thread for Alreadyfree, asking Forgetment to guide me

[forgetmenot]

Hello Phil,

Apologies for the delay in replying due to: 1. electricity off again for 1 day in my street last week for maintenance.
2. unable to login yesterday which took 1-2 hours to fix. Was unable to request help from LU Admin as that's only possible if one is first logged in. I finally found help via the LU Facebook group.

Life happens :)

Where are they coming from and going to?

The conventional answer (which I don't accept) is from "my mind". To me it's more accurate to say "from the one universal mind or collective consciousness". Where do they go? They simply quickly evaporate, like a puff of smoke or steam.

This is an intellectual thought based answer.
Where in actual experience can you find "from the one universal mind or collective consciousness"? Where in the observing of thoughts did you see a “universal mind” or “collective consciousness”?

So please look again...when you observe thoughts as they arise, where are they coming from and going to?

Did you do anything to make a particular thought or thoughts appear?

No, nothing at all. They arise without any intention of involvement by me. Of course, if I choose to ignore your instruction & look at the CONTENT of the thought, then I am doing something to create the thoughts.

Really, and how do you do that? Doesn’t content of thought arise just like any thought, since the content of thought is simply thought? They are thoughts about thought.

I would like for you to describe in detail, the process by which you create a thought, or choose which thought to think. If you have been doing it all your life then you must know exactly how you do it. Please include describing the following in with your detailed step by step description please.

1. How you decide/intend which thought/s you are going to think?
2. Describe where in your mind you go exactly, to retrieve a particular thought, or set of thoughts to think?
3. Describe the location where are all thoughts are stored, so you can go to the thought pool/container and retrieve the thought/s you have decided/intended to think?
4. Describe, in precise detail, how you then bring that thought or thoughts from the thought pool to the forefront of the mind for you to become aware of them?
5. Without being aware of the thought you want to retrieve, how would you know what thought you are going to retrieve to think it? And how can you retrieve it when you are already aware of it?

So how do you do it? How do you create a thought? How do you think?

Could you have done anything to make a different thought appear at that exact moment instead?

If I follow your instructions ('just let thoughts appear as they appear......without doing anything at all etc....") then the answer is no. If I chose to deviate from your instructions & chose a particular thought (eg "what will I eat tonight?") then that would lead to a chain of different thoughts (eg "pizza, fish n chips etc").

And again…how did you choose a particular thought? How do you know what thought you want to think without the thought already been there? And if that thought had revealed itself, then how did you know what other follow on thoughts you wanted to think?

Can you predict your next thought?

If I follow your instructions, the answer is No.

Think of a 2-digit number. Why did you choose that number? Why not the previous number, or the next one? Do you know? If not, why don’t you know? If you are the thinker of thoughts then you must know how you create them.

Can you choose not to have painful, negative or fearful thoughts?

No

Why not? If you can pick and choose other thoughts, then why can’t you choose not have painful, negative or fearful thoughts and all the contents of those thoughts?

Can you pick and choose any kind of thought?

No

But you just said you could. That if you deviated from the exercise instructions then you could choose your thoughts.

Can you stop thinking a thought in the middle?

No, provided I follow your instructions by completely ignoring what the thought is saying (the content of the thought).

The content of thought is thought. So I don’t understand the difference you are trying to highlight here. If the thought is “I like chocolate ice-cream” and the follow on thoughts were why you like chocolate ice-cream…they are still all thought, whether you label them as a thought or content of thought. Thought is simply thought.

And how is it known when it's a middle of a thought exactly? What is it that suggests you stopped a thought in the middle?

It seems that thought has some logical ordered appearance, but look carefully and just notice if there is an organised sequence. Or is it just another thought that says ‘these thoughts are in sequence’ or “they take content from previous thought”, or that "one thought follows another thought"?
There's no logical ordered sequence (if I follow your instructions). It is just another thought that says "these thoughts are insequence", "they take content from previous thought" etc.

It seems to me that the nature of thought & mind is that it always tries to maintain it's momentum by following chains of thoughts - whether they appear to be in a ordered sequence or not. If I was experiencing thoughts that seemed to have a logical sequence (eg. while trying to mentally solve a problem) then I may choose to follow that sequence, in the hope that it MAY lead to a solution or insight. Of course, many times a solution/insight doesn't happen. This can lead to useless worry & obsessing.

Where in colour, sound, taste, smell, sensation or thought can you find this “I” that is choosing to follow sequences of thought?

If you can’t choose your thoughts, then how can a sequence of thoughts be chosen that one seemingly wants to follow? Do not those thoughts arise of their own accord? Can you find anyone/anything in the thoughts themselves or anywhere that is choosing thoughts…no matter the sequence?

Where is the “mind” you are referring to exactly? Where in actual experience is it found?


Kay

[alreadyfree]

Hi Kay

Thanks for your email. I've just spent 2 hours replying to your email & (guess what?) .... yes the whole lot has disappeared & seems irretrievable. Yes I know how to use the save function. I had almost finished the reply when I noticed that the "preview, submit, save draft, load draft" options which usually appear at the bottom of the page I'm typing on..... had all disappeared. I spent about 20 minutes trying to find them to no avail. It seems I should check every few minutes when typing a reply to ensure those buttons haven't disappeared. Either that or send my reply in instalments. Or life is telling me to ditch this process.

My computer skills are reasonably good. I suspect a reason why many people don't complete the guiding process is simply because using the website for this is so unwieldy & complex, especially when 2 hours of work goes down the drain. Yes it is free & as they say, you get what you pay for for - in this case a very user UNFRIENDLY website. I guess if LU were a commercial business then a much better website would have been used. And yes, I know you dislike me criticising LU. Sorry.

So I will try again from scratch later, unless I've already been fired by LU.

Cheers
Phil

[alreadyfree]

Hi Kay

Thanks for your email. I've just spent 2 hours replying to your email & (guess what?) .... yes the whole lot has disappeared & seems irretrievable. Yes I know how to use the save function. I had almost finished the reply when I noticed that the "preview, submit, save draft, load draft" options which usually appear at the bottom of the page I'm typing on..... had all disappeared. I spent about 20 minutes trying to find them to no avail. It seems I should check every few minutes when typing a reply to ensure those buttons haven't disappeared. Either that or send my reply in instalments. Or life is telling me to ditch this process.

My computer skills are reasonably good. I suspect a reason why many people don't complete the guiding process is simply because using the website for this is so unwieldy & complex, especially when 2 hours of work goes down the drain. Yes it is free & as they say, you get what you pay for for - in this case a very user UNFRIENDLY website. I guess if LU were a commercial business then a much better website would have been used. And yes, I know you dislike me criticising LU. Sorry.

So I will try again from scratch later, unless I've already been fired by LU.

Cheers
Phil

[forgetmenot]

Hi Phil,

You will find on my housekeeping post at the beginning of the thread I mention that:

"Technology is not perfect and sometimes there is a glitch which can wipe out your responses. It is advisable that you copy and paste questions asked into Word, answer them there and then copy and paste them to your thread. Always save a copy of what you have done in Word - it will save you time in the long run!"

I make sure I include this nugget of information with everyone I guide in order to alleviate situations like this from arising.

Warmly,
Kay