Letting go

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Anastacia42
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Re: Letting go

Postby Anastacia42 » Thu Sep 16, 2021 1:46 pm

You're welcome! Good

Try this one I call ButtChair.

Can you find any place where your butt ends and the chair begins? Look closely and report what is true, which is to say only Actual Experience from the list above. Short & sweet.

Loving,
~ Stacy

"Not to know there is an alternative to being lost
in thought is to be a kind of prisoner."

Sam Harris, from his podcast on his book, "Waking Up" on https://www.samharris.org/ near the middle of the page

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Padmasukha
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Re: Letting go

Postby Padmasukha » Thu Sep 16, 2021 2:30 pm

Hi again
I can find no boundary there. Only fuzzy sensation.
On Monday I heard the phrase 'energy meeting space, and noticed that there is equally no place where 'my' energy ends and space begins xxx

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Padmasukha
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Re: Letting go

Postby Padmasukha » Thu Sep 16, 2021 2:31 pm

"Energy meeting space"

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Anastacia42
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Re: Letting go

Postby Anastacia42 » Fri Sep 17, 2021 12:00 am

Good, yes.

How does it FEEL to see this "fuzzy Sensation?"

Can you find any "me?" Any "self" anywhere?


Loving,
~ Stacy

"Not to know there is an alternative to being lost
in thought is to be a kind of prisoner."

Sam Harris, from his podcast on his book, "Waking Up" on https://www.samharris.org/ near the middle of the page

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Padmasukha
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Re: Letting go

Postby Padmasukha » Fri Sep 17, 2021 4:21 pm

Hi Stacy. It feels like tingling, sparkly, fuzzy, vibrant energy. It doesn't seem to have anything to do with a 'me'. xxx

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Padmasukha
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Re: Letting go

Postby Padmasukha » Fri Sep 17, 2021 6:13 pm

When I'm still, with my eyes closed, and just focusing on the sensations, it's a bit like they're just floating in space xxx

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Anastacia42
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Re: Letting go

Postby Anastacia42 » Fri Sep 17, 2021 10:55 pm

Hi Steph,

Very freeing, isn't it?

Now let's take a look at the idea of "choice," remembering to continue answering ONLY with Direct Experience, listed above.

Palm Flipping Exercise

1. Hold a hand in front of you; palm turned down.

2. Now turn the palm up. And down...and up and so on.

Watch like a hawk.

Don't go to thoughts – examine your direct experience.

Do this as many times as you like, and each time inquire:

How is the movement controlled?

Does a thought control it?

Can a ‘controller’ of any description be located?

How is the decision made to turn the hand over?


Track any decision point when a thought MADE THE DECISION to turn the hand over and the hand turns over immediately.

Who or what ​ chose which hand - the left or right hand for the exercise?

Can you find a separate individual or anything that is choosing when to turn the palm up or down?



Loving,
~ Stacy

"Not to know there is an alternative to being lost
in thought is to be a kind of prisoner."

Sam Harris, from his podcast on his book, "Waking Up" on https://www.samharris.org/ near the middle of the page

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Padmasukha
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Re: Letting go

Postby Padmasukha » Sat Sep 18, 2021 6:58 am

Good morning.
No thought appears to control the movements.
There is a thread of thought dialogue about the exercise, but that doesn't correspond directly to when the movements are made. It seems like a subconscious process is happening. I can look at my hand and have the thought 'turn over', but that doesn't result in action. The action seems to happen or not happen independent of thought. It's like there is some deep, subconscious mechanism rolling on unseen in the background. The mystery we cannot know!
There is great enjoyment and delight arising in doing these exercises. A deep fascination.
I have to get up now and am spending all day in the woods with friends, so may not find the opportunity to post again before tomorrow, but I will come back to answering your blue questions individually. Have a lovely day :-) xxx

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Anastacia42
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Re: Letting go

Postby Anastacia42 » Sat Sep 18, 2021 12:38 pm

Hi Steph

Please rewrite your answer, quoting the question from the pointer with your reply underneath.

There is a link to a video on how to use the Quote Function near the bottom of my very 1st email to you.

I'd appreciate that! I read these on my phone.

Thank you!
~ Stacy

"Not to know there is an alternative to being lost
in thought is to be a kind of prisoner."

