

It's just thoughts.

How does this frustration feel in your direct experience?

If I look at how it feels, there is a constriction somewhere around my chest and stomach area, a tenseness.

Try this, whenever you notice a thought, ask is this true?

I will keep trying this. For now, Mind keeps butting in with a yes or a no which is not very helpful! Haha

Oh right, I have been doing DE wrong.

Is there a Direct Experience without memory of it?

No, memory is more thought, seeing, tasting etc are all happening right now in the moment.

What is memory, isn't memory a thought?

Yes.

Is a sensation and a thought connected in any way, look and see?
A sensation leads to a thought, a sensation makes certain thoughts (labels, commentary) arise about it. Like cause and effect. Do you know this for sure with 100% certainty?

Well now I'm not sure, your question has confused me.

Is there a thought for every possible sensation? (can you say this for sure) Logically I say no - we have around 65,000 thoughts a day, that many sensations would probably be overwhelming. So sensations are sensations and thoughts are thoughts, right?

Can you describe this 'me' using your DE please, look closely at this and be 100% certain of your description?

Me feels like a sensation in my head or in my chest but when I examine it with with seeing, hearing, tasting there is nothing, no Me to see or hear or taste. So always I come back to if I can't find a Me, why am I still feeling like one?

You asked in the last post or two, do eyes hear, do ears see? What is the answer to those questions please?

[CarefulDog88]

Hi Stacy,

Is a sensation and a thought connected in any way, look and see?
A sensation leads to a thought, a sensation makes certain thoughts (labels, commentary) arise about it. Like cause and effect. Do you know this for sure with 100% certainty?

Well now I'm not sure, your question has confused me.

Is it confusion or is it simply not knowing?

Is there a need to know?

So sensations are sensations and thoughts are thoughts, right?

OK is a thought a sensation, is a sensation a thought?

Me feels like a sensation in my head or in my chest but when I examine it with with seeing, hearing, tasting there is nothing, no Me to see or hear or taste. So always I come back to if I can't find a Me, why am I still feeling like one?

Look into this feeling, describe:
where is this feeling?
if its a me, is it in the head or the chest, which one is it, or does it move house randomly? :)
what does this me feel like? (look deeply at this feeling, and focus with a singular attention on this feeling and really look into it).

Now, this next question is where i really would like you to relax and look into it please.
Is there an expectation that you should feel differently, that the feeling of a me shouldn't exist or you should feel special or something is suppose to happen that signifies an event, something a sign that allows you to know

You asked in the last post or two, do eyes hear, do ears see? What is the answer to those questions please?

What is the direct experience of your ears is it seeing or is it hearing?
What is the direct experience of eyes is it seeing or is it hearing?

Well why don't we have a look, we can try some pointers to find out.

Sit quietly, close your eyes, and listen to the sounds that can be heard without actively reaching out for them. Labels will be added, for example, “a child calling”, “a truck passing”. Allow this to happen and focus on the sound that can be heard.
1. Where is the sound, is it inside or outside?
2. Inside or outside of what?
3. Is there a hearer and the heard, or simply hearing, or simply the heard?
4. If you find a hearer and the heard, where is the border between them?
5. Where does the heard end and the hearer of the heard start?
Try this experiment with different sounds.

[Stacyg888]

Hi Paul,

Is it confusion or is it simply not knowing? Is there a need to know?

Not knowing, but I seem to not know a lot. And yes, there is a need and a desire to know :)

OK is a thought a sensation, is a sensation a thought?

No, a sensation is a sensation and a thought is a thought.

where is this feeling? If its a me, is it in the head or the chest, which one is it, or does it move house randomly? :) what does this me feel like? (look deeply at this feeling, and focus with a singular attention on this feeling and really look into it).

This Me feels to be encapsulated in this body, most noticeably in my head and in my chest. The fact that I can't find a Me, makes me think that's because it is an invisible Spirit/Soul which each body has. Is that completely wrong? A thought? A belief? Because that is how Me feels to be, the reason I can't find it is because it is invisible, not because it isn't there.

Is there an expectation that you should feel differently, that the feeling of a me shouldn't exist or you should feel special or something is suppose to happen that signifies an event, something a sign that allows you to know

Yes, there was some expectation that I should feel differently but I am okay with that not being the case. Then when I am fully realised (or whatever we are trying to achieve here) I will reach the end of seeking, no longer be deluded by thoughts, but it might still feel like a Me in this body. Is that what you are saying?

What is the direct experience of your ears is it seeing or is it hearing? What is the direct experience of eyes is it seeing or is it hearing?

Eyes see and ears hear.

Exercise: listening to the birds, voices

1. Where is the sound, is it inside or outside?

They are outside

2. Inside or outside of what?

Outside of my body and outside of my house where I am currently sitting

3. Is there a hearer and the heard, or simply hearing, or simply the heard?

My experience is that I am the hearer and the sounds are the heard, but if I go to DE there is simply hearing and simply the heard.

4. If you find a hearer and the heard, where is the border between them?

No border - the longer I listen, the more the birds twittering seem to be coming from Me/my body.

5. Where does the heard end and the hearer of the heard start?

As I listened longer, that merged as for my answer to 4 above.