I have a pain in my face with Spirituality, I’m going home.

[Truthfull]

When I look for the I that suffers. It seems to be a series of thoughts believed. There may also be sensations that feel uncomfortable, take I feel are reporting to me.

[Truthfull]

When I look for the I that suffers. It seems to be a series of thoughts believed. There may also be sensations that feel uncomfortable, take I feel are reporting to me.

[Elad]

I am sorry you get the sense I get angry with you. It's not like that. Just aiming to keep things simple. In agreement with the initial message I sent. I will mention that the work here equal some seeing through at least fetter 1, often 1-3, sometimes others. Our guiding here is centered on what equals these fetters with strong emphasis on 1. It will sometimes touch on other fetters too though, the aim is really for a shift that makes a difference in life, marked by a palpable sense of relief, appreciation and gratitude. I don't want to further discuss me, or fetters, other methods, teachers here. I want to focus exclusively on a clear experience of seeing through separate self, that feels clear from inside. If you want to work with me given this let's continue. Alternatively I can ask in the guides group for a different guide for you.

Last thing, a significant part of the guiding in LU are often exercises that contain multipe questions. They intend to help make it all more experiential. To do them properly the person must be up for answering all questions, which might take discipline and feel at times unnecessary or painstaking. After our little bit more back and forth, and where we have come to now, I see that I would want you to be committed to do that for this guiding to continue with me.

Let me know what you wish. I wish you freedom and relief and a successful exploration.

[Truthfull]

Ok, thanks for the explanation and kind words. I’m up for keeping it simple. Let’s get back to this important work. I want to continue with you. I’m committed. 👍🏼

[Elad]

Ok, thanks for the explanation and kind words. I’m up for keeping it simple. Let’s get back to this important work. I want to continue with you. I’m committed. 👍🏼

I'm glad to hear. Okay please do this exercise today:

Finding the Gap

This exercise has a dual purpose. Firstly, to become aware of each and every though as they appear. Secondly, the careful looking for the gap is an example of how carefully to look when looking for the ‘separate self’.
Here is a step-by-step description of how to look at thoughts. First thing is to sit for at least 10-15 minutes quietly somewhere, several times throughout your day. Close your eyes and just notice thoughts. Don’t engage with any thought, just notice them.

1. Notice the current thought that is present.
Like when you sit observing the body, a thought might arise “this is my feet” or “here is a pain” or “my breathing is too quick” or “I am bored with this exercise” or “I have better things to do” or any sorts of thoughts.
2. This thought will pass and another thought will come. So just observe this thought passing.
3. Then wait for the next thought to come.
4. When the next thought is present, just notice it, and see how it passes.
5. Then wait for the next thought to come.
6. Repeat #4 and #5 many-many times.

Between the 2 thoughts there is a gap. It can be very short or subtle, just a second or a few seconds before the next thought come in.

This is how to look at thoughts:-
Looking how they come and go, and Observing the short gap between them. Noticing how the current thought is passing. And waiting for the next thought to come.
Please do the following exercise:
Throughout your waking day, try to observe the gap between thoughts as often as possible. It can be done by noticing that ‘thinking’ is happening right now, then stop and just simply wait for the next thought to come. In the ‘waiting’ there is a gap between two thoughts.

Tomorrow, let me know what was experienced with this.

[Truthfull]

Hi Elad,

When I did this I found it difficult. The first session was ok. Their were thought's with gaps. The next 4 session were like I was infected with a thought virus. It was uncomfortable and I went of into daydreams 3 times for 10 minutes. Thoughts were hard to see, they kind of half came up or would mumble something inaudible, but still got my attention. Their seemed to be no gaps of silence doing it, or very little. I tried it in different places and the place and environment effected the thoughts that came up. It was all a bit shocking. It made the body feel uncomfortable and restless.

Maybe I'm now seeing subtle thoughts that I was missing before, or noticing more subtle layers of ego. I'm not sure.

[Elad]

Hi Denis, good. Please practice this exercise a couple of times more at least - and as many more as you feel is right. Write me what is experienced. Seems good to me you are playing with different places and other variables that might come to you (time of day, state of mind, sitting/walking/lying etc.).

Also, today do this exercise:

“I” labelling

Get a sheet of paper and draw a line that divides that sheet in half. Label one half 'self' and the other side 'other'. Sit down and start a timer for 5 minutes. Every time you have a thought make a mark on the sheet. If that thought is about the self put a mark on the self side, if it’s about something else, mark the other side. If a thought about food occurs due to feeling hungry, mark that on the self side. Any thought that refers back to a self should go on the self side. (I'm bored, I'm tired, is the door locked (my safety) that video was funny (I was amused), my back hurts, I am frightened) get it?
Let me know how you go and what you notice.

[Truthfull]

ok, I did the I labeling excursive 2 times. Each time 90% 0f thoughts were about self. four thoughts each time were about other, like "bin" "tree", etc. 28 thoughts were about self. This felt uncomfortable to see. I thought work thoughts and project work might fall into other. These are useful functional thoughts. Selfing is the main stream of thoughts. It creates the self.

I also did "Finding the Gap" again twice. It felt like the more I put attention waiting on the thoughts, the less they are clear. Then my attention went onto the body sensations, back and forth. Then I started to see steam with my eyes closed. Then I opened my eyes and looked at my legs and arms/hands (with clothes on) and with a relaxed gaze, they all had steam coming of them around the borders. It felt like the sense of self was a contraction behind the nose and it was panful.

[Elad]

Good noticing. Relax the rest of the day. You can practice with the gap more, or do natural meditation, but only if it feels like fun or you are "called to it".

Tomorrow start with this:



Observing thoughts


Here is a thought exercise. Sit quietly for about 30 minutes and notice the arising thoughts. Just let them appear as they appear. Try your best to COMPLETELY ignore what they are saying and just notice how they appear without you doing anything at all.

Where are they coming from and going to?
Did you do anything to make a particular thought or thoughts appear?
Could you have done anything to make a different thought appear at that exact moment instead?
Can you predict your next thought?
Can you select from a range of thoughts to have only pleasant thoughts?
Can you choose not to have painful, negative or fearful thoughts?
Can you pick and choose any kind of thought?
Is it possible to prevent a thought from appearing?

[Truthfull]

Ok, I’ve done the observing thoughts. Answer to all your questions is No..

It is a very frustrating process. I got annoyed, pisses off, etc. it is obvious I’m helpless to make anything happen. So feeling pissed off now.

Denis

[Elad]

Ok, I’ve done the observing thoughts. Answer to all your questions is No..

It is a very frustrating process. I got annoyed, pisses off, etc. it is obvious I’m helpless to make anything happen. So feeling pissed off now.

Denis

That's a good place to be... Almost there...

Where or what is this I that is helpless?

Once what you are almost seeing or seeing intellectually is clearly seen in real time, the utmost frustration turns to the utmost relief. This is all as if I was asking you to bring me an upside down circle...

Please do the following exercise:

[Elad]

Drink Exercise

The aim of the following exercise is to discover whether the function of choice can really be found or confirmed in actual experience. The idea of making ‘choices‘ is a very clear example of a function that we wrongly identify as the basis of our identity.
Here's what’s needed - a chair, a table and two different drinks. Any two drinks you like are okay for this: coffee, tea, milk, water, juices, smoothies, beer, wine, etc.
Preparation - Place the two drinks side by side on the table in front of you, sit comfortably on the chair and mentally label them as drink A and drink B.
Experiment - Finding the function of choice
Sit for a few moments, take a few relaxed breaths and let the dust settle. When you feel ready:
1. Look at drink A and at drink B. Think about their respective qualities, the things you like about them, compare and weigh the pros and cons of each. See if a preference is manifesting for one or the other.
2. Count to 5.
3. Choose one of the drinks. Pick it up and take a sip.
Questions:

Remember that we’re looking for some kind of function, a something, an ‘I’ which is doing the ‘choosing’.
In step 1 when thinking about their respective qualities, did you ‘choose’ the qualities? Or did they kind of appear by themselves? If some preferences manifested, did you ‘choose’ these preferences? Or did they just pop up by themselves?
In step 2 when you counted to 5, if the preferences took the back seat while the numbers took the front seat, did you ‘choose’ this sequence of event? Did you ‘choose’ to shut down the preferences to give way to the counting? Did you directly experience a mental function or faculty doing the ‘choosing’? Have you seen this function in action?

In step 3 where you made a choice, did you actually witness or directly experience a mental function or faculty doing the ‘choosing’? Did anything arise that announced, ‘I am the chooser’? If so, what does this function look like?
Sometimes we describe this sense of choosing as a ‘feeling’: It feels like ‘I’ did the ‘choosing’. But the question is, can a feeling ‘choose’? Is it in the nature of a feeling to ‘choose’?

[Elad]

Also:

Is there anything getting in the way of "you" writing: "clearly there is no separate self, clearly there never was, clearly there is no one controlling or choosing anything"?

If there is anything in the way - seemingly - what is it?










Try silently inwardly intoning several times:

"there is no separate being that can get this right or wake up anywhere"

After intoning it be quiet and receptive and just see what comes up, thoughts, feelings, associations, experiences...

Write me about it.

[Truthfull]

Answering the 3 posts:

1. There does not seem to be an I that is helpless, just thoughts of helplessness that make the body fell crappy.

2. I did the drink task and savoured tea and water. I was looking forward to the tea and looked at both their quality’s. I planned to have the tea first. After 5 I drank the water, while my mind said drink the tea. So the body had its own view. 😂
There was no doer doing, just a lot of thoughts guessing the expected outcome.
Feeling does not choose, choosing just happens by magic, all by itself.

3. I will do pat 3 now and later and report back tomorrow. 👍🏼

[Elad]

Good stuff, good movement.