Eager to Begin!

[Elad]

🥳🎊 🎆🙏🎆 🎉🍾

[mo23]

Dear Elad,
I have been trying to articulate a question for a while now. Today it feels the clearest it's been so I am just going to put it out there for you.
The understanding I now have through inquiry and simple looking has turned on a light switch that I cannot turn off.
Of course it will get clearer through life's experience and ongoing inquiry. But there seems to be an important piece missing.
It has long seemed to me that there is life in this 3D world and there is another realm, to me a more compelling realm, that offers a glimpse into my larger beingness. (Like Dr. Who's Tardis I'm bigger on the inside!) Is this only a story I have told myself? I have had direct experience with feelings of connection and expansion and the profound wellbeing that arises. I can say that, unlike the stories which created a separate self, these delicious feelings do not come with a sense of separation. Quite the opposite!
I am very interested to here your thoughts on this.
Warmly,
Maureen

[Elad]

Dear Maureen, this is beautiful.

Beyond believing in thought content to be reality life is a rich Mystery. Follow your intuition to explore and enjoy where-ever your heart is leaning towards. In Dharma terms we differentiate between morality, concentration and wisdom. Morality pertains to everything that has to do with living everyday normal life skillfully and caringly. Wisdom is seeing truth beyond thought, i.e. that there is no separate self, that no object of mind has inherent existence, essence or duration, that any description of reality does not equal reality (including this) and more. This is the realm we mainly work with here. Concentration is about qualities of mind and states of being that are discovered when the mind is calm and non-reactive. These states can go way outside of normal experience and be blissful, peaceful, beautiful, love-ful, still, empty, in many different ways. They are called the djyanas. I have a sense that what you are speaking of here might be you glimpsing/touching/resting in one or some of these realms. How does all this sound with you?

With much warmth,
Elad

[mo23]

Dear Elad,
The work we have done here has been life changing. I can now see what I am not but I still want to know what I am! Experiences of expansion and connection are wonderful and may give me a taste of it but I want more!
Is there an intelligent life force that moves through the whole, that allows life to be experienced as a flow and not as random chaos?
I look at the incredible intelligence of my body, of the natural world, of the Earth spinning in perfect proximity to the Sun. Surely there is a cosmic intelligence at play!
Each one of us must be a part of all of that. I want to know this, to feel this within every cell of my being. I want to experience this oneness! And live my life from within that knowing.
Perhaps the states of mind and being that you mention under concentration is where this knowing comes in?
Perhaps it is a natural progression that comes with living my new not self understanding through many more of life's experiences?
Do you understand what I am asking? Have you found this experience of oneness for yourself through living without the illusion of separation?
I do appreciate the clarity that our dialogues inspire me to reach for!
Warmly and with much appreciation for the light you shine!
Maureen

[Elad]

Dear Maureen,

I love the attitude you bring to this. The sense here is that the mystery, is beyond any conception. Words like you shared here are beautiful pointers to open the mind and heart. The main thing is to stay true to these questions and this love, and not let any "small explanation" limit them, as truth unfolds. Truth burns up misunderstandings.

How would it feel to you at this point to answer the final questions here?

With you,
Elad

[mo23]

Yes, it feels right and good to answer the questions now! I awoke with that intention for today. And I'm looking forward to it!
Warmly,
Maureen

[mo23]

Hi Elad,
Here are my answers with a big request for further clarification on question 5.

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?
2)there is not and never was! Every now and then I think I see the shadow of a separate self but when I turn to look I realize there is nothing there!

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

2)my mind has created an elaborate story, in fact many interwoven stories that feature me as the main character. And others as separate from me. I have inhabited this world and seen it as real and true. Until now! What an illusion! It really is very funny. Walking around in a storyland when simple inquiry shows these stories to be unreal, fabrications of the mind!


3) How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.
3) it feels wonderful! Blinders removed from my eyes! It is a most extraordinary thing to have accepted these stories as true and lived my life caught up in them and then to see them as fabrications of the mind!!! Liberation unleashed!


4) What was the last bit that pushed you over; made you look?
I found myself (in thought only) blaming my daughter for blaming her son for his inappropriate behavior in school. I could see that my response came from what had come before: my expectations, thoughts, beliefs etc. Before LU this interaction would have remained with the flavor of blame. But this time I wanted to make a different choice. I had a renewed intention to see things as they really are and to hold a place of love and compassion for these people who are dear to me.
I sat with the questions of Byron Katie.
Asking " what happens if you see it is only a story?', had a surprising effect. With that the entire scene seemed to move away from me. It no longer felt in my face, rather more distant than it had been. Worry and tension disappeared completely! It felt like magic but I knew it was an allowing of a different perspective. The next morning I continued to feel a lightness of my being, and ease within my body that felt delicious.
That evening right after watching a TV show the illusion was exposed! I could see the interweaving stories that pass for the truth. It struck me fully for the first time that the illusion of a separate self has been created by the stories held in my mind. I laughed quite a lot with that realization! "Games up!" I thought. "Your (the mind's) cover has been blown!"

5) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen?
How does it work? What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.
5) what makes things happen? Oo, that's a good question! With no separate self there is no decision maker, chooser or controller. Is there free will? Again, how can there be without a self to freely choose?
Intention I am not clear on. It seems possible to me that intention is a quality of my larger beingness, that it has a role to play in shaping the direction my life may unfold.
What makes things happen?
I have been told it happens automatically, habitually. But then how does change happen in my life?
How does it work? I don't know!
What an I responsible for?I don't know!
This is a big hole in my understanding and I would very much like some clarity here.

6) Anything to add?
6) I have appreciated this incredible opportunity for guidance! And I am delighted with question 5 which actually brought to light questions that had been lurking in the outskirts of my awareness!

[Elad]

So beautiful and inspiring Maureen! Re question five, please read the following and see what reactions come up:

Experiences of choice, intention, will happens. We are practically aware of that and able to communicate on this level in conventional terms. At the same time we can see that all this happens without a self and also that whatever story we tell about how the whole is functioning is only a story, never the whole itself. At best helpful on a relative level. We can continue to speak and think in these terms when it seems helpful, but also hold it lightly, knowing no story/theory/idea truly is more then a story/theory/idea.

How does this sound and feel with you?

[Elad]

Hmm one more thought for you: Words like choice, will, intention are assoicated with the felt sense of what we want and what feels right, what can be called to the the feeling of the heart. I am not talking here of a "thing" but using metaphorical language to speak to experience. So while we can see that choice, will and intention do not exist as they would in a fantasy of a separate self, they definitely exist as part of our embodied human *experience*, and are something we can attend to and be informed by caringly. Let me know how this lands with you together with the first answer.

[mo23]

Thanks Elad!
"Experiences of choice, intention, will happens. We are practically aware of that and able to communicate on this level in conventional terms."
This is a helpful clarification. I have found myself wondering how to know what I know and still communicate in meaningful ways with others who don't yet.

"At the same time we can see that all this happens without a self and also that whatever story we tell about how the whole is functioning is only a story, never the whole itself."
Does that mean there really is no answer I can grasp (beyond a story I may tell) of what makes things happen and how does it work?

" At best helpful on a relative level. We can continue to speak and think in these terms when it seems helpful, but also hold it lightly, knowing no story/theory/idea truly is more then a story/theory/idea."
At this point I don't think I've come up with a story to explain these questions. That is probably a good thing! To be okay with not knowing, accepting the mystery. Maybe not even needing to know!
But what about my responsibility? Does this come back to the Dharma of morality? One thing I have noticed once through the Gate is that the qualities of kindness, compassion, and mudita come much more easily now!
I'm really appreciating this dialogue.

[mo23]

Hi Elad,
Thanks for that extra thought! I'll sit with it tomorrow and get back to you then.
This is such a great conversation! Very helpful in deepening my understanding.
Thanks!
Maureen

[Elad]

Again so beautiful Maureen. I am with you on that no explanation is final, the mystery is beyond. That being said, of course there are skillful ways of attending and thinking. In Buddhism this is described in terms of the absolute truth and the relative truth. The absolute is beyond explanations and ideas. The relative truth is all that pertains to functioning in a skillful way in ordinary life, like morality in Buddhism (sila) as you said, where we also will think and communicate in terms of responsibility in the conventional sense, when that is seen to be helpful and appropriate.

Okay Maureen, for me the clarity you express is absolutely "past gate", i.e. "passing the gateless gate", i.e. what LU aims for. I will let 3 other guides review and see if they have questions they think might help. After that process I would be more than happy to stay "friends on the pathless path" together and continue this exchange and looking. I will also refer you to other groups with "post-gaters", where the exploration can continue.

[Elad]

Hi Maureen, three other guides looked at your answers. Everyone had the sense that a deep seeing and opening has taken place. At the same time, a couple of guides suggest to help clarify further if there is in any real absolute way anyone who can choose and intend and thus have responsibility, or if all those concept are only stories that get on top of e seamless whole? Here are two exercises to look into this. Feel free to answer them over a couple of days if you wish:

Stream Exercise

Imagine for a moment a scene, one of a little mountain stream which is tumbling down a hillside gully, not far from its source. It has been raining and so the level is quite high. Consider in your mind's eye, if you can, how it flows to the right over a little rock (where, had the level been lower, it would probably have gone around the rock), then the flow goes to the left over a tree bow, and then slows a little in a broader place, before splashing over a small cascade into a pool, and so on down the mountain side. Does it choose any of its directions? Is it even really a separate entity different from the water deposited in it, the rocks, the depressions in the ground etc? Is it even the same entity moment by moment, or more the product of weather conditions and water, like an ever-changing pattern?

1. Can you find anywhere where 'insert name' autonomously intervenes into life, choosing something that is not the product of all the elements; that is not a part of the overall flow?

2. Now please consider a regular decision made eg; what to wear in the morning, or what to eat for lunch, and describe to me what happens. There are environmental factors, there are colour preferences (but where did those come from - any autonomous intervention there perhaps?), practical issues (such as what is available), available time for preparation, purpose (eg; need to fill up for the day, or to look hip and cool for that person!) etc. Where in there is an autonomous entity intervening in the flow of life? Can you find someone somewhere?

3. Can anything be found for which 'insert name' is responsible – if so responsible to what and for what?



Nature Exercise

Go out into nature and spend some time watching the movement of the whole. See how clouds move, trees swing, leaves wiggle, grass moves, insects, birds - all move all the time.
Then move focus to sensations and see how they too are in constant motion, thoughts come and go, sounds, colours, sensations come and go.
Notice that everything is part of one movement.
Then close your eyes and see if there is a line between you and out there, between you and life itself. If yes, where is the boundary?
Is there an inside and an outside of Life?
Is there something which is not included in the movement of the whole?
Is there a witness that is watching life happening from a distance? Is witnessing part of the one movement too?
Is there anything which is not just happening?
Go out, come back and tell me what you found.

[mo23]

Hi Elad,
I did not answer each specific question but I hope this reply is seen to be satisfactory!
I found the stream and nature exercises very helpful in evoking a feeling of connection and oneness. Beyond the words used they created a felt sense, a touchstone to revisit and enjoy!
Over these last weeks I have been tuning in often throughout the day to see if I can find an autonomous person in the midst of whatever is going on. And I never can! When I am cutting vegetables, I'm just cutting vegetables. There isn't the feel of a doer or a chooser in the mix. I feel myself just allowing life to move through me.
The question about responsibility is an interesting one! If there is nothing that I have initiated autonomously then I do not bear responsibility for the outcome. In essence this outcome was not my fault!
I like your description, Elad, of relative truth and functioning in a skillful way in ordinary life. How it may be helpful to think and communicate in terms of responsibility in the conventional sense when that is seen to be helpful.
I can see there is great depth to this not self teaching! I feel that I am in a good place to move forward. I am eager to interact with others who are sharing this path.
Warmly,
Maureen

[Elad]

Dear Maureen, so the fellow guides gave the green light to graduate you from LU 🙃 As you know, in reality what is important is what is directly seen, and no one else can give or take it. And yet, good company can be invaluable. You will be contacted by someone here, I believe Nerina, who will share with you about this transition. I'll be waiting for you at the Liberation Unleashed "post gate" facebook group, and will be there for continued dialogue and sharing of other options on the other side. It's been a joy and inspiration to work with you here. Love, Elad