What is really true?

[Inspirit12]

Hi Luchana,

Thank you. This one is very tough for me. I sense there is a important entry point here behind the hidden beliefs.

I see independent bodies mainly because:

* I see thoughts belonging to the bodies. (I can only experience "my" thoughts, not any other person´s thoughts) There is a believed connection with body and thought because of this.thoughts. I think this is evidence that thought knows body because the thoughts seems to be personal.

Although, I can´t find any evidendence of bodies knowing the thought.

It also makes sense that both are known, there is a lot of confusion now.

If we crack this somehow, there might be an opening. Now there is just confusion and immense suffering.

With love,
tommy

[Luchana]

Hi dear Tommy,

Now there is just confusion and immense suffering.

I hear you. Yes this is the way.

I see thoughts belonging to the bodies. (I can only experience "my" thoughts, not any other person´s thoughts) There is a believed connection with body and thought because of this.thoughts. I think this is evidence that thought knows body because the thoughts seems to be personal.

This is Maya, this is primal illusion which you want finally to break trough.
Persona and body are one and the same - they refer to something which needs care and protection from environment, right?
There is no persona (you found that) and there is no body also. How do you feel to be the NOW without persona living life and without body fighting for food and live?

Whose thoughts are now?
Knowing of thoughts - what can be aware of thoughts if it is not wholeness itself?

Much love,
Luchana

[Inspirit12]

Hi Luchana,

Thank you again. This has also been tricky for me. I now notice that "no me" was not really experienced, it was only a conceptual thought. The ego is very smart and camouflages itself as a "no me" thought. This is why i have experienced difficulties. This is why I experience body/mind identification.

I can conceptually also understand that there is only a hologramic screen where everything is one and no separate bodies are anywhere, only colours and shapes. But I am not experiencing this beacuse the the identification with the self is still in the body.

At times when the body seems empty of me it is very liberating. But my ego is super strong and stubborn and I have build a superman ego my whole life because of trauma during my upbringing and this is causing me a lot of stress now. I haven´t really ever been able to be mentally free or relaxed. This is why liberation seem as my only option.

If sense we should try to look at thoughts as totally separate from the body. I would love to experience that the thoughts are not in my head and that they are not my thoughts.

With love,
Tommy

[Luchana]

Hi dear Tommy,

Thoughts, this topic is here.

Look, we are looking that there is no inherent self , that there is no separation. It is obvious that there is something including thoughts. So, it is not a goal to see that thoughts are not yours.

Let's start with this, surrender in front of thoughts - this is how freedom wants to appear here. And notice that all these imaginations and stories about someone with trauma is OK to be here and notice with love - isn't it how freedom appears, right now in this very moment?

Isn't it freedom appearing as...that thoughts with exactly this story right now in this very moment?
Notice the idea that you are something separate and you can see that this story is not your story?

How this can be possible?

You are imagining Tommy's traumatic life, this is the joke :)

There never was Tommy living life, like Santa..

Stay with thoughts and notice what your imaginations are?

So much love to you,
Luchana

[Inspirit12]

Hi Luchana,

Thank you for this, I have let this marinate in my experience. I have started to experience a subtle shift in perception. It´s like my awareness is a bit outside the body somehow and I experience less of "self" being the agent doing, thinking etc. It seems like the body is moving by itself, decisions are happening, speaking is happening, thinking is happening. At the same time the body feels more empty than before. It.s like I am observing my body rather than being my body if you know what I mean. The experience is very subtle but there seems to be a small gap between the observer and the observed. This is still duality but the experience is a bit different than before. I try also to catch the thought more rapidly than before, which seem to be working, There is still reactions in the body when triggers come.

Much love,
tommy

[Luchana]

Hi dear Tommy,
Wonderful that you can see that.
Now notice that there is no substance. The body is empty from substance and there is nothing which can be Tommy.

Look, do you exist?


Love,
Luchana

[Inspirit12]

Hi Luchana,

Thank you. First this pointing caused a reaction in me. But, today I could really experience that the body is only a thoight. And for the first time I experienced what you pointed before that the eyes don´t see. :)

A huge relaxation came after it was experienced that the visual field is more lke a hologramic screen with colours and form. And that the sensations are just sensations if you take away the thought linked with the sensation. There is just what is right here, right now. No body, no Tommy. This is absolutely crazy! Are you sure this is like this?? (you see, the doubt thought is coming directly).

This is still very subtle, easiest to notice alone in silence. One problem arises when I look myself in the mirror... What is that then?

Much love,
Tommy

[Luchana]

Beautiful, dear Tommi,

There is just what is right here, right now. No body, no Tommy. This is absolutely crazy! Are you sure this is like this?? (you see, the doubt thought is coming directly).

Yes, we still cannot believe that we are so free... from each thought story. Only now, yes, only what is here.

This is still very subtle, easiest to notice alone in silence. One problem arises when I look myself in the mirror... What is that then?

You are much bigger then this image :)
Ok. Notice the face in the mirror.
Then notice what is imagination, to whom this face belongs to?
Notice also imagination - to whom thoughts are speaking to?
And now notice without these imagination what is really here ?
and is there someone IN something which is here?
It is crazy yes, this is freedom :)

Much love,
Luchana

[Inspirit12]

Hi Luchana,

Thank you! Your pointing are starting to sink in.. It is only imagination (thought) that this face belongs to me. It is also seen that is imagiantion that the thoughts belong to me. There is no one IN here either. This is very liberating.

It is seen that there is emptiness left. I don´t actually know what it is. It is unkonowable. Like chaos? Crazy...

Much love,
Tommy

[Luchana]

Beautiful, Tommi :)

What is to live that in everyday life?
Are there any doubts, share what is going on.
I am with you.

Much love,
Luchana

[Inspirit12]

Hi Luchana,

Thank you. I had a short and very relaxed period while the mind was seemingly relaxing/giving up. It seems that the nondual experience is revealing itself by itself when there is enough relaxation.

However, it seems that the mind wants to activate itself again, for example after conversations with friends or after a trigger. Then the contracted "me" comes back again. Then it starts to search for nonduality videos again to find something new. The triggers are also VERY powerful. One is for example a desire for partner & family. This is huge. The fear of missing out on this is a huge fear trigger. Then I´m all in the mind again fearing the worst possible outcome being alone the rest of my life. Another trigger is work. If the work doesn´t go as expected, a huge fear reaction comes, a fear that I won´t survive & I won´t be accepted. These two triggers are killing me at times. Then there is also this seeming "personal development" trap where the whole western culture wants you to become the best version of yourself. This is very much in conflict with the surrender approach and triggers me also a lot.

It seems though that the overall experience has shifted a bit more towards the nondual than before. I guess there has to be more surrendering.

Much love,
tommy

[Inspirit12]

Hi Luchana,

Thank you. I had a short and very relaxed period while the mind was seemingly relaxing/giving up. It seems that the nondual experience is revealing itself by itself when there is enough relaxation.

However, it seems that the mind wants to activate itself again, for example after conversations with friends or after a trigger. Then the contracted "me" comes back again. Then it starts to search for nonduality videos again to find something new. The triggers are also VERY powerful. One is for example a desire for partner & family. This is huge. The fear of missing out on this is a huge fear trigger. Then I´m all in the mind again fearing the worst possible outcome being alone the rest of my life. Another trigger is work. If the work doesn´t go as expected, a huge fear reaction comes, a fear that I won´t survive & I won´t be accepted. These two triggers are killing me at times. Then there is also this seeming "personal development" trap where the whole western culture wants you to become the best version of yourself. This is very much in conflict with the surrender approach and triggers me also a lot.

It seems though that the overall experience has shifted a bit more towards the nondual than before. I guess there has to be more surrendering.

Much love,
tommy

[Luchana]

Hi dear Tommi,

It seems that the nondual experience is revealing itself by itself when there is enough relaxation.

Yes, exactly! The storm is coming from the commentator/mind but not from the nondual experience.
Notice that there is only a nondual experience?

The triggers are also VERY powerful. One is for example a desire for partner & family. This is huge. The fear of missing out on this is a huge fear trigger. Then I´m all in the mind again fearing the worst possible outcome being alone the rest of my life. Another trigger is work. If the work doesn´t go as expected, a huge fear reaction comes, a fear that I won´t survive & I won´t be accepted. These two triggers are killing me at times.

yes, and notice the doubt that you are not the whole this phenomena but something small and separate persona hidden in the experience called body?
look the face in the mirror - notice the false idea that this image is a persona? But not how the nondual experience appears right now?
meet these two trigers, notice the thought story - how it appears by itself?
Then notice emotions, notice is there someone small behind them? If not What is there, what is behind them when you look?

Then there is also this seeming "personal development" trap where the whole western culture wants you to become the best version of yourself.

Yes, the beauty of this investigation is that you are already the best version only doubt, shame and fear make us powerless

We are in a beautiful white house with 3 bedrooms with see view in Sete, it will be nice if you can jump again for a few days to clear the picture?

So much love,
Luchana

[Inspirit12]

Hi Luchana,

Thank you again. This looking has been very hard for me going back and forth all the time. One time when the mid was relaxed I could sense agan the emptiness of everything, including the body. This was very liberating. Then the next day all contraction is back again together with massive fear and doubt. I know that the doubt is also a thought combined with a sensation of fear, nothing more. But still, it takes over and the relaxation is gone. I think it is because there is an underlying fear triggering every second of my waking hour. I guess the mind doesn´t feel safe and don´t yet trust the nondual way of living. It´s terrible to live in this "no mans land" where the experience is back and forth, relaxed and triggering.

I look at the mirror and can sometimes see that there is no persona behind the face, but because I´ve belied in the persona for 46 years, it is not easy to let that belief go. Especially when I live in a society that is mirroring false beliefs everywhere and all the time.

Now I can at least start to see that there is nothing behind the emotions. This is a small step forward I guess. There has also been a lot of OCD in my life (controlling, tics etc) which has intensified my ego somehow. This is my intuition. But when I experience the relaxed nondual abiding, all OCD is gone, which is amazing! This is a sign for me that this is the right way to go.

Maybe we could have a 30 min chat on zoom at some point and then I can see if there would be a chance for me to travel to Sete again. My ego is not happy of this work and I am sensing it very clearly now :)

Much love,
Tommy

[Luchana]

Hi Tommi,

Now I can at least start to see that there is nothing behind the emotions. This is a small step forward I guess. There has also been a lot of OCD in my life (controlling, tics etc) which has intensified my ego somehow. This is my intuition. But when I experience the relaxed nondual abiding, all OCD is gone, which is amazing! This is a sign for me that this is the right way to go.

Beautiful. Yea, nothing behind the emotions, still emotions /sensations are felt deeply. More space for those.

Maybe we could have a 30 min chat on zoom at some point and then I can see if there would be a chance for me to travel to Sete again. My ego is not happy of this work and I am sensing it very clearly now :)

Yes, how about later today 7 or 8 pm Central European Time?
Lubo is going to meet you for 20,30 min I'm having something else...
Let me know if today works otherwise probably Monday...

Sending love,
Luchana


ps. Link for zoom

Join Zoom Meeting
https://us02web.zoom.us/j/3718929853?pw ... BoUUNwUT09

Meeting ID: 371 892 9853
Passcode: HmbSF4