Request to work with Elizabeth

[lalla]

Interesting evening here...not much time after work, but staying up alone cleaning the kitchen and focusing on choice, doership, sensation that you suggested a couple days ago...think I’m actually seeing or at least glimpsing that no one is in control here...weird. Wishing you a happy morning and sending love, Linda

[Elizabeth]

Good morning Linda.
It is unexpected, literally. Unscripted by a you, except as thoughts. Keep looking at the gaps between what is, and what is thought. Or what happens, and then what is thought.
Can a you control the thoughts? In reality? Stop, start, make pleasant ones only?
If it's not a you in control, what's behind the illusion thrown up by all these thoughts? Anything special, or jsut what was always there?
Much love, Elizabeth

[lalla]

Elizabeth,
Insomnia last night. A happy lying in bed marveling. However, am too tired to stay up any later tonight so will write a bit in the morning.
Love to you, Linda

[lalla]

Elizabeth,
The morning slipped away and so has another day. So much busyness that I’ve found it difficult to really catch those gaps between what is and what is thought. What I continue to see/get is the ridiculousness of how we can/could think we’re in control/separate when so much of our life is on automatic. Keep trying to think about what it means in regard to the life I’ve lived so far. Know that’s probably not useful but it’s where the thoughts go when left on auto. Am also (when present) paying attention to movement and not finding a doer/decider to move anywhere.
What’s behind the illusion? I’m stuck on how does it happen; how did we get here from stardust? I don’t see anything behind the illusion. It feels as though it’s a huge void, but that’s just another thought isn’t it? It just is what it is. Truly mind boggling. I’m up too late again savoring the quiet of the wee hours...having lots of thoughts about no one’s in control seems like a great justification for life’s bad decisions. Oh God, I’m going in circles. Better stop. Tomorrow afternoon is the start of a quiet weekend at home. Much love, Linda

[Elizabeth]

Hi Linda.
If everything that applies a judgement or a meaning to life is a label, a thought ABOUT life, what is left?
Love, Elizabeth

[lalla]

lol
That was great to reflect on all day at work...brought a smile to my face over and over again.
Life...living itself.
What will it take for this process to know itself?
Love all around, dear Elizabeth, thank you.

[Elizabeth]

Hi Linda. Glad it was a lovely day!
We go till there is knowing. And so that's simple, all the information is there. Labeling, as part of life. None of it separate. No need to believe a single thought that separates.
And no need to see that every single moment, for every single thought. Thoughts arise as habitual responses and patterns. Thoughts with a freight of emotional reaction and a heap of applied history still come up, and we notice them, looking at them for the truth. I spent quite a while questioning any thought with a 'should' or 'must' on it. Haven't found a true one yet :-)
So, let's go a bit further. See what happens.
Much love, Elizabeth

[lalla]

Elizabeth, Not much to report. Just sitting, lots of exhaustion and napping :-). No impatience, some wondering. Reading other conversations here. Enjoying the first rainstorm of the new season. For the moment at least have let go of trying. Planning a few hours of silence in the morrow. Love, Linda

[lalla]

Dear Elizabeth,

What is being missed?

Frustration comes and goes.(just a thought that separates that doesn't need believing in?) Sense of dipping in and out of being on a wave of life when I sit. The sequence begins with not being able to locate an I. Sort of a sense of floating while very aware of sensations in feet/pressure on ground, pressure of elbows on knees while I write. Hearing drone of dryer in distance, closer the purr of cat (who just climbed on my lap) beyond the sound I call the hum of the universe. Just got that dryer and purr are labels as are distance. It is just hearing...

Have noticed difficulty tracking the beginning or end of thoughts--it feels very cobwebby-all stuck together--diaphanous--like a layer between I’m not sure what and what--life and life knowing itself?. "No need to believe a single thought that separates." Hard to do when so many thoughts go unnoticed.

Was rereading what I’d written and just got that frustration is just a label and a story being weaved about waking up. Looks like writing this stuff down can be useful for seeing.

Any pointers? Love, Linda

[Elizabeth]

There you go :-) Frustration, even the story about awakening, all thoughts.
And, when not focused on thoughts, no hearer, just the heard.
Are the thoughts themselves the separation?
Please look.
Is there anything separate to see the thoughts as separation?
Such good work, Linda.
Love, Elizabeth

[lalla]

Elizabeth, Sometimes thoughts are very convincing in their story, but I don't think they're the separation. How could they be when they just naturally arise and pass away? Perhaps believing in the thoughts is the separation, yet isn't it all just part of the dance of life? If there isn't anything separate to see the thoughts as separation, is it just the belief in all those I thoughts? Believing those I thoughts deludes us into thinking we're separate even thought we're not? Please don't let me be running in circles again. Went on a long hike in the mountains today, so may be too exhausted to be thinking straight. Love, Linda

[Elizabeth]

Hi Linda,
Somehow, despite the tiredness and the doubtful thoughts (ahem?) on your end, the answers keep sounding very clear to a me :-)
Let's look at answers to the clarifying questions, see what responds.

1) Is there a you, at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Please look and describe what is found.

2) Explain in detail what 'your self' is and how it works. How on earth did it come to this?

3) How would you explain this 'no you' thing to a high-achieving, yet distressed student ?

4) From this moment's perspective, is it clear that awakening has happened?

Much love, mountain hike sounds wonderful...
Elizabeth

[lalla]

Dear Elizabeth,
I’m not really aware of a shift. Can it be so subtle I don’t see it and don’t really feel any different?
Am I expecting too much of a change? For example, my husband was in a terrible mood this afternoon/evening, and I was annoyed (until I realized that he really needed to eat:-).
I think it will be interesting to write answers to these questions, but it may take me a day or two.
Much love, Linda

[Elizabeth]

Hi Linda. Ilona recently took a small poll and it's about 50/50 on the Big Bang/slow and subtle shifts. However, the proof is in the pudding. Is there a significant difference over time in how life is perceived? Is reactivity different?
I found that after a big bang and some stunned silence, it's been shifting ever since. Same for others who shifted with zero drama. Doesn't seem to matter how the initial shift is perceived, just that it gets foot in door of enlightenment. That becomes apparent.
So, let's work on the questions, and then spend some time using the new looking/focus to shift back and forth between reality, and overlaying of reality with the mental constructs. Back and forth. We are not looking for peace or a state of any kind, though it may feel peaceful not to be narrating ALL the time :-)
Just: "'hmm, LOOKS like this, and is interpreted like that. "
"Hmm..looks like he is being a pain just to annoy me, but in reality, he is suffering and lashing out till some food happens. Nothing to do with a me!"
Be a hoot if nothing was ever personal, including awakening.
Look forward to the answers and reports of further Looking. Concrete examples of Looking are great, vagueness appears to be part of the self-ing mechanism.
Love, Elizabeth

[lalla]

Thanks for these words Elizabeth. It may take me until Saturday, Friday at the earliest to respond because of some work deadlines. Love, Linda