Sam Harris, from his podcast on his book, "Waking Up" on https://www.samharris.org/ near the middle of the page

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Anastacia42
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Re: Letting go

Postby Anastacia42 » Sat Sep 18, 2021 12:40 pm

Ah, I see you will be doing that. Thank you!

I'm thinking of going to Rocky Mountain National Park, myself, early, before a reservation is required. Then I have a Flow appointment at 10 am.

See you later!
~ Stacy

"Not to know there is an alternative to being lost
in thought is to be a kind of prisoner."

Sam Harris, from his podcast on his book, "Waking Up" on https://www.samharris.org/ near the middle of the page

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Padmasukha
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Re: Letting go

Postby Padmasukha » Sun Sep 19, 2021 6:12 pm

Hi again. How are you? I hope you had a nice time at the Park.

Here are my more direct answers to the Palm Flipping Exercise.
How is the movement controlled?
I don't know.
Does a thought control it?
No. At least not a conscious thought.
Can a ‘controller’ of any description be located?
No.
How is the decision made to turn the hand over?
I don't know.
Track any decision point when a thought MADE THE DECISION to turn the hand over and the hand turns over immediately.
I can't find one.
Who or what ​ chose which hand - the left or right hand for the exercise?
I don't know. Habit, but beyond that, I don't know.
Can you find a separate individual or anything that is choosing when to turn the palm up or down?
No.

With love and gratitude xxx

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Anastacia42
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Re: Letting go

Postby Anastacia42 » Sun Sep 19, 2021 7:51 pm

Very good. All true. This whole thing is a complete mystery! We will never "know."

There's a lot of peace in not knowing.

How does it FEEL to not know, to find no one there?

Loving,
~ Stacy

"Not to know there is an alternative to being lost
in thought is to be a kind of prisoner."

Sam Harris, from his podcast on his book, "Waking Up" on https://www.samharris.org/ near the middle of the page

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Padmasukha
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Re: Letting go

Postby Padmasukha » Mon Sep 20, 2021 8:57 am

Good Morning.
How does it FEEL to not know, to find no one there?
It feels exciting and liberating. And like there is a stronger direct experience to be had on further reflection. It feels like a huge leap in understanding, and a new beginning!
With love and thanks xxx

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Padmasukha
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Re: Letting go

Postby Padmasukha » Mon Sep 20, 2021 9:05 am

This whole thing is a complete mystery! We will never "know."
I believe that full enlightenment is knowing directly how all things exist, so don't accept that we can never know, but accept that it probably won't be happening in this lifetime.
There's a lot of peace in not knowing.
For 'me', thinking that we can't know directly how things exist and come into being doesn't bring peace. There is too strong a drive/craving for understanding here. But recognising that there is no 'self, me, I' does bring peace.
Thank you
xxx

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Anastacia42
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Re: Letting go

Postby Anastacia42 » Mon Sep 20, 2021 1:32 pm

Good morning,

There are 2 things that will prevent you from doing there is no self:

1. Expectations - this is an expectation:
like there is a stronger direct experience to be had on further reflection
This is an expectation:
I believe that full enlightenment is knowing directly how all things exist, so don't accept that we can never know, but accept that it probably won't be happening in this lifetime.
It is not. We cannot know. Ask any "enlightened" person, who is being honest.

The Buddhist outline "10 Fetters" of which what we point to here is only the first one - seeing there is no "self." That's all we do at LU, nothing more. It is just a beginning, but an important one.
For 'me', thinking that we can't know directly how things exist and come into being doesn't bring peace. There is too strong a drive/craving for understanding here.
Thinking will fail you.

No content of thought is ever true. It is all made up. You can never find no self through thinking. So, you are both wrong & right here.

Direct or Actual Experience is

Seeing
Hearing
Feeling (Sensation, not emotion. Emotion is Sensation plus made-up thoughts & labels)
Tasting
Smelling
Thoughts Arising (but not their content)


Seeing no self simply arises as an obvious truth when we DROP thinking & cravings. Beliefs must be seen through.

These pointers are designed to show you how false thoughts are.

2. Fears - which may come up when you realize thoughts aren't true.

Do you want to continue? Or do you want to cling to beliefs that fight against what is?
~ Stacy

"Not to know there is an alternative to being lost
in thought is to be a kind of prisoner."

Sam Harris, from his podcast on his book, "Waking Up" on https://www.samharris.org/ near the middle of the page


